Holmesy

Can we get Jacob Murphy off the fucking pitch please?

If they’re told to mark specific players at set pieces, they’re not going to break from their instructions to peg it out to the edge of the box. Arsenal have clearly analysed us, spotted something, taken advantage. Needed instructions from the sideline after the second time.

Right, time to switch over

You reckon 4-3-3?! 😀 To be honest, I’ve got a strange feeling we might get something from this game.

What we thinking then, 4–4-1-1, patient possession based football, Wolte at #10, solid defence?

Here's a slightly different take - If Rafa was manager right now and had this group of players at his disposal (and had been through everything you listed in the summer), do you think he would find a way to win games?

There’s also an elephant in the room with regards to getting back into Europe.

I get it, i completely get how it sounds but the situation is of his own making. There's no enjoyment in it happening. At the moment, the most positive outcome we can hope for is he rebuilds in the summer and we go back to winning, doing the same thing but with different players. And i'm sure plenty would be ok with that. But we can't unknow what we now know - what still won't have been addressed is the poor in-game management, the one plan, the inability to manage PL & Europe, the same coaches, the lack of focus on defence, no focus on keeping hold of the ball etc. We know what's coming next because as he has alluded to, he isn't for changing. And that is the biggest damage that has been done this season - it has shone the spotlight on his limitations where before all we knew were his strengths, and his limitations are deeply concerning for a club with our ambitions.

He hasn't shown he has the credentials to re-motivate a group of players who are clearly not engaged. He hasn't shown his credentials to adapt to our system being found out. He hasn't shown his credentials to freshen things up when they go stale. He hasn't shown his credentials to improve his in-game management. He hasn't shown his credentials to effectively manage a dual front campaign. He has shown his credentials to save us from relegation, compete above our level playing plan A for the first 3 seasons, and be competitive in the cups. Every manager has his strengths and his weaknesses. Until this season we had only seen Eddie's strengths. This season we have seen his weaknesses and limitations, but he has openly admitted that he is not prepared to work on his weaknesses - same system, likely the same coaches, same ideas going forward. Exactly the same way it played out at Bournemouth. You're right, if 12 months ago someone would have said this would be the situation no one would have believed you. But the reality is that this is the situation. And the majority of people are not even referencing the results when they say we should move on from him, they're referencing the performances, the same broken record, the appalling in-game management and the fact he will not deviate from his plan A only approach, despite plan A no longer working. If the fact he has essentially openly said 'more of plan A' next season doesn't worry you, I don't know what will. If we had seen 3 seasons of tactical flexibility, changing games with clever in-game management and a willingness to learn, evolve and adapt, i'd be with you, i think we all would. But we haven't and probably won't, which is where this feeling of needing to move on is coming from.

I think we all do but ultimately we're fans of the club, not the manager. He'll always be a hero here but what's best for the football club is the only thing that matters, and I don't think it's him any more.

No, you don't become a bad manager overnight but you can become a stale one over the course of a few years, and that's the point at which you change things (as Fergie did, as Pep does etc.). When you see the players are no longer responding to your coaching and ideas, and your gameplan is no longer working, you do something different to re-engage them and reverse the slide. But that's evidently not Eddie's way. If he goes away, has another sabatical and works on a new playbook, i've no doubt he would come back and do wonders again somewhere else. But while he is here, we will play the playbook he developed over 4.5 years ago, with minor tweaks, and that's your lot.

Amorim is the best comparison I can think of right now for Eddie, and look at what ManUre have don't since he left. His system worked at Sporting, didn't work at ManUre, and he wan't for changing. Eddie's worked here but now it doesn't, and he isn't for changing. We'll be doing the same thing in 5 years if he's still here.

This. He was a really good player at Forest in a system that suited him. This is Eddie all over at present - there is only one system, EVER. There is no attempt to build around the strengths of the players we have. Could it have been foreseen that Elanga has rubber feet and no brain? Who knows, but you work with what you have and try to create conditions where they can thrive and succeed regardless. This guy has got no chance under Eddie and I do have some sympathy for him.

Even if he could, I don't want him to. If he was as good as we thought he was, he'd be able to get some sort of tune out of the current group. Just throwing more players at the problem masks obvious limitations in his approach. I want evolution and flexibility, and he has proven that's not his game. And i'm bored and frustrated with his football and his wank in-game management.

Not sure what's left to say on this situation, it's tragic and entirely self-created. If you're the board watching this, there's only one conclusion you can come to, and one outcome. He's literally doing nothing to change our fortunes. No one is telling him he needs to play one formation and one playing style - that is entirely his decision. It feels like we're watching a man slowly losing the plot. I don't even give a shit about the wasted money in the transfer window any more. He has a group of players and he needs to build a system to fit them, look where we're conceding goals and do something to address it. In other words, do his fucking job! There is absolutely no chance we come out next season doing something different - he has basically said as much. It will be more of the same but with different players, and that is simply not good enough. If this situation occurs in any other business, - not addressing the things that are causing poor performance - you're toast, and rightly so. Thanks for the memories, Eddie but it's time to move on.

What a crock of shit! Can’t believe he actually came out with that tbh.

What was the response in the presser? I hadn’t watched it yet

The fact that he's highlighting our failings in attack rather than our failings in defence is concerning. Front foot football is great but it has to be married with defensive solidity if we're ever going to kick on.

Funnily enough, I was looking on a Bournemouth forum (because i'm a total loser) and they were complaining, back when he managed them, that he only ever played 4-4-2. And then they broke from that formation for one game, got a result and then he went back to 4-4-2. I'd kill for a bit of 4-4-2 right now

I think the opposite is true - trying to breathe new life into a group of players who are already not executing your plan is harder than going into a new group with fresh ideas and new energy, especially if you don't make changes. The players are already familiar with him and as has been mentioned a number of times, they have listened to the same ideas and the same voices for a long time.

It's a very simplistic view and I know where you're coming from but someone doing a thing before doesn't necessarily mean they'll do it again. Ranieri won the PL with Leicester - why doesn't he win every PL? Because the variables weren't the same after that season. The variables aren't the same now for us. Our shock & awe approach worked for a period because teams didn't know how to deal with it. Now they do, and our players are older, more tired and let's be honest, probably a bit bored. The argument isn't can Eddie do it again really. The argument is can he change and is he willing to? That's the unknown. On this season's evidence, people have doubts. Does he even accept that change is needed? If he does, can he do it on the job or does he need to go and have another sabatical to work on his new gameplan? Again, look at the recent evidence, what does it tell you? Everything we have achieved to-date has been achieved doing variations of the same thing. That same thing doesn't seem to work now and the one thing we haven't seen Eddie do in all his time here is change our fortunes by changing the thing. He admits openly that he has plan A, and if plan A doesn't work it's because the players aren't executing the plan properly. He said this in a recent interview. Well, the players aren't executing plan A properly, what now? Your argument is either, the thing still works, we just need different tools (or mitigating circumstances are to blame). Or you believe Eddie can do something different despite the fact he hasn't shown us he can. And that is where the optimism comes in, which I admire but don't share.

You don't have to be Barcelona to keep the ball. Passing and moving are two of the fundamentals of football. It just needs to be something coached into the players and built into the system. There's a reason we don't do it.

We haven't lost 14 Pl games this season and the other cup games because of individual errors. They account for some but not the majority - the majority of defeats are because our tactics haven't worked this season and we're defensively weak. And we routinely let the opposition get to our weak defence. Then the errors become a lot more frequent and a lot more costly.

But is it not his job as manager (in the short term at least) to notice that we habitually drop a bollock towards the end of games and do something to mitigate it? When Dan Burn at LB was an open invitation for everyone to attack us down the right hand side (an invitation they accepted with open arms) Eddie eventually mitigated it by moving Burn to CB, and we looked more solid. The last time we were wide open in midfield and getting run through consistently, Eddie eventually dropped Tonali into the number 6 role and we started looking more solid. This isn't a new problem, it's been happening all season. If anyone has seen any signs of Eddie taking action to mitigate it, you've seen something I haven't. And i'm happy to stand corrected. I've no doubt it's a harder problem to solve that the others but Barcelona shut up shop by keeping the ball, tiring us out and picking us off. Couldn't we try something like that? I know it doesn't happen overnight but we have had months to do something.

Not sure reacting the same way the scousers would if it was our player is the way we should be carrying ourselves, but each to their own. I'd rather not drop myself to their scumbag levels tbh.