Jonas

I think both points on this matter are correct without being contradictory. It probably shouldn't be a dividing line amongst fans the ownership hasn't seemingly explored nevermind exhausted every revenue stream (ironically except organic ones like high league finishes, CL quali and cup wins) but also even if they had it wouldn't really change anything relative to where we want to be because of these rules

CL qualification helps relative only to the clubs below but any benefit of it relative to the cartel is off-set by their revenues set prior to FFP and is limited. Another sad consequence of PSR is that apart from an adventure football-wise, CL qualification now has no effect on establishing yourself in the elite, if you happened to be outside when the PSR dropped. Its as likely to help ourselves and Villa as it was Willem II and Leicester despite club size and owner ambitions. Ironically its made the organic growth they suggest as an alternative to spending money completely impossible if you want to be at that level as being succesful and CL money were the only hopes.

Me if he goes for less than what he's worth and PSR doesn't change.

Well it doesn't reflect domestically, comparing like for like drawing power in the championship/2nd Division will probably only be about 95% in our favour and domestically is all we can go off on account of their having virtually no record in Europe. But those two games 50years ago and legends like Ball and Kay must have struck a chord with people globally in a different way to clubs that have spent most of the last 50years outside the top division and offering nothing when in it and having no identity or icons in other countries do with us

Aldridge, Barnes, Houghton, Beardsley and Rush in just over a year back then had to be about the biggest spending spree anyone had done in England. Everton had finished above them and were their nearest challengers spent hardly anything. Course, speaking of organically built success, Ferguson blew it out the water a year later -probably spent more than three quarters of the division combined.

Coincidentally beginning at exactly the same time as Greame Souness arrived on the scene.

That rules been around for ages

Wasn't even that reasonable it was 'bottom half at best'. Wonder what the worst case scenario is. Armageddon!?

He was probably sold on Brentford as a stepping stone if he performs so probably has more right to feel aggreived than Isak who was sold a project that would have happened but for the conspiring against us.

I'm so paranoid (no wait, you cant be paranoid if they are out to get you) that I would genuinely not be surprised if that was revisited should he sign for us

Its really not. Its the best case I can think of in our history of doing exactly that. We went from 6th to 2nd and ended up with a better team. Manchester United were already ahead of us when we sold him, and already double champions and double winners when he went. We closed the gap substantially after we sold him going from not even qualifying for Europe to runners up twice, nothing really changed for Man United in the next three seasons, runners up twice, winners twice is where they already were. We've never had a better team and will never go closer to winning the league than the two years after selling Cole. He came good in the end but was a flop the first 2 1/2 years he was there, there were literal jokes about him (Cantona wears his collar up because his necks dirty from carrying Cole all season), was becomming known for embarrassing misses and I've video of extremely biased and arrogant Man United supporting Journo Steve Curry on Hold the Back Page saying Cole was a terrible signing and Ferguson would snap your hands off for the money back in May 97.

On the other hand there's Ferdinand, Fox, Speed, Cole (before the Keegan song), Venison, Keegan as manager, Sibierski, David Kelly (whilst playing for Sunderland), Pav, Shaka, Goddard, Batty off the top of my head. All clubs fans do it (Shearer got booed going back to Blackburn, Phillips got booed going back to Sunderland) but how many give receptions like the afforementioned players/managers got here.

Treason doth never prosper, what's the reason?, for if it prosper none dare call it treason.

Everton have an even bigger problem than us and they're in Liverpool and before their takeovers Man City was less appealing than Middlesbrough and Blackburn. Money and being allowed to spend it is by far the biggest factor.

Would take a part-exchange deal to facilitate that. *going abroad (not Bayern/Kane)

Every single thing they moan and get santcimonious about they'd do to someone else in a heartbeat, fully justify it and be shitheads about it to boot.

Been a few and Champions League qualifiation seems a theme. Dalglish's downgrading us to the worst we'd been in 5yrs and the summer of Bowyer. In retrospect the summer of Bramble and Viana was worse than useless too

A rolling universal spend limit that rolls over or is increased by player sales perhaps. Anything's better than an SPL just with double the elite and double the farm clubs. Its not like 4th-8th is bad. Its just knowing that's your limit and knowing on top of that its only because of rules deliberately designed to make sure that's your limit.

This is more Beardsley/Waddle/Gascoigne than Cole (for me) Cole was sold to better the club and we did - Ferdinand was a betterr player (even scored more goals in 94/95 and both his seasons with us than Cole did at the same time if it comes down to goals), Shearer was better than both of them, the team did improve. I know we'll reinvest but because the regulations I don't see any moving forward possible. Nothing to do with the club. * I started going in time to fully experienced 88-92, officially the clubs worst days, never considered not going but if these rules had been in place then that would be different. Its not about us being rubbish its about being legislated against being at the top. You hoped it would be transient at the top even if you couldn't be there yourself. There is no hope for that now and feels a bit of a mugs game, especially for us, VIlla and Forest having experienced it first hand, others will one day realise the same but the upward mobility until that point will help obfuscate it

He's been the best for me since I first happened across him on Hold the Pack Page in the mid/late 90s. Stood out like a sore thumb from the crusty, arrogant, 'all played out' gang

Could have a game of 'which cartel club will nab our target'.

I also like how this has rendered CL qualification redundant as means to try and establish yourself at the top and the irony that it would be in the organic way they want. Us twice and Villa. So nobody else has any chance either. When I started going we were at our lowest ebb but you still hoped that one day. Leeds and Blackburn rose from the ashes before us and Chelsea to an extent after. None of that would happen now. If these rules were formulated when the PL was it would have been Liverpool, Arsenal and Man United indefinitely and even worse than the 1st Division had been.

Nigel Clough in his Man City days?

Another quality scam for the elite though. They'll all cycle in and out of it, hoover up the money to further dominate the leagues they already dominate, even by legislature now. They've sewn the whole thing up for themselves now.

Liked it better when it was club owners that needed to show ambition not the fans and when ambition could be realised not barred.