Nail your colours to the mast: Sack or No Sack?

[Guest Knightrider]

Souness took over a team who finished 5th and was universally not wanted. Allardyce took over a big steaming pile of turd at every level and was a favourable appointment. I'll give you Roeder.

 

As for the not knowing what to do, I think he's trying to do too much, keep us from conceding, doing all the right things as a team and playing decent football which the fans crave, and it's a big pile of mess. He does need to get back to basics and while I think we're going to lose the next two, I think we'll move into a better period of form for us after this obvious sticky patch, I hope so anyway. He's still well on course to achieving what I expected anyway so it's all the same for me.

[The College Dropout]

The fact his record at Bolton was so good, helps. He is no Souness or Roeder. He's no Sir Bobby either but we may never know unless we get off our f****** high horses and show a bit of patience and understanding and get behind the man instead of mocking him in public on our own home turn with the world watching on.

 

You have to earn the patience and understanding of the supporters. Sam hasn't done that.

 

When you are as blatantly clueless as Big Sam is showing you deserve nothing.

[NE6]

Smack him for being silly

[Guest Brazilianbob]

If I believed in conspiracy theories I would suggest that perhaps Ashley has already told BSA he will be going in the summer, and he has decided to get the f*** out asap with his contract paid up in full by making them sack him now.  He can then apply for the England job as a free agent and the FA won't have to buy out his contract from NUFC... Only if I believed in conspiracy theories of course!

[Guest Knightrider]

The fact his record at Bolton was so good, helps. He is no Souness or Roeder. He's no Sir Bobby either but we may never know unless we get off our f****** high horses and show a bit of patience and understanding and get behind the man instead of mocking him in public on our own home turn with the world watching on.

 

You have to earn the patience and understanding of the supporters. Sam hasn't done that.

 

When you are as blatantly clueless as Big Sam is showing you deserve nothing.

 

I disagree but respect your opinion.

[ChezGiven]

The fans singing it were utter pricks imo. Congrats on making us a laughing stock. The Liverpool fans normally have a few witty ditties when they're doing well but we did the work for them yesterday. The performance on the pitch was s****, obviously but that's besides the point. Rarely have I been so embarrassed at SJP.

 

 

I wasn't one of the singers, but I totally agree with them. They have their right to show their frustration and yesterday Sam deserved everything that was thrown at him.

Yeah, they've got a right to express their opinions. That doesn't alter my view about them however.

They have every right to express their opinions. However, when the same people who were chanting 'big sam for england' then start chanting 'one james milner' you know they are window-licking mongers.

[The College Dropout]

Souness took over a team who finished 5th and was universally not wanted. Allardyce took over a big steaming pile of turd at every level and was a favourable appointment. I'll give you Roeder.

 

As for the not knowing what to do, I think he's trying to do too much, keep us from conceding, doing all the right things as a team and playing decent football which the fans crave, and it's a big pile of mess. He does need to get back to basics and while I think we're going to lose the next two, I think we'll move into a better period of form for us after this obvious sticky patch, I hope so anyway. He's still well on course to achieving what I expected anyway so it's all the same for me.

 

Aye well it wasn't long till Souness lost most of our support anyway.

I think we've had this discussion before but it looks like Sam has no plan or strategy for success. Nothing is consistent except poor performances and long balls.

 

Fuck that.

 

Unless we win a trophy sharpish Sam will always be at odds with the fans because of his style of play.

[Mick]

 

I wont disagree. To me he looks like someone who doesn't quite know what to do but that doesn't mean he wont eventually find a winning formula. Like I've said all along, he experiments, I warned people about this when we appointed him, until he finds what he's looking for. He's obviously underestimated the lack of patience here and need to buck his ideas up fast and just get the season over and done with on an ending that is going to show everyone things will get better and we will improve. He can do that by first playing players in their correct positions, sticking to one system and then shipping out those he doesn't want in January and bringing in a few he does.

 

I agree with that but he needs to find the winning formula soon because if he doesn't then the players will stop listening to him through a lack of faith.  He doesn't have to go out and win every game but we've got to look as if we can beat teams below us.  As for a lack of patience, he'll get it if he shows he's worth sticking with, he's got to offer the supporters something more than what he's done at another club.

 

As for someone better. Not this crap again. Who? If we were to sack Allardyce, no-one worth their salt would want to come anywhere near us. We'd end up with Moyes or someone like that who guess what, would need 3 years or something.

 

I could name managers in this country who could be better than Allardyce but that would be pointless as we've got a manager.

 

There is no easy way about this so we just have to shut the f*** up and let the manager get on with it for better or worse. For once.

 

We don't have to shut the F*** up, some may chose to do so others may chose not to.

 

If I was Sam I'd resign and go after the England job, it's much easier. 13 games in and his own fans who when we were beating his old team 3-1 were chanting his name, turning on him publicly? Disgraceful. Souness or Roeder never got this.

 

If I was Allardyce I'd try to prove the doubters wrong, I hope he tries and does it.  I also hope that if something doesn't work he learns from it instead of keep on trying in the vain hope that it eventually works.  He's got certain players to work with and should play to whatever strengths they posess instead of trying to get them to do things that are just not working.

 

Again jesus f****** wept. It takes a lot to shock me but I am shocked at the turnaround in opinion and the lack of patience showing from fans. It makes me wonder why they bother, they are like a dad who no bloke will ever be good enough for his daughter.

 

The supporters are showing frustration and I'm not surprised.

 

[The College Dropout]

The fact his record at Bolton was so good, helps. He is no Souness or Roeder. He's no Sir Bobby either but we may never know unless we get off our f****** high horses and show a bit of patience and understanding and get behind the man instead of mocking him in public on our own home turn with the world watching on.

 

You have to earn the patience and understanding of the supporters. Sam hasn't done that.

 

When you are as blatantly clueless as Big Sam is showing you deserve nothing.

 

I disagree but respect your opinion.

 

Do you believe every manager appointed by our club should be given 2-3 years to get it right?

Do you believe Sam should get 2-3 years to get it right no matter what? If you do, tell me why you believe this.

[Guest Knightrider]

The fact his record at Bolton was so good, helps. He is no Souness or Roeder. He's no Sir Bobby either but we may never know unless we get off our f****** high horses and show a bit of patience and understanding and get behind the man instead of mocking him in public on our own home turn with the world watching on.

 

You have to earn the patience and understanding of the supporters. Sam hasn't done that.

 

When you are as blatantly clueless as Big Sam is showing you deserve nothing.

 

I disagree but respect your opinion.

 

Do you believe every manager appointed by our club should be given 2-3 years to get it right?

Do you believe Sam should get 2-3 years to get it right no matter what? If you do, tell me why you believe this.

 

No I don't. In general though a manager does need on average at least 2 years.

 

Allardyce is a manager I rate, wanted and have faith in so obviously he'll get time from me, Steve fucking Bruce would, that's just the type of bloke I am, but not at any cost. Sam or Bruce.

 

I expect to see improvements and progression. I'm seeing both, but in very very small doses. I can see a big picture though and based on what I've learned of the manager over the years and his record in football I can see that picture being filled in eventually.

 

If not, back to the drawing board we go.

 

What I can't stomach though is lunacy and hanging a manager after 13 games where 8 of them have yielded enough points to give us a total of 18 and with it a standing of 11th or whatever in the table, because it's pointless.

 

You can disagree, and I won't argue, I can't be bothered.

 

Me, he gest time, support and patience. I rate him, he's a good manager, better or as good as we could get at the time, sacking him now wouldn't do any good whatsoever, he does need time even if you don't rate him and want him out he does need time, so I hope he gets it and we go on to better things.

 

At the start of the season I was hopeful of that, now I can't see him being here in August, thanks to the handy work of our moron fans, although there is still time for Big Sam to change that but he'd have to get us finishing 6th or a trophy and our form doesn't suggest that's going to happen.

 

I just hope Mort and Ashley know more about football than the last fuckwits running things, if not, well, there are other things besides NUFC far more worthy of my emotions.

 

I couldn't stomach another merrygoround. I've had enough.

[Thomson Mouse]

It's a difficult one.

 

The sensible choice is to wait until the end of the season - assuming nothing goes badly wrong - then assess things. If we do this, there is the very real chance of getting a quality manager.

 

The other choice is to get rid now - which I can sympathise with - and hope that Ashley has the ability to get a top quality manager in ASAP.

 

 

[fredbob]

I know that this isnt by any means anything to shoutabout and will come under a hell of a lot of scrutiny but isnt it worth mentionaing that we're due for approximately 54 points which isnt to be sniffed at, i mean obviously its a load of bollocks looking at i that way but 54 points would be a decent finish, i think that would of got us to 9th positions last season. I'd be happy for that in his first season, proving we dont have any relegations problems i will stick by SA. According to my incredibly scientific calculations he's on course to better roeder, and for his first season withall the good changes he's made,  id be happy with that.

[Guest Elan]

HTT what do you make of the rumour he's lost the dressing room?

[The College Dropout]

Fair enough HTT.

 

[Mick]

Mick, it isn't 13 games anyway because in 8 of them he's obviously been doing something right because we've picked up points in 8 of those games.

 

So in 5 games he's not got things right. Big deal. Lets take a closer look though shall we. How many of those games was he forced into trying out new things because of injury? How many of those 5 games were we expected to lose anyway, regardless? How many of those games were we unlucky in? What other factors played their part? Aye, when you dig deeper things aren't so black and white.

 

Here, don't get me wrong, we've been s**** for the best part of the season and no I'm not happy with Big Sam either, but I'll be damned if I join the simpletons in wanting him out or get myself carried away over 13 games one way or the other because my intelligence tells me he and any fucker else needs to be judged over a season, maybe even two regardless.

 

The fact his record at Bolton was so good, helps. He is no Souness or Roeder. He's no Sir Bobby either but we may never know unless we get off our f****** high horses and show a bit of patience and understanding and get behind the man instead of mocking him in public on our own home turn with the world watching on.

 

Of course it's 13 games regardless of how we've done in them.  He has done somethings right, I doubt anybody thinks that he hasn’t.  I think he's done really well away from the games but he also needs to show something during the games.  Some of his substitutions have been almost beyond beleif and I struggle to understand what the point of them was.

 

Out of those 3 drawn games we’ve drawn, two teams that are in the bottom 4 and they’ve managed to scrape less than a point a game.  We’ve lost to Reading who also have less than a point a game and Derby, probably the worst team ever in this league and we’re the only team to lose to them.  I think yesterday might have been our highest number of enforced changes, we had to make 3 but Allardyce decided that he wanted to make 6.

 

[Guest Knightrider]

HTT what do you make of the rumour he's lost the dressing room?

 

I think it's more tabloid bull, but nothing would surprise me at Newcastle. I have a sinking feeling these stories are coming from within NUFC if they are true. Can't see Big Sam lasting if I'm honest. Oh well.

[Mick]

Souness took over a team who finished 5th and was universally not wanted. Allardyce took over a big steaming pile of turd at every level and was a favourable appointment. I'll give you Roeder.

 

As for the not knowing what to do, I think he's trying to do too much, keep us from conceding, doing all the right things as a team and playing decent football which the fans crave, and it's a big pile of mess. He does need to get back to basics and while I think we're going to lose the next two, I think we'll move into a better period of form for us after this obvious sticky patch, I hope so anyway. He's still well on course to achieving what I expected anyway so it's all the same for me.

 

I don't think Allardyce is as bad as the two you mention but I must admit to wondering if he's one of those managers who can only do it at one club, time will tell and no amount of arguing will change that.

 

He might be trying too hard and if that’s the case the shit he got yesterday might just do him good if he stops doing what has failed him so far.  I really think he could lose the players if it goes on too much longer, he’s probably strong enough to deal with any unrest at the minute but I wouldn’t be surprised if the players stop listening to him if things don’t change before too long, I hope that doesn't happen.

 

[biggs]

Sven, Houllier, Ramos, Hughes, Redknapp, Moyes, O'Neill, (insert your own name here), Allardyce needs more than 13 games.

 

I'm shocked fans have rounded on him so quickly, fans who before he arrived chopped and changed their own opinions on who they'd like to see manage us from one week to the next, fans who if we win our next 3 games will put Allardyce back in the good book, fans who said no to Sven last time, but would love him and his sexy football now. I notice Redknapp is currently flavour of the month and a good back up option incase we can't get Mourinho...

 

Don't you see, it doesn't matter who is in charge, a manager needs more than 13 games.

 

I guarantee if it was Sven, Houllier or whoever who was having a dodgy patch the same threads would be made about them.

 

Oh and yesterday was one of the most embarrassing moments I've had to endure sitting next to my fellow fans.  Well f****** done on makBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOing us the BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO laughing stoBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOck of the PremBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOiership agaiBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOn

 

NUFC fans = idiots

 

 

Mind, I was just as embarrassed about the performance, but still, 13 games....

 

Lets hope Ashley and Mort are not idiots, eh.

 

If i were at the game yesterday i would of walked out of the ground in disgust...of the fans.

 

Terrible. We look like the muppets everyone brands us as. Well done.

 

Agreed. Completely embarrassing.

 

 

 

NE5, i feel total and utter delight on agreeing with you, CoachHTT, where the hell have you been? we've been fighting this alone for 12 pages!

go and have a wankathon with your mates over your fat sam picures

[Guest Knightrider]

Souness took over a team who finished 5th and was universally not wanted. Allardyce took over a big steaming pile of turd at every level and was a favourable appointment. I'll give you Roeder.

 

As for the not knowing what to do, I think he's trying to do too much, keep us from conceding, doing all the right things as a team and playing decent football which the fans crave, and it's a big pile of mess. He does need to get back to basics and while I think we're going to lose the next two, I think we'll move into a better period of form for us after this obvious sticky patch, I hope so anyway. He's still well on course to achieving what I expected anyway so it's all the same for me.

 

I don't think Allardyce is as bad as the two you mention but I must admit to wondering if he's one of those managers who can only do it at one club, time will tell and no amount of arguing will change that.

 

He might be trying too hard and if that’s the case the shit he got yesterday might just do him good if he stops doing what has failed him so far.  I really think he could lose the players if it goes on too much longer, he’s probably strong enough to deal with any unrest at the minute but I wouldn’t be surprised if the players stop listening to him if things don’t change before too long, I hope that doesn't happen.

 

 

Agreed. Reports about dressing room unrest are always worrying, whether true or not. I think who goes or stays in January will be canny revealing on that front. I'm talking about Allardyce here too.

[Thespence]

I am all for him building a infrastructure but when he brings in Steve McClarens number 2, adds his mate Reids croonies to the backroom & doesn't dump Terry Mac, I am wondering is the right man for this role.

 

He makes it hard at times to defend him.

[Mick]

 

No I don't. In general though a manager does need on average at least 2 years.

 

Allardyce is a manager I rate, wanted and have faith in so obviously he'll get time from me, Steve f****** Bruce would, that's just the type of bloke I am, but not at any cost. Sam or Bruce.

 

I expect to see improvements and progression. I'm seeing both, but in very very small doses. I can see a big picture though and based on what I've learned of the manager over the years and his record in football I can see that picture being filled in eventually.

 

If not, back to the drawing board we go.

 

What I can't stomach though is lunacy and hanging a manager after 13 games where 8 of them have yielded enough points to give us a total of 18 and with it a standing of 11th or whatever in the table, because it's pointless.

 

You can disagree, and I won't argue, I can't be bothered.

 

Me, he gest time, support and patience. I rate him, he's a good manager, better or as good as we could get at the time, sacking him now wouldn't do any good whatsoever, he does need time even if you don't rate him and want him out he does need time, so I hope he gets it and we go on to better things.

 

At the start of the season I was hopeful of that, now I can't see him being here in August, thanks to the handy work of our moron fans, although there is still time for Big Sam to change that but he'd have to get us finishing 6th or a trophy and our form doesn't suggest that's going to happen.

 

I just hope Mort and Ashley know more about football than the last fuckwits running things, if not, well, there are other things besides NUFC far more worthy of my emotions.

 

I couldn't stomach another merrygoround. I've had enough.

 

I don't think he needs to finish 6th to keep the fans but people must see something to suggest that good times are ahead, we are talking about the same people who applauded Souness after finishing 14th.

 

The points and league position are better than they were this time last season, the problem is that we could probably have had more if we'd gone into games with a different attitude, nobody will ever convince me that we went to Derby with the right team and tactics, if we had I'm sure we'd now be on 21 points or more.

[Dr Venkman]

Sven, Houllier, Ramos, Hughes, Redknapp, Moyes, O'Neill, (insert your own name here), Allardyce needs more than 13 games.

 

I'm shocked fans have rounded on him so quickly, fans who before he arrived chopped and changed their own opinions on who they'd like to see manage us from one week to the next, fans who if we win our next 3 games will put Allardyce back in the good book, fans who said no to Sven last time, but would love him and his sexy football now. I notice Redknapp is currently flavour of the month and a good back up option incase we can't get Mourinho...

 

Don't you see, it doesn't matter who is in charge, a manager needs more than 13 games.

 

I guarantee if it was Sven, Houllier or whoever who was having a dodgy patch the same threads would be made about them.

 

Oh and yesterday was one of the most embarrassing moments I've had to endure sitting next to my fellow fans.  Well f****** done on makBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOing us the BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO laughing stoBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOck of the PremBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOiership agaiBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOn

 

NUFC fans = idiots

 

 

Mind, I was just as embarrassed about the performance, but still, 13 games....

 

Lets hope Ashley and Mort are not idiots, eh.

 

If i were at the game yesterday i would of walked out of the ground in disgust...of the fans.

 

Terrible. We look like the muppets everyone brands us as. Well done.

 

Agreed. Completely embarrassing.

 

 

 

NE5, i feel total and utter delight on agreeing with you, CoachHTT, where the hell have you been? we've been fighting this alone for 12 pages!

go and have a wankathon with your mates over your fat sam picures

 

haha, i rarely agree with NE5, that was my point. and if you're going to try and be clever i suggest you check your spelling

[Mick]

 

Agreed. Reports about dressing room unrest are always worrying, whether true or not. I think who goes or stays in January will be canny revealing on that front. I'm talking about Allardyce here too.

 

I think he'll still be here at the end of the season unless we got somebody a lot better, they do exist.  I think it's probably 9 to 1 that he'll stay because I doubt we'd get better, even if it is possible.  I'm sure we'll not get a knee-jerk reaction although again, it's possible.

[Mick]

 

haha, i rarely agree with NE5, that was my point. and if you're going to try and be clever i suggest you check your spelling

 

Your 'i's' should be upper case, so should the 'a' at the beginning of the sentence, do I win? 

[Dr Venkman]

 

haha, i rarely agree with NE5, that was my point. and if you're going to try and be clever i suggest you check your spelling

 

Your 'i's' should be upper case, so should the 'a' at the beginning of the sentence, do I win? 

 

no, it was a spelling competition, not punctuation and grammar