Senderos Vs Taylor

[fredbob]

They're both equally crap, neither player has any outstanding quality, and both seem to have the exact same attributes. If Taylor played at a lower positioned side do you think going by any of his perfomance that he would stand out as a defender? Same goes for Senderos as well.

 

The only reason Taylor hasnt been cast off as a s*** defender like Roz, Cacapa, Bramble, Boums etc is because he's a product of the youth system here, he hasnt dont anything in my opinion to clearly seperate himself from this group of write offs.

 

Reminds me of Oba a little, seems to have the attributes, but doesnt have the brain to put it together. And hasnt done in 130 appereances etc. At least Oba has a telling end product at times.

 

I just don't think he has the attributes. I don't think he doesn't have a brain or anything, just doesn't have the required attributes.

 

What you said actually reminds me of Bramble.

 

Fair point!

 

Starting to agree with you to be honest, if your looking for a true measure of how good a defender is you need to compare them against the best in the world.

 

Comparing them against equals or poorer defender will tell you absolutely nothing, its easy to say that Taylor is better than Bramble, that he's a better passer of the ball, but that is only because Bramble is a terrible passer of the ball.

 

If Taylor wants a true measure of how good he is as a defender he needs to be compared agaisnt he likes of Terry, Ferdinand, Vidic or Toure.

 

To say he's a good defender despite being at least 3 classes below the best isnt a good measure of aplayers ability in my book.

 

 

[Guest Sniffer]

They're both equally crap, neither player has any outstanding quality, and both seem to have the exact same attributes. If Taylor played at a lower positioned side do you think going by any of his perfomance that he would stand out as a defender? Same goes for Senderos as well.

 

The only reason Taylor hasnt been cast off as a s*** defender like Roz, Cacapa, Bramble, Boums etc is because he's a product of the youth system here, he hasnt dont anything in my opinion to clearly seperate himself from this group of write offs.

 

Reminds me of Oba a little, seems to have the attributes, but doesnt have the brain to put it together. And hasnt done in 130 appereances etc. At least Oba has a telling end product at times.

 

I just don't think he has the attributes. I don't think he doesn't have a brain or anything, just doesn't have the required attributes.

 

What you said actually reminds me of Bramble.

 

Fair point!

 

Starting to agree with you to be honest, if your looking for a true measure of how good a defender is you need to compare them against the best in the world.

 

Comparing them against equals or poorer defender will tell you absolutely nothing, its easy to say that Taylor is better than Bramble, that he's a better passer of the ball, but that is only because Bramble is a terrible passer of the ball.

 

If Taylor wants a true measure of how good he is as a defender he needs to be compared agaisnt he likes of Terry, Ferdinand, Vidic or Toure.

 

To say he's a good defender despite being at least 3 classes below the best isnt a good measure of aplayers ability in my book.

 

 

Aren't you forgetting that he's 21 and surrounded by shite?

 

How about the rest of our central defenders compared to the  four you've mentioned? None of the ones who are 30 are going to get any better so should we ship them all out?

[Dave]

This is like asking whether you'd prefer your cock cutting off or your balls cutting off.

[Guest jcricthon]

Out of the two, Taylor has the more room for improvement, and the better potential.

 

Taylor has played alongside Carr, Babayaro, Boumsong, Bramble, whereas Senderos is being coached by one of the best managers in the world, playing alongside quality international stars like Gallas and Toure and they're both at pretty much the same level ability wise.

 

Agreed.

I'm sure its generally agreed that defenders don't seem to peek now until their late 20s, even hitting 30 (Campbell, Carragher, Carvalho etc.), thus making this a bit insignificant, but at the moment I'd go for Taylor.

I'm sure I am right in saying Taylor has the highest number of tackles and blocks in the Premiership this season? With an attitude like that, responsibility like captaining the Under-21s and plenty of years experience ahead of him before he peaks, I can also see him becoming a very good player.

[Tooj]

They're both equally crap, neither player has any outstanding quality, and both seem to have the exact same attributes. If Taylor played at a lower positioned side do you think going by any of his perfomance that he would stand out as a defender? Same goes for Senderos as well.

 

The only reason Taylor hasnt been cast off as a s*** defender like Roz, Cacapa, Bramble, Boums etc is because he's a product of the youth system here, he hasnt dont anything in my opinion to clearly seperate himself from this group of write offs.

 

Reminds me of Oba a little, seems to have the attributes, but doesnt have the brain to put it together. And hasnt done in 130 appereances etc. At least Oba has a telling end product at times.

 

I just don't think he has the attributes. I don't think he doesn't have a brain or anything, just doesn't have the required attributes.

 

What you said actually reminds me of Bramble.

 

Fair point!

 

Starting to agree with you to be honest, if your looking for a true measure of how good a defender is you need to compare them against the best in the world.

 

Comparing them against equals or poorer defender will tell you absolutely nothing, its easy to say that Taylor is better than Bramble, that he's a better passer of the ball, but that is only because Bramble is a terrible passer of the ball.

 

If Taylor wants a true measure of how good he is as a defender he needs to be compared agaisnt he likes of Terry, Ferdinand, Vidic or Toure.

 

To say he's a good defender despite being at least 3 classes below the best isnt a good measure of aplayers ability in my book.

 

 

Aren't you forgetting that he's 21 and surrounded by shite?

 

How about the rest of our central defenders compared to the  four you've mentioned? None of the ones who are 30 are going to get any better so should we ship them all out?

 

Ah so the blaming of other people again then.

[Guest alex]

I'm not sure I'd swap Senderos for Taylor like. With both I get the feeling the next clanger is round the corner. Good centre halves need to be consistent as much as anything else. It's no good being sublime one week and ridiculous the next, as Titus proved.

[Mowen]

This is like asking whether you'd prefer your cock cutting off or your balls cutting off.

 

Dunno. Balls probably.

[Dave]

This is like asking whether you'd prefer your cock cutting off or your balls cutting off.

 

Dunno. Balls probably.

 

[fredbob]

They're both equally crap, neither player has any outstanding quality, and both seem to have the exact same attributes. If Taylor played at a lower positioned side do you think going by any of his perfomance that he would stand out as a defender? Same goes for Senderos as well.

 

The only reason Taylor hasnt been cast off as a s*** defender like Roz, Cacapa, Bramble, Boums etc is because he's a product of the youth system here, he hasnt dont anything in my opinion to clearly seperate himself from this group of write offs.

 

Reminds me of Oba a little, seems to have the attributes, but doesnt have the brain to put it together. And hasnt done in 130 appereances etc. At least Oba has a telling end product at times.

The fact that Taylor has played at the back with the s**** you mention says it all. How could you learn anything from those players? Tthrow in the abject fullbacks we've had and exposure the back four got from the midfield and I'm surprised he didn't put in a transfer request. At 21 he's still learning and at least has the right attitude which can't be said for everybody.

 

But learning from other players is only part of the process, he hasnt showed one modicom of improvement since his debut yet has had a lot of practise at defendeing. As have the likes of Beye and Faye and they have both come in and looked good in a poor back four.

 

You learn from you're experineces.

 

As for the exposure form the back 4 nonsense, well what are you saying? He's crap becasue he's had to defend alot?

[Guest alex]

If you think he's good sniffer, why not say why, instead of saying why he isn't, which is basically all you seem to be doing.

[fredbob]

They're both equally crap, neither player has any outstanding quality, and both seem to have the exact same attributes. If Taylor played at a lower positioned side do you think going by any of his perfomance that he would stand out as a defender? Same goes for Senderos as well.

 

The only reason Taylor hasnt been cast off as a s*** defender like Roz, Cacapa, Bramble, Boums etc is because he's a product of the youth system here, he hasnt dont anything in my opinion to clearly seperate himself from this group of write offs.

 

Reminds me of Oba a little, seems to have the attributes, but doesnt have the brain to put it together. And hasnt done in 130 appereances etc. At least Oba has a telling end product at times.

 

I just don't think he has the attributes. I don't think he doesn't have a brain or anything, just doesn't have the required attributes.

 

What you said actually reminds me of Bramble.

 

Fair point!

 

Starting to agree with you to be honest, if your looking for a true measure of how good a defender is you need to compare them against the best in the world.

 

Comparing them against equals or poorer defender will tell you absolutely nothing, its easy to say that Taylor is better than Bramble, that he's a better passer of the ball, but that is only because Bramble is a terrible passer of the ball.

 

If Taylor wants a true measure of how good he is as a defender he needs to be compared agaisnt he likes of Terry, Ferdinand, Vidic or Toure.

 

To say he's a good defender despite being at least 3 classes below the best isnt a good measure of aplayers ability in my book.

 

 

Aren't you forgetting that he's 21 and surrounded by s****?

 

How about the rest of our central defenders compared to the  four you've mentioned? None of the ones who are 30 are going to get any better so should we ship them all out?

 

Ah so the blaming of other people again then.

 

Precisely. That shouldnt stop him being a good defender, it shouldnt stop the ball bouncing over his head and it shouldnt stop him tracking the run of an attacker, the defnders role is an individual role, you can only make yourself look bad because your role in the squad isnt effected much by how the rest of the team play, which is conversely different to say a striker who is practically dependant on the team.

 

Look at Woodgate at Leeds when they were on there way down, he still looked class despite not getting much protection. How about Campbell at Pompey last year.

 

[Guest alex]

What about Wheater?

[fredbob]

They're both equally crap, neither player has any outstanding quality, and both seem to have the exact same attributes. If Taylor played at a lower positioned side do you think going by any of his perfomance that he would stand out as a defender? Same goes for Senderos as well.

 

The only reason Taylor hasnt been cast off as a s*** defender like Roz, Cacapa, Bramble, Boums etc is because he's a product of the youth system here, he hasnt dont anything in my opinion to clearly seperate himself from this group of write offs.

 

Reminds me of Oba a little, seems to have the attributes, but doesnt have the brain to put it together. And hasnt done in 130 appereances etc. At least Oba has a telling end product at times.

 

I just don't think he has the attributes. I don't think he doesn't have a brain or anything, just doesn't have the required attributes.

 

What you said actually reminds me of Bramble.

 

Fair point!

 

Starting to agree with you to be honest, if your looking for a true measure of how good a defender is you need to compare them against the best in the world.

 

Comparing them against equals or poorer defender will tell you absolutely nothing, its easy to say that Taylor is better than Bramble, that he's a better passer of the ball, but that is only because Bramble is a terrible passer of the ball.

 

If Taylor wants a true measure of how good he is as a defender he needs to be compared agaisnt he likes of Terry, Ferdinand, Vidic or Toure.

 

To say he's a good defender despite being at least 3 classes below the best isnt a good measure of aplayers ability in my book.

 

 

Aren't you forgetting that he's 21 and surrounded by s****?

 

How about the rest of our central defenders compared to the  four you've mentioned? None of the ones who are 30 are going to get any better so should we ship them all out?

 

So, your saying Taylor is crap because the defender he was with were crap as well? Well what about those defenders? Werent they crap because they themselves were playing with other crap defenders??

 

 

[Guest Sniffer]

They're both equally crap, neither player has any outstanding quality, and both seem to have the exact same attributes. If Taylor played at a lower positioned side do you think going by any of his perfomance that he would stand out as a defender? Same goes for Senderos as well.

 

The only reason Taylor hasnt been cast off as a s*** defender like Roz, Cacapa, Bramble, Boums etc is because he's a product of the youth system here, he hasnt dont anything in my opinion to clearly seperate himself from this group of write offs.

 

Reminds me of Oba a little, seems to have the attributes, but doesnt have the brain to put it together. And hasnt done in 130 appereances etc. At least Oba has a telling end product at times.

The fact that Taylor has played at the back with the s**** you mention says it all. How could you learn anything from those players? Tthrow in the abject fullbacks we've had and exposure the back four got from the midfield and I'm surprised he didn't put in a transfer request. At 21 he's still learning and at least has the right attitude which can't be said for everybody.

 

But learning from other players is only part of the process, he hasnt showed one modicom of improvement since his debut yet has had a lot of practise at defendeing. As have the likes of Beye and Faye and they have both come in and looked good in a poor back four.

 

You learn from you're experineces.

 

As for the exposure form the back 4 nonsense, well what are you saying? He's crap becasue he's had to defend alot?

No. I'm saying he's a young lad playing in a poor back four that's had little cover from a poor midfield. He's played with a succession of mediocre central defenders that somebody listed above. Plus the fullbacks have been shite which leads to the back four being pulled all over. I'd say that Terry looks a lot better than he is playing alongside Carvalho, Vidic alonside Ferdinand, anybody alongside Gallas. Throw in their fullbacks who can actually defend and cut out crosses and you have a back four that can play consistently well, grow in confidence and everybody improves and looks good. Taylor has never had that opportunity so it's absurd to compare him with these players who are also much more experienced.

 

But then, if you think Faye is a good central defender as he's average at best and looked like a donkey in some games, what's the point?

[James]

I think Taylor is the better of the two, but things could change if we improve our defensive unit (as a team, not just in defence), and Taylor doesn't stop having some of those moments of bad defending that he still produces.

[Ashley17]

Fuckin hate David Wheater, Boro fan at Uni quipped that he was better than Woodgate, I spent a week taking the piss only for him to get called into the England squad. Fuck sake!

 

I think Taylor and Senderos are both pretty poor, but I've seen Taylor have more good games than Senderos (law of averages, most likely)

[KaKa]

Pretty similar players, but I've seen Senderos have more outstanding games than Taylor. Senderos is also a much bigger threat at scoring goals from corners. I think Senderos is a better player tbh.

 

Don't let the fresh memory of last night' game fool you. Afterall it was no worse than Taylors unbelievably poor performance against Manchester United earlier this season.

 

We have to remember that yesterday's game was a huge game with tons of pressure and not just another game. Senderos also hasn't played much recently and got thrown in at the deepend somewhat. I am pretty certain Taylor would have been worse under the same circumstances. I think he would have crumbled even moreso than Senderos.

 

Did any of you see Senderos at the world cup where he was great as a first teamer for Switzerland? They didn't concede a goal from open play during their group stage games. Taylor wouldn't look as impressive at that level.

[Alberto2005]

Senderos imo.

[juniatmoko]

both are shit.... but they are still young... they will learn. defenders reach it peak at the age of 28 and 32

[fredbob]

They're both equally crap, neither player has any outstanding quality, and both seem to have the exact same attributes. If Taylor played at a lower positioned side do you think going by any of his perfomance that he would stand out as a defender? Same goes for Senderos as well.

 

The only reason Taylor hasnt been cast off as a s*** defender like Roz, Cacapa, Bramble, Boums etc is because he's a product of the youth system here, he hasnt dont anything in my opinion to clearly seperate himself from this group of write offs.

 

Reminds me of Oba a little, seems to have the attributes, but doesnt have the brain to put it together. And hasnt done in 130 appereances etc. At least Oba has a telling end product at times.

The fact that Taylor has played at the back with the s**** you mention says it all. How could you learn anything from those players? Tthrow in the abject fullbacks we've had and exposure the back four got from the midfield and I'm surprised he didn't put in a transfer request. At 21 he's still learning and at least has the right attitude which can't be said for everybody.

 

But learning from other players is only part of the process, he hasnt showed one modicom of improvement since his debut yet has had a lot of practise at defendeing. As have the likes of Beye and Faye and they have both come in and looked good in a poor back four.

 

You learn from you're experineces.

 

As for the exposure form the back 4 nonsense, well what are you saying? He's crap becasue he's had to defend alot?

No. I'm saying he's a young lad playing in a poor back four that's had little cover from a poor midfield. He's played with a succession of mediocre central defenders that somebody listed above. Plus the fullbacks have been s**** which leads to the back four being pulled all over. I'd say that Terry looks a lot better than he is playing alongside Carvalho, Vidic alonside Ferdinand, anybody alongside Gallas. Throw in their fullbacks who can actually defend and cut out crosses and you have a back four that can play consistently well, grow in confidence and everybody improves and looks good. Taylor has never had that opportunity so it's absurd to compare him with these players who are also much more experienced.

 

But then, if you think Faye is a good central defender as he's average at best and looked like a donkey in some games, what's the point?

 

You'd say Terry looks better playing with Carvahllo, i'd say the Chelsea defence looks better when Terry is playing with Carvahllo. Theres a big difference there.

 

I think its ironic that you call our best centre defender since Woodgate " a donkey in some games" yet have the audacity to defend a player like Taylor.

 

I think you have to look at his indivudial traits such a positioning and heading and anticipation to see what mst of us are on about when we assess Taylor, saying he's poor because he's young and has played with some poor players doesnt really help assess him as an individual defender.

 

 

 

[S.S.R.]

Senderos was awful against Liverpool last night.

 

Hyypia made him look a mug, and Liverpool's second goal was a joke. They were both stood together when Torres received the ball, Torres moved away from him - not even particularly quickly - and he just stood still and let him move about two-three yards away from him.

 

He may as well walked off the pitch and sat down, for all the use he was.

[Newcastle Fan]

Why the fuck do people hate Taylor so much around here

[mozy]

Taylor has more potential and I would have him over Senderos every day of the week. Senderos reminds me of Bramble, without the good side!

[Mick]

I thought that Taylor would become a very good player but he hasn't.  Passing the buck to everybody but him is daft as he's responsible for his own performances, nobody else.

[Gash]

Senderos, and i am as annoyed at him as the next man atm.

Senderos small duck big pond? Senderos is being scrutinised for not being at ARSENAL standard