Newcastle United 2 - 2 Stoke City - 06/12/08 - Post match reaction from page 16

[Guest Howaythetoon]

We are going down folks with this muppet in charge, those heartless bastards in our shirt and the shitbags running the club from above.

 

Look, even if the players aren't doing it, we need to hold back until the end of season post mortem before having a go. We need to give them more support than ever right now, as realistically they are pretty much our last hope.

 

I do plenty of that at the match thanks... not that it gets us anywhere. The whole club is a mess and honestly, relegation could well be the only way to get rid of this mess as much as it pains me to say it. When a former player pops up in the last minute to grab an equaliser it does make you wonder about fate... teams that flirt with relegation a few times eventually run out of luck or answers. Furthermore the opposition has been stronger than ever making our position even more perilous. We are going down.

[Adam]

Needs moar Joey Barton/

[James]

Relegation prospects will be determined by whether the likes of Owen, Martins, Jonas, Barton and Viduka can stay fit.

 

With players like that to pick from, I don't think even someone as incompetent as Kinnear could quite fuck it up. We'll be shite all year, but we'll just do enough to get through it and stay up.

 

But lose more than 1 or 2 of that lot and all bets are off, and we really could be going down.

 

The man is useless, truly useless, and has no business in any level of professional football management, nevermind managing an established Premier League club.

 

I'd give an awful lot for us to be taken over by someone, anyone, and a real boss brought in.

 

Fuck all those cunts for what happened on the first few days of September. Power hungry cunts who've ruined the great direction we were going in.

 

I think it is just down to those lot staying fit, but a few other players staying injured.

 

At the moment, it is almost as if Kinnear has created a list that looks like this:

 

 

1. Given

2. Owen

3. Duff

4. Butt

5. Barton

6. Smith

7. Colocinni

8. Taylor

9. Beye

10. Enrique

11. Gutierrez

12. Martins

13. Viduka

14. Bassong

 

etc, and is just sticking whoever is close to the top of his list of favourites into the team shunting out those towards the bottom.

[ElDiablo]

We'll put in a Villa like performance soon and everything will be rosy again.

 

What, we'll get a goal from absolutely nowhere after looking shite for 60 minutes and only being in the game due to the opposition missing an absolute sitter and Given making a great save?

 

I actually agree, that's probably all we can hope for with Kinnear in charge.

 

Clever.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

I'm not sure what concerns me more, the match I've just witnessed or the reaction of the fans.

 

I was thinking exactly the same.  Have Stoke not been above us for the majority of the season?  I can't remember the last time I felt like Newcastle could beat virtually anyone at home, and I don't know why people are assuming that just because Stoke are just up from the Championship we should automatically be tonking them.

 

It's s*** that we didn't, and it's s*** the way we hoyed the points away, but they started the game in a higher position than we did, and that has to count for something.  Blackburn, West Brom and Sunderland will save us

 

No-one was expecting us to hammer them, but people have a right to expect a team coasting into a 2-0 half-time lead to pick up the three points even at this ridiculously insane club of ours where nothing is ever as black and white as that. As for sunderland and Blackburn, I expect those two clubs to react positively to a perilous situation which the mackems will no doubt do sooner following kean's departure. Our reaction to our own perilous situation..... was to hand Kinnear the job until the end of the season. We're fucked.

[Guest Heneage]

Few questions I was there behind the gallowgate but .

 

1.) was it a freekick I couldn't see anything majorly wrong and it seemed tome at least another poor decision by a ref who had a poor game for both teams. First half all us second all them.

 

2.)ok Guthrie is injured but why not bring Viduka on? Their defence was shakey at the best of to we our goals showed that, chuck an extra man against 2 centre backs and I would gurantee 3-0 before 60 minutes. UK seems to have this real rigid belief in 4-4-2 and the fact he brought Taylor on baffled more, not because it's Taylor he played very well, but it just meant jinking and even then you have Cacapa or Colo who are supposed Dm's.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

we are screwed if we are having to rely on keeping players fit and Owen staying, the two biggest question marks over the club in recent years. How to prevent injuries and keep Owen. We need to rely on the opposition performing worse than we do and the tactical nous of our manager and of course what all fortune needs, reams of positivity. Now I'm usually one of the most optimistic when it comes to Newcastle but I cannot see anything positive to come for us under the 4 fuckiteers ru/ining our club.

[Teasy]

worrying feeling.... actually i felt i can accept being relegated now!

 

We've been here before. We're going nowhere.

 

Yep, short memories. We'll be fine.

 

Really wish you'd fuck off with this condescending bullshit Diablo. Short memories of what? I remember last season perfectly.

 

Dalglish and Gullit left within a few weeks of the respective new seasons. We were close-ish to relegation under Souness, but we were five points away from the drop-zone with a few months to go. Roeder, we were never really in danger - i never really understood this big sigh of relief when we won at Sheffield United. We were miles away from going down. Last season we were potentially going down - that's the closest we've been until now, but we had Kevin Keegan and pulled ourselves away.

 

This season, we're a few points off bottom of the table at Christmas times, with a shitty run of fixtures in the New Year. With Joe Kinnear.

 

We're perilously close to relegation, man.

 

Why should I? Like I said if we hang on which was looking more and more likely and the time ran out would there be the same inquest into Kinnear's subs, his tactics? Course not. We concede a goal from A SET PIECE, and suddenly he's the fucking anti-christ. It gets to me more than anything I've ever read on here, kneekjerk doesn't do it anywhere near justice.

 

We were in a worse position under Allardyce and say what you like, we could have easily gone down under KK imo. But we're not even at Christmas yet, picking up points (that should have been three points today, yes), scoring goals and looking reasonable tight at the back. What with the premiership table as it is now too it's pretty fucking obvious to me that we've been much deeper shit not even 8 months ago. Yet i'm reading this 'omg, we r so going down' which gets an airing every time a result doesn't go out way. We'll put in a Villa like performance soon and everything will be rosy again.

 

Perilously close to relegation, good cunting grief.

 

The way you talk about the game everything was going fine until we leaked a fluke goal and now Kinnear is being made a scapegoat.  That's just not how it happened..  We invited pressure on to ourselves for the entire of the second half and to me it was always a matter of when the Stoke goals would come, not if.  Contrary to the rosy picture your painting we looked more and more desperate and likely to concede as time ran out.  This is not a case of everything going ok with an unlucky goal at the end, this is a case of a manager making 3 completely inept substitutions, each of them piling more and more pressure on the side, and being inevitably punished for it.

[Syrette]

I'm not sure what concerns me more, the match I've just witnessed or the reaction of the fans.

 

I was thinking exactly the same.  Have Stoke not been above us for the majority of the season?  I can't remember the last time I felt like Newcastle could beat virtually anyone at home, and I don't know why people are assuming that just because Stoke are just up from the Championship we should automatically be tonking them.

 

It's s*** that we didn't, and it's s*** the way we hoyed the points away, but they started the game in a higher position than we did, and that has to count for something.  Blackburn, West Brom and Sunderland will save us

 

No-one was expecting us to hammer them, but people have a right to expect a team coasting into a 2-0 half-time lead to pick up the three points even at this ridiculously insane club of ours where nothing is ever as black and white as that. As for sunderland and Blackburn, I expect those two clubs to react positively to a perilous situation which the mackems will no doubt do sooner following kean's departure. Our reaction to our own perilous situation..... was to hand Kinnear the job until the end of the season. We're fucked.

 

Simple as really. Well said.

 

I can not believe there are people out there who are using the fact that we're below the likes of Stoke as a positive thing. I should be happy that we got point/s against teams higher than us, simply because they are higher than us?

[Shak]

We'll put in a Villa like performance soon and everything will be rosy again.

 

What, we'll get a goal from absolutely nowhere after looking shite for 60 minutes and only being in the game due to the opposition missing an absolute sitter and Given making a great save?

 

I actually agree, that's probably all we can hope for with Kinnear in charge.

 

Clever.

 

It's quite true though.

 

Not one game under Kinnear have we looked good going forward, actually playing good football and creating chances rather than just hoping for the best and trying to keep it tight at the back.

 

Until today of course, and we all know Joe put a stop to that as soon as it could be addressed at half time.

[TRon]

the team basically picked itself, but ill give kinnear credit for making it work, particularly the emphasis on pace and width, with us doubling up on their full back at every opportunity, and martins dragging defenders out of position. it looked like a system that guaranteed us to be on top and, when guthrie went off, kinnear shouldve done everything he could to maintain this system.

 

but he changed it around and stripped us of what made us so dangerous, taking players out of their positions and putting them in untested places or slots they are not suited to. then he made it worse by taking martins off, and again by taking off geremi, our last remaining central midfielder. as a collection, those 3 subs are the worst i can remember as a newcastle fan.

 

That's the first sensible post I've read in the last few pages, aside from the last sentance, as I'll reserve judgement on the substitutions until I've heard Kinnear's explanations. I don't know how many of you were there, but we were as good in the first half as we were bad in the second. Bottom line, imo, is that we wouldn't have lost that match if Guthrie hadn't been injured. ps Beye and Jonas were just sublime in the fist half.

 

It's a shame the second half is going to overshadow the first because for the first time we had players moving and passing at pace, and for me the make up of the midfield had a lot to do with that. We should have had a midfielder on the bench though, even if it was Lua Lua. The concern for me is that we are letting sides dominate us for such long periods once we have taken a lead. It was all Stoke in the second half and JK didn't make the best use of his subs for me.

[Robster]

For me he simply side-stepped the opportunity to go with the 3 up front and come out for the 2nd half with an attacking mentality

 

[Guest Howaythetoon]

The last time we played Stoke at home...

 

Only at Newcastle could things go so belly up in such a short space of time.

[chicago_shearer]

There isn't really going to be a more winnable home game all season, and we didn't win it.  1 point is no consolation at all. 

[Guest samtoonarmy]

Few questions I was there behind the gallowgate but .

 

1.) was it a freekick I couldn't see anything majorly wrong and it seemed tome at least another poor decision by a ref who had a poor game for both teams. First half all us second all them.

 

Seen it on the tele just before the end and it was never a free kick in a million years.

 

As for us, we'll get relegated at this rate if we cant beat West Brom, Wigan and now Stoke at home - which are teams we should be beating at SJP. If you look at our next four games in the league, we've got Portsmouth away, Spurs at home, Wigan away and Liverpool. Personally I cant see us winning any of them. Things dont look good

[Teasy]

Perilously close to relegation, good cunting grief.

 

This is relegation form. I don't know how you can deny that. You don't throw away 2 goal leads at home to teams like Stoke and expect to get away with it.

 

Before the last 3 games I would have expected us to take 3 or 4 points in total from them. We have 3, not in the way we thought but to go away to Boro and Chelsea and get points doesn't indicate relegation form to me.

 

Form doesn't equal 3 games though, I said the same thing to myself after the Boro game with regards to Wigan.  I thought well I expected 3 points against Wigan and maybe one against Boro and none against Chelsea so its not so bad in the end.  But now when this result is added to it the picture starts to look far more worrying.

[johnnypd]

the team basically picked itself, but ill give kinnear credit for making it work, particularly the emphasis on pace and width, with us doubling up on their full back at every opportunity, and martins dragging defenders out of position. it looked like a system that guaranteed us to be on top and, when guthrie went off, kinnear shouldve done everything he could to maintain this system.

 

but he changed it around and stripped us of what made us so dangerous, taking players out of their positions and putting them in untested places or slots they are not suited to. then he made it worse by taking martins off, and again by taking off geremi, our last remaining central midfielder. as a collection, those 3 subs are the worst i can remember as a newcastle fan.

 

That's the first sensible post I've read in the last few pages, aside from the last sentance, as I'll reserve judgement on the substitutions until I've heard Kinnear's explanations. I don't know how many of you were there, but we were as good in the first half as we were bad in the second. Bottom line, imo, is that we wouldn't have lost that match if Guthrie hadn't been injured. ps Beye and Jonas were just sublime in the fist half.

 

It's a shame the second half is going to overshadow the first because for the first time we had players moving and passing at pace, and for me the make up of the midfield had a lot to do with that. We should have had a midfielder on the bench though, even if it was Lua Lua. The concern for me is that we are letting sides dominate us for such long periods once we have taken a lead. It was all Stoke in the second half and JK didn't make the best use of his subs for me.

 

Lua Lua looked fine against this lot last year and was on the bench recently so that is a bit of a weird one if he is not injured. not sure he would play centrally in a 4-4-2 but it would give us another option at least, meaning we dont have to push Beye forward.

[Robster]

There isn't really going to be a more winnable home game all season, and we didn't win it.  1 point is no consolation at all. 

 

Its the manner of the result that is the most disappointing.

I always thought this might be a stiff test due to their physical approach, long ball, long throw tactics. Had it been a ding-dong game and ended 2-2, I would have been disppointed but maybe not massively surprised. I am not sure it was the most winnable home game of the season.

Plus Stoke havent done too badly for themselves so far this season

 

However, to capitulate in a game in which we were in such complete and utter control for 45 minutes is like a sucker-punch to the stomach.

[Mick]

The first half was all Newcastle, we played really well and Stoke didn't have a chance.  The second half was totally the opposite and we were the ones who weren't in it.

 

I'm still struggling to get my head around what happened in the second half and I'm still trying to work out the formation after the break and it's 2 1/2 hours since I first tried.

[Decky]

Few questions I was there behind the gallowgate but .

 

1.) was it a freekick I couldn't see anything majorly wrong and it seemed tome at least another poor decision by a ref who had a poor game for both teams. First half all us second all them.

 

Seen it on the tele just before the end and it was never a free kick in a million years.

 

As for us, we'll get relegated at this rate if we cant beat West Brom, Wigan and now Stoke at home - which are teams we should be beating at SJP. If you look at our next four games in the league, we've got Portsmouth away, Spurs at home, Wigan away and Liverpool. Personally I cant see us winning any of them. Things dont look good

 

Would surely warrant getting rid of Kinnear? He cant possible stay if we go 7 games without a win and will more than likely be in the bottom 3 if not rock bottom?

[Syrette]

There isn't really going to be a more winnable home game all season, and we didn't win it.  1 point is no consolation at all. 

 

Succinct and simple, and true.

[Golfmag]

For Christ sake, if everthing post half time is Kinnear's fault, then following the same logic, he derserves for the way he set up the team in the first half and the way they played. Oh, and following the same logic. presumably Kinnear is reponsible for Guthrie's injury. I'm as disappointed as everyone else with the second half display but get some bloody perspective (unbeaten in four) and give Kinnear some bloody credit. Even Southgate of the smogs said today that we are far better organised since his arrival.

[Syrette]

For Christ sake, if everthing post half time is Kinnear's fault, then following the same logic, he sderserves for the way he set up the team in the first half and the way they played. Oh, and following the same logic. presumably Kinnear is reponsible for Guthrie's injury. I'm as disappointed as everyone else witht he second half display but get some bloody perspective (unbeaten in four) and give Kinnear some bloody credit. Even Southgate of the smogs said today that we are far better organised since his arrival.

 

The team pretty much selected itself, and he should have dealt with Guthrie's injury better than he did.

 

I'll give him and the players credit for getting a 2 goal lead, and I'll also criticise them as much as I please for throwing it away.

 

I don't care what Southgate has to say really. Better organised than Keegan? Seriously? Even if he is "better organised", that counts for nothing when you're throwing away points in a manner that I don't feel a Kevin Keegan team would.

[Yorkie]

For Christ sake, if everthing post half time is Kinnear's fault, then following the same logic, he sderserves for the way he set up the team in the first half and the way they played. Oh, and following the same logic. presumably Kinnear is reponsible for Guthrie's injury. I'm as disappointed as everyone else witht he second half display but get some bloody perspective (unbeaten in four) and give Kinnear some bloody credit. Even Southgate of the smogs said today that we are far better organised since his arrival.

 

Well done, Joe. You can put two wingers and two strikers on the field, and make them play as two wingers and two strikers against the mighty Stoke. Bravo.

[Teasy]

Few questions I was there behind the gallowgate but .

 

1.) was it a freekick I couldn't see anything majorly wrong and it seemed tome at least another poor decision by a ref who had a poor game for both teams. First half all us second all them.

 

Seen it on the tele just before the end and it was never a free kick in a million years.

 

As for us, we'll get relegated at this rate if we cant beat West Brom, Wigan and now Stoke at home - which are teams we should be beating at SJP. If you look at our next four games in the league, we've got Portsmouth away, Spurs at home, Wigan away and Liverpool. Personally I cant see us winning any of them. Things dont look good

 

We did beat West Brom, but you've still got a point.