Cockney Mafia Out! Banner

[Guest fading star]

As HTT has already said, the banner is pretty harmless, its not that offensive and singling out cockneys is not going to upset that many people. Most London fans probably laugh at the banner. Thats not the point, its makes us look small-minded, has further damaged our reputation in the press and doesnt address the reality of the financial crisis in its continued assertion that the current owner should leave.

But NUFC supporters aren’t small minded. The opinion of people who get their knickers in a twist over a piss taking banner at a football match aren’t worth bothering with.

 

I don’t know Keith but he should be able to express his views without fear of harassment.

I'm not saying they are, i'm saying it makes us look small-minded, which is the impact its had in the press.

 

As for your second idea that he should be able to express his views without fear of harassment, what if those views are offensive, or what if those views are idiotic? Clearly just because you have a point of view doesnt make it vaild or worth expressing. I can think of some pretty offensive and idiotic points of view, because i have them they are valid???

 

I'd say that highlighting a regionalist separation between the north and south of England, when we play with French, Argentinean, Irish, Spanish and Nigerian players makes us look like f***ing bell-ends.

Yes it makes us look small minded in the eyes of people who really are small minded. People with a modicum of intelligence are unlikely to jump to sweeping conclusions about NUFC supporters because they see two blokes with a cockney mafia out banner on the TV, unless of course they already have an anti NUFC agenda.

 

Are you opposed to the chants we sing inside the ground that that include the word Geordie? They do after all highlight a regionalist separation between the north and south of England.

[NE5]

I was referring to NJS, but the number of matches Keith has been to doesn't change my opinion of this stupid banner one little bit.

 

I don't believe in pissing contest in general but when it comes to football, people who put time, effort and money into actually supporting the team deserve credit for that - I have no problem with anyone anywhere calling themselves a fan and supporting the team in spirit but to pretend they are the same level of fan as those who go to games is ridiculous imo.

 

 

 

Nowhere near as ridiculous as calling someone an "enemy of the club" because they disagree with you.

 

It wasn't primarily because you disagreed with me - it was because you implied that the banner could be used by "enemies" which I think is bollocks and leading on from that I think people who support Ashley as fully as I get the impression you do are in my opinion just as much enemies of the club as nebulous media or fans of other clubs.

 

 

 

How anyone can be labeled an enemy of the club because they support the present owner is strange to say the least. He may have upset Keegan he may have appointed Wise but he also probably saved the club from the financial Armageddon it was heading towards.

 

Ashley may not be right for Newcastle (personally I think he could be given a chance) But if he is not who is ?

While everyone carps on about how bad Ashley is, no one comes up with any tangible, realistic or specific alternative, just the usual abstract slavver - "someone who'll spend big" - "someone who'll back the manager" - "someone who we'll all love" etc etc.

Who is this person ?

Do we want Freddy and Doug back ?  Can we name the Russian oligarch, Saudi prince or Texan oil man who we want to head up NUFC ?

Or do we just continue to harp on about what went before and pile abuse on the only person who right now can ACTUALLY do something about NUFC.

 

 

I'm actually fairly sceptical of Ashley, but I'm still in wait-and-see mode, and I definitely think the way everyone decided Ashley was the devil incarnate five minutes after Keegan walked (or in NE5's case, five minutes after he bought the club) is pretty... hysterical.

 

unfortunately I was also right.

 

You should learn to look at things and judge them, instead of "waiting to see"

 

Then again, I wouldn't expect someone who wasn't interested in the club when they had a shite board to know one when they saw one in the first place

 

 

[Syrette]

Not that old chestnut.

[fredbob]

I was referring to NJS, but the number of matches Keith has been to doesn't change my opinion of this stupid banner one little bit.

 

I don't believe in pissing contest in general but when it comes to football, people who put time, effort and money into actually supporting the team deserve credit for that - I have no problem with anyone anywhere calling themselves a fan and supporting the team in spirit but to pretend they are the same level of fan as those who go to games is ridiculous imo.

 

 

 

Nowhere near as ridiculous as calling someone an "enemy of the club" because they disagree with you.

 

It wasn't primarily because you disagreed with me - it was because you implied that the banner could be used by "enemies" which I think is bollocks and leading on from that I think people who support Ashley as fully as I get the impression you do are in my opinion just as much enemies of the club as nebulous media or fans of other clubs.

 

 

 

How anyone can be labeled an enemy of the club because they support the present owner is strange to say the least. He may have upset Keegan he may have appointed Wise but he also probably saved the club from the financial Armageddon it was heading towards.

 

Ashley may not be right for Newcastle (personally I think he could be given a chance) But if he is not who is ?

While everyone carps on about how bad Ashley is, no one comes up with any tangible, realistic or specific alternative, just the usual abstract slavver - "someone who'll spend big" - "someone who'll back the manager" - "someone who we'll all love" etc etc.

Who is this person ?

Do we want Freddy and Doug back ?  Can we name the Russian oligarch, Saudi prince or Texan oil man who we want to head up NUFC ?

Or do we just continue to harp on about what went before and pile abuse on the only person who right now can ACTUALLY do something about NUFC.

 

 

I'm actually fairly sceptical of Ashley, but I'm still in wait-and-see mode, and I definitely think the way everyone decided Ashley was the devil incarnate five minutes after Keegan walked (or in NE5's case, five minutes after he bought the club) is pretty... hysterical.

 

unfortunately I was also right.

 

You should learn to look at things and judge them, instead of "waiting to see"

 

Then again, I wouldn't expect someone who wasn't interested in the club when they had a shite board to know one when they saw one in the first place

 

 

 

 

Sometime, NE5, you dont half come out with some shit.

 

Do you think about what you write or do you just go blind and let god do his thing?

[NE5]

Mike ashley invested Millions of his own money into the club and like Keith, may make a few bob out of it. Dont see anyone dredging the shit out of his arse.

 

Actually, according to some thats not true, but you get my point.

 

Only relevant if Ashley sells at a loss imo.

 

 

 

Cant see him selling at a profit at the minute. Not a fair comparison anyway as Ashley's only been around 18 months.

 

Its funny like but Ashley gave 80% of Newcastle fans exactly what they wanted, 1. He got rid of Shepherd 2. He (apparently) introduced some sense into the business operations that people complained about under Shepherd and 3. He brought King Kev back and gave SJP the opportunity to sing EIEIEIO one more time (which most would never have expected).

 

We dont know why things fucked up over the summer but if it turns out Kev was playing silly buggers i'll feel sorry for him in a lot of ways. If you took a wishlist from 2005/6, am sure a lot of what went on up till sept 2nd was in line with what people wanted, apart from a missing 20m worth of investment and again we dont know why that didnt happen either.

 

Maybe i'm being too circumspect.

 

Maybe they only thought thats what they wanted ie anybody but the fat bastard and all of that ?

 

Some should have known better though.

 

 

The fan's expectations were developed over the 90s and they expected it to be the norm to be competing at the top and in Europe every year. When we were subsequently in mid table the frustrations of the fans were taken out on the board, a position i never agreed with as i could see it was them that had given them the expectations in the first place!!

 

I think that those frustrations are still there and people want to take them out on someone else now. We need to step back and think about where we've been as a club, the state of the current financial world and maybe hold back from anymore discontent for now. These banners are getting us nowhere at the minute.

 

 

exactly right.

 

I agree the whole thing is now just so frustrating but there is nothing anybody can do but protest.

 

 

[NE5]

I was referring to NJS, but the number of matches Keith has been to doesn't change my opinion of this stupid banner one little bit.

 

I don't believe in pissing contest in general but when it comes to football, people who put time, effort and money into actually supporting the team deserve credit for that - I have no problem with anyone anywhere calling themselves a fan and supporting the team in spirit but to pretend they are the same level of fan as those who go to games is ridiculous imo.

 

 

 

Nowhere near as ridiculous as calling someone an "enemy of the club" because they disagree with you.

 

It wasn't primarily because you disagreed with me - it was because you implied that the banner could be used by "enemies" which I think is bollocks and leading on from that I think people who support Ashley as fully as I get the impression you do are in my opinion just as much enemies of the club as nebulous media or fans of other clubs.

 

 

 

You're like a hysterical old wife, man.

 

you can't identify with people who have genuine emotion for the club can you ?

 

 

[fredbob]

Mike ashley invested Millions of his own money into the club and like Keith, may make a few bob out of it. Dont see anyone dredging the shit out of his arse.

 

Actually, according to some thats not true, but you get my point.

 

Only relevant if Ashley sells at a loss imo.

 

 

 

Cant see him selling at a profit at the minute. Not a fair comparison anyway as Ashley's only been around 18 months.

 

Its funny like but Ashley gave 80% of Newcastle fans exactly what they wanted, 1. He got rid of Shepherd 2. He (apparently) introduced some sense into the business operations that people complained about under Shepherd and 3. He brought King Kev back and gave SJP the opportunity to sing EIEIEIO one more time (which most would never have expected).

 

We dont know why things fucked up over the summer but if it turns out Kev was playing silly buggers i'll feel sorry for him in a lot of ways. If you took a wishlist from 2005/6, am sure a lot of what went on up till sept 2nd was in line with what people wanted, apart from a missing 20m worth of investment and again we dont know why that didnt happen either.

 

Maybe i'm being too circumspect.

 

Maybe they only thought thats what they wanted ie anybody but the fat bastard and all of that ?

 

Some should have known better though.

 

 

The fan's expectations were developed over the 90s and they expected it to be the norm to be competing at the top and in Europe every year. When we were subsequently in mid table the frustrations of the fans were taken out on the board, a position i never agreed with as i could see it was them that had given them the expectations in the first place!!

 

I think that those frustrations are still there and people want to take them out on someone else now. We need to step back and think about where we've been as a club, the state of the current financial world and maybe hold back from anymore discontent for now. These banners are getting us nowhere at the minute.

 

 

exactly right.

 

I agree the whole thing is now just so frustrating but there is nothing anybody can do but protest.

 

 

 

Do you not think that the fans understood this and gave them a hell of a lot more slack than other boards would get when they did mess up? I havent seen anything happen now which hasnt happned under the old board, yet they were given many chances to redeem themselves, unlike what is happening now, its a true mark of respect for what the old board achieved.

 

Its only you who doesnt see this and believe everyone hated the old board.

[NE5]

I was referring to NJS, but the number of matches Keith has been to doesn't change my opinion of this stupid banner one little bit.

 

I don't believe in pissing contest in general but when it comes to football, people who put time, effort and money into actually supporting the team deserve credit for that - I have no problem with anyone anywhere calling themselves a fan and supporting the team in spirit but to pretend they are the same level of fan as those who go to games is ridiculous imo.

 

 

 

Nowhere near as ridiculous as calling someone an "enemy of the club" because they disagree with you.

 

It wasn't primarily because you disagreed with me - it was because you implied that the banner could be used by "enemies" which I think is bollocks and leading on from that I think people who support Ashley as fully as I get the impression you do are in my opinion just as much enemies of the club as nebulous media or fans of other clubs.

 

 

 

How anyone can be labeled an enemy of the club because they support the present owner is strange to say the least. He may have upset Keegan he may have appointed Wise but he also probably saved the club from the financial Armageddon it was heading towards.

 

Ashley may not be right for Newcastle (personally I think he could be given a chance) But if he is not who is ?

While everyone carps on about how bad Ashley is, no one comes up with any tangible, realistic or specific alternative, just the usual abstract slavver - "someone who'll spend big" - "someone who'll back the manager" - "someone who we'll all love" etc etc.

Who is this person ?

Do we want Freddy and Doug back ?  Can we name the Russian oligarch, Saudi prince or Texan oil man who we want to head up NUFC ?

Or do we just continue to harp on about what went before and pile abuse on the only person who right now can ACTUALLY do something about NUFC.

 

 

I'm actually fairly sceptical of Ashley, but I'm still in wait-and-see mode, and I definitely think the way everyone decided Ashley was the devil incarnate five minutes after Keegan walked (or in NE5's case, five minutes after he bought the club) is pretty... hysterical.

 

unfortunately I was also right.

 

You should learn to look at things and judge them, instead of "waiting to see"

 

Then again, I wouldn't expect someone who wasn't interested in the club when they had a shite board to know one when they saw one in the first place

 

 

 

 

Sometime, NE5, you dont half come out with some shit.

 

Do you think about what you write or do you just go blind and let god do his thing?

 

no, I'm saying any old knacker can use hindsight.

 

 

[ChezGiven]

As HTT has already said, the banner is pretty harmless, its not that offensive and singling out cockneys is not going to upset that many people. Most London fans probably laugh at the banner. Thats not the point, its makes us look small-minded, has further damaged our reputation in the press and doesnt address the reality of the financial crisis in its continued assertion that the current owner should leave.

But NUFC supporters aren’t small minded. The opinion of people who get their knickers in a twist over a piss taking banner at a football match aren’t worth bothering with.

 

I don’t know Keith but he should be able to express his views without fear of harassment.

I'm not saying they are, i'm saying it makes us look small-minded, which is the impact its had in the press.

 

As for your second idea that he should be able to express his views without fear of harassment, what if those views are offensive, or what if those views are idiotic? Clearly just because you have a point of view doesnt make it vaild or worth expressing. I can think of some pretty offensive and idiotic points of view, because i have them they are valid???

 

I'd say that highlighting a regionalist separation between the north and south of England, when we play with French, Argentinean, Irish, Spanish and Nigerian players makes us look like f***ing bell-ends.

Yes it makes us look small minded in the eyes of people who really are small minded. People with a modicum of intelligence are unlikely to jump to sweeping conclusions about NUFC supporters because they see two blokes with a cockney mafia out banner on the TV, unless of course they already have an anti NUFC agenda.

 

Are you opposed to the chants we sing inside the ground that that include the word Geordie? They do after all highlight a regionalist separation between the north and south of England.

 

We sing "we hate cockneys" when we play in London, we dont stick it on a 20 foot high banner and parade it around the away end.

[Guest fading star]

So why doesn’t singing we hate cockney’s make us look like ‘f****ing bell-ends?'

[ChezGiven]

You cant see the difference? Do you think people would react differently to a massive banner saying 'we hate cockneys'? I do.

[Guest fading star]

No I can’t see the difference. Words generally mean the same thing whether their written down or chanted. If anything ‘we hate cockneys’ is less PC as it generalises, whereas cockney mafia out just targets London’s criminal element. 

 

Your position is very inconsistent. You’re not JK are you? 

[Guest Keith Barrett]

Just reading throught the posts since last on, in a quieter moment, I've had a bit on my mind this week! Answers to a couple of the questions asked. Indie, I would love to be able to take the big flag to the match at the weekend, or someone else, re present circumstances, but, as soon as John Hall gained control of the club it was banned straight away from the ground, also we took it to Barcelona the first game on a charter flight I had on, the flight was full of ticketless fans as at the time if you did not travel with the club you did not get a match ticket, my flight was full because it was nearly half the price of the club travel, and when tickets were not forthcoming I confronted John Hall/Douglas/Freddie Fletcher outside the stadium and me and the lads dumped it on the pavement outside the Nou Camp in disgust as a form of protest at the treatment we recieved. A bit daft really, but you may have noticed i'm prone to a bit of daftness now and again. I did write a more detailed explanation in The Mag a few years ag entitled, 'The Day The Big Flag Died'.

 

Ozzie, comment from 'the chump', I was not trying to infer I was better fan then anyone else by mentioning my time I had spent following The Toon or matches missed, it was merely a bit of background about me.

 

Luca Alteri, you are right about my behaviour at Hull. Hav'nt done to bad in the past though.

 

Fading Star, 'Mafia' might have been a good choice of word considering the criminal way in which Ashley is running the club.

 

To those suggesting I cost the team a goal or points at home against Hull, I was'nt actually playing that day, when I did play I was always taught to keep my eye on the ball. Also, the truth of it is, and I do try to be honest, when me and my Dad and Paul got the banner out that day, our intention was only to stand at the front of the East stand with it, but as we walked down with it, I was going to say everyone, but after being on here obviously not, start to stand and applaud so we moved around as the fans stood up.

 

Regards,

 

Keith Barrett

 

 

[indi]

Just reading throught the posts since last on, in a quieter moment, I've had a bit on my mind this week! Answers to a couple of the questions asked. Indie, I would love to be able to take the big flag to the match at the weekend, or someone else, re present circumstances, but, as soon as John Hall gained control of the club it was banned straight away from the ground, also we took it to Barcelona the first game on a charter flight I had on, the flight was full of ticketless fans as at the time if you did not travel with the club you did not get a match ticket, my flight was full because it was nearly half the price of the club travel, and when tickets were not forthcoming I confronted John Hall/Douglas/Freddie Fletcher outside the stadium and me and the lads dumped it on the pavement outside the Nou Camp in disgust as a form of protest at the treatment we recieved. A bit daft really, but you may have noticed i'm prone to a bit of daftness now and again. I did write a more detailed explanation in The Mag a few years ag entitled, 'The Day The Big Flag Died'.

 

Ozzie, comment from 'the chump', I was not trying to infer I was better fan then anyone else by mentioning my time I had spent following The Toon or matches missed, it was merely a bit of background about me.

 

Luca Alteri, you are right about my behaviour at Hull. Hav'nt done to bad in the past though.

 

Fading Star, 'Mafia' might have been a good choice of word considering the criminal way in which Ashley is running the club.

 

To those suggesting I cost the team a goal or points at home against Hull, I was'nt actually playing that day, when I did play I was always taught to keep my eye on the ball. Also, the truth of it is, and I do try to be honest, when me and my Dad and Paul got the banner out that day, our intention was only to stand at the front of the East stand with it, but as we walked down with it, I was going to say everyone, but after being on here obviously not, start to stand and applaud so we moved around as the fans stood up.

 

Regards,

 

Keith Barrett

 

 

 

That's a real shame about the big flag, I reckon something like that would be just what's needed at the moment, there's far too much infighting going on, the club's tearing itself apart and it's the people who should/do care about it the most who are (unintentionally) doing the greatest damage. It really depresses me. The re-appearance of something like your flag could give people a lift and get us all back to doing what we do best; supporting NUFC. This brings me onto the other point about the Hull game, the crowd does have an effect on what happens on the pitch, we all know this, otherwise why do we shout and scream, chant and sing? Why are away matches generally considered harder to win than home games? I'm not saying that you cost us a goal or points on your own, but I think what happened in the crowd certainly contributed to that amongst many other things. I accept that it wasn't your intention to parade the banner around the ground and you probably never expected the scale of the reaction you got, but I still say it was a mistake to do it whilst the players were on the pitch. Yeah, they should be professionals and be able to concentrate on the game regardless, they should have a spine and not bottle it at the first little thing, but we all know that the majority of footballers aren't like that now - particularly the ones in our squad. They're spineless little scumbags in the main, who are more bothered about their cars, how many women they can shag at the same time and most importantly, how much money they're on. It's a shit situation, but unfortunately that's how it is and there's little chance of it changing anytime soon. Those are the people who go out on the pitch each week and "try" to get us what we crave - goals, points, wins, good football, etc - so for our own benefit we need to make it as easy for them to do that as possible. We don't care about them, they don't care about us or the club, but we do and that's the reason we need to stop what's happening now and get on with trying to make/allow this club to be as good as it possibly can be. Keegan's gone, Ashley remains, that's how it is. Unless anyone can change that - for the better mind you - then I suggest we start trying to make the best of a bad situation, before it gets any worse - because it can get a lot worse.

[NJS]

As a small point it was 1-0 to Hull when the flag was paraded.

 

 

[Mick]

As a small point it was 1-0 to Hull when the flag was paraded.

 

 

 

And it was 2-0 to Hull within minutes of the banner being paraded, not that I think it was to blame for that goal.

[Guest TheKingOfNewcastle]

Anyone who thinks the banner got us beat that day needs their head examining. A far more realistic explanation is the fact that a shit set of players were demoralised following the exit of Keegan. A hangover that lasted until the Everton game.

[ChezGiven]

No I can’t see the difference. Words generally mean the same thing whether their written down or chanted. If anything ‘we hate cockneys’ is less PC as it generalises, whereas cockney mafia out just targets London’s criminal element. 

 

Your position is very inconsistent. You’re not JK are you? 

 

I brought up the 'we hate cockneys' chant to highlight the difference between a terrace chant, which are on the whole just a laugh and part of the game and erecting a banner. The banner is a statement, a nailing of colours to the mast, a definitive expression of opinion. If you qualitatively cant see the difference then i'm not surprised you dont understand how it gives the press more amunition to take the piss.

 

According to you then, since words are words, when we next play in London, we could take a 30 ft high banner with 'we hate cockneys' written on it and it would gain the same reaction as the chant? Uttter fucking bollocks.

[OzzieMandias]

 

Ozzie, comment from 'the chump', I was not trying to infer I was better fan then anyone else by mentioning my time I had spent following The Toon or matches missed, it was merely a bit of background about me.

 

 

Fair enough.

[Big Geordie]

Anyone who thinks the banner got us beat that day needs their head examining. A far more realistic explanation is the fact that a s*** set of players were demoralised following the exit of Keegan. A hangover that lasted until the Everton game.

 

This.

[Guest Brummiemag]

I agree with the banner and want Ashley and Wise out of this club

 

Well done Keith, your a true fan, I respect you and I hope your ban is lifted ASAP 

[Syrette]

Well done Keith, your a true fan, I respect you and I hope your ban is lifted ASAP 

 

Hold on - he didn't get banned because of the banner, he got banned for physically assaulting someone. Is that allowed now, because he's a "true fan"?

 

I guess that makes us that don't agree with everything he says 'false', then?

[Guest Brummiemag]

Well done Keith, your a true fan, I respect you and I hope your ban is lifted ASAP 

 

Hold on - he didn't get banned because of the banner, he got banned for physically assaulting someone. Is that allowed now, because he's a "true fan"?

 

I guess that makes us that don't agree with everything he says 'false', then?

 

I meant well done for making a stand against Ashley, not for punching someone. He shouldnt have punched the bloke even though he was being verbally abused.  I hope the ban is lifted though because we need fans like Keith.

[Guest bertiemasson]

Just reading throught the posts since last on, in a quieter moment, I've had a bit on my mind this week! Answers to a couple of the questions asked. Indie, I would love to be able to take the big flag to the match at the weekend, or someone else, re present circumstances, but, as soon as John Hall gained control of the club it was banned straight away from the ground, also we took it to Barcelona the first game on a charter flight I had on, the flight was full of ticketless fans as at the time if you did not travel with the club you did not get a match ticket, my flight was full because it was nearly half the price of the club travel, and when tickets were not forthcoming I confronted John Hall/Douglas/Freddie Fletcher outside the stadium and me and the lads dumped it on the pavement outside the Nou Camp in disgust as a form of protest at the treatment we recieved. A bit daft really, but you may have noticed i'm prone to a bit of daftness now and again. I did write a more detailed explanation in The Mag a few years ag entitled, 'The Day The Big Flag Died'.

 

Ozzie, comment from 'the chump', I was not trying to infer I was better fan then anyone else by mentioning my time I had spent following The Toon or matches missed, it was merely a bit of background about me.

 

Luca Alteri, you are right about my behaviour at Hull. Hav'nt done to bad in the past though.

 

Fading Star, 'Mafia' might have been a good choice of word considering the criminal way in which Ashley is running the club.

 

To those suggesting I cost the team a goal or points at home against Hull, I was'nt actually playing that day, when I did play I was always taught to keep my eye on the ball. Also, the truth of it is, and I do try to be honest, when me and my Dad and Paul got the banner out that day, our intention was only to stand at the front of the East stand with it, but as we walked down with it, I was going to say everyone, but after being on here obviously not, start to stand and applaud so we moved around as the fans stood up.

 

Regards,

 

Keith Barrett

 

 

 

People should be applauded for their honest thoughts and not called tools / knobs etc just shows how fckin stupid and immature some of our fickle fans are.

 

well done Keith!

 

 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

The banner just makes us look thick as mince and won't achieve anything. Supporters should concentrate on supporting the team to get them through the match at hand.