U23s & Academy

[Guest ObiChrisKenobi]

Happy people have enjoyed the read, thank you.

 

 

[Guest palnese]

Fantastic post that!

[Tooj]

I've said a number of times that improvements to the training ground and academy facilities were made with some of the money from the Andy Carroll sale. Yet, because its not an instant gain/improvement to the first team squad people balk at the idea. Sure a bore hole isn't going to score us goals, but it will save the club a load of money in the long run, its long term planning. Likewise the undersoil heating at the training facitilies, no one cares about it now, but come Winter when we're still training and can go largely unaffected by bad weather...

 

The academy facilities are almost identical to the first team setup, its very impressive, and when the Elite Player Performance Plan (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/premier-league/8276220/Premier-League-plot-a-youth-revolution-in-English-football.html) comes into play (if it does), Newcastle should be in line for a decent grade, better long term funding, and greater benefits (money/grants and quality of player) due to the investment.

 

These are basic things a club of our stature should have had for a long, long time. Don't know about anyone else, but how many years have people sat there and envied 'Boro, recently Sunderland, certainly Man U, Everton and West Ham as they seemingly managed to produce 2-3 Premier League sufficient, at least, calibre of players to put into their squads. Homegrown talent. Local lads.

 

When you look over the list of 'notable' players that Newcastle has managed to produce in the last decade or so (going off League debut), its not really stellar (no offence to any of the players listed!):

 

2011: Michael Richardson+

2010: Shane Ferguson, Haris Vuckic, Sammy Ameobi, Phil Airey+, James Tavernier+, Jóan Símun Edmundsson*+

2009: Ryan Donladson, Matthew Grieves+ (NL), Nile Ranger*,

2008: Tamás Kadar*, Ben Tozer*+ (L2), Wesley Ngo Baheng* (Non), Fraser Forster+ (SPL),

2007: Kazenga LuaLua, James Troisi+ (TUR),

2006: Ben Smith+ (L2), Tim Krul*, Paul Huntington (L1), Andy Carroll (EPL),

2005: David Edgar (CH), Matty Pattison (SAF), Daryl Smylie+ (SWE),

2004: Peter Ramage (CH), Martin Brittain (BSP), Lewis Guy+ (L2/L1), Charles N'Zogbia* (EPL), Alan O'Brien (L1),

2003: Neale McDermott+ (Malta), Calvin Zola+ (L2), Phil Cave+ (BSN), Steven Taylor, Tomi Ameobi+ (Ice),

2002: Adam Collin+ (L1), Richard Offiong+ (Aus), David Cowen+ (Scot), Joe Kendrick+ (BSP), Bradley Orr*+ (EPL),

2001: Gary Caldwell*+ (EPL), Adam Rundle+ (BSP), Brian Kerr (Scot),

2000: Michael Chopra (CH),

 

*Bought from another club

+League Debut with another club

(Current League Level)

Players in Bold have played in the Premier League

 

Players Lost to other Academies:

 

Adam Johnson (Boro)

Michael Carrick (West Ham)

Jack Colback (Sunderland)

Liam Nobles (Sunderland)

Louis Laing (Sunderland)

 

Most of this is off the top of my head, so by no means is it comprehensive, or even entirely accurate (for 6am in the morning). So we've managed to produce 15 or so players that have played in the Premier league since 2000.

Is this good, is this poor?

Of the 15 8 are currently still playing in the Premier League.

Of the 8 5 have made more than 10 appearances in the Premier League.

 

If you look at the 10 years before 2000:

 

Lee Clark

Steve Watson

Steve Harper

Steven Taylor

Steve Howey

Steve Caldwell

Robbie Elliott

Aaron Hughes

Jamie McClen

Shola Ameobi

Matty Appleby

Alan Neilson

 

12 Players who played more than 10 games in the Premier League

 

James Coppinger

Paul Arnison

Stuart Elliott

Alun Armstrong

Paul Brayson

Stuart Green

 

6 Players that managed  a decent career at various levels.

 

Obviously the Premier League has evolved a lot since the 90s, so you could argue its harder for younger talent to break into a side, but still, we've produced half as many Premier League 'quality' players since the 90s (at least from this off the top of my head list). Its entirely possible that an in depth look (which time and resources I'm lacking at the moment) will show a different picture - could be better, could be worse. Certainly, think it could be worse, if I was to try and include every player that has passed through the Newcastle Academy since 2000, with most of them ending up out of football, or Northern League (though that's to be expected and is the same across the country).

 

If I was to try and compare it to another club, say Boro and Sunderland, again, we might look better or worse. Though off the top of my head I feel like Boro have produced more Premier League players than Newcastle.

 

Currently the club has more youth coaches than its ever had, coaches with a high degree of coaching experience and qualifications. They've actively tried to recruit proven Youth Coaches that have helped other clubs produce a successful youth team (Willie Donachie - Man City, Frankie Bunn - Man City, and if rumours are true Ricky Sbraga - Sunderland). We have one of the most highly regarded young youth coaches in the North-East in Liam Bramley coaching our U16 squad, which in 2010 managed to get into the World Nike Cup for the first time in the club's history. In the process Adam Campbell was voted the MVP, which isn't something to be dismissed.

 

They've finally, after several years of inactivity, started to take an interest in Grassroots football again (could be a coincidence this is happening under Mike Ashley's reign). We're actively recruiting and scouting at youth level again. Maybe even for the first time. I believe that's largely down to a stable structure, and a scouting network setup by Tony Jimenez & Jeff Vetere, who have a proven history of setting up good youth policies and structures.

Its also the first time a long time we've had a stable structure at the Academy level with Joe Joyce overseeing the Academy since 2006. The last time we had anyone in his position for so long was in the late 90s and Early 00's when we arguably produced our best home grown talent (Taylor, Shola, Chopra, Hughes etc), until recently, with Alan Irvine in charge of the Academy.

 

So, it looks like we've finally caught up on years of constant change at Academy Level. When Irvine left Kenny Wharton, John Carver & Glenn Roeder switched as Head of the Academy (all of which coincided with a change of 1st team manager). The Academy seems to now by an autonomous set up immune to 1st team management changes, which is a good thing, however, its still working closely, if not as close as its ever been, with the first team, due to the introduction of a Reserve/Development squad (looked after by Peter Beardsley). The Development squad is the first time, as far as I can ever remember, where Newcastle have kept a pool of players after the Academy to allow the younger talent to keep developing (rather than cutting ties at 18). Man U have done this for years, with '21' being the cut off age for most of their talent - if they haven't made the grade by then they're sold on or released (often sold on for a fair bit of profit). This only makes sense, considering the new Premier League squad registration rules that allow for U21s to play without being registered. Also financially it makes sense too, since Newcastle can claim compensation for their time and resources for any players that leave the club to join another before their 21st Birthday (as long as they haven't been released).

 

I'm not entirely sure what my point is with this post, I just feel that the time and efforts that the club have put into the Academy (and Development Squad which I group together) often go overlooked and unappreciated. We're trying. For the first time in a decade we're actually seeing some sort of result from the Academy, yet little notice is paid as people would prefer to worry about money from a transfer, and instant rewards to the first team. Whereas years ago it would have been us spending £15m-£35m to bring in talent to the first team to fruitlessly fight to fit into the Top 4 of the league.

We sold a locally produced player for £35m - a transfer record for a British player. A player that could have been on Sunderland's books, but was swayed to join the Newcastle Academy -possibly because he loves the club (though that hasn't stopped others joining Boro or Sunderland). But we might not have even been in the position to have produced a player to sell for £35m (all Jan Transfer window factors aside).

 

Genuinely optimistic about the club, despite what might or might not be happening with the first team. Alan Pardew, for whatever reason, is utilising and taking advantage of the youth players coming through into the development squad, we haven't had a manager like that since Bobby Robson (not saying the two are same or even comparable just pointing out how long its been).

Just look at the player threads for Shane Ferguson, Haris Vuckic and Sammy Ameobi (obviously Nile Ranger too), for how daft some of the posts might be in them, at least people are happy/hysterical, dare I suggest, cautiously optimistic about the young players.

 

We haven't had that for a LONG time.

 

Ask binnsy, or anyone else who goes to watch the Development/Youth team regularly (or even start at page 1 of this thread and work your way through) and they'll tell you how impressive the 2009-2010 youth team were. Not only were they Quarter Finalists in the FA Youth Cup (the furthest Newcastle have managed since the 80s), but their football was fantastic too. There's a good batch of footballers in that group. Its no coincidence that a handful of them are now in and around the First Team.

They might not become world beaters, but right now its a bit of hope, a bit of excitement for us as fans. I can only imagine what it might be like for other players in the Development Squad to see their team mates and peers get a chance in the First Team. If they have any sense about them that's one huge incentive - there is a door, it is open, put your foot in it and show them what you can do.

 

Last Saturday we beat Chelsea 4-3 in the U18s league. OK, that might not mean anything, but to me that's a bit of hope. Chelsea, arguably, have one of the best Youth Setups in England, and have ploughed millions into its development over the last 5 years or so.

 

Fantastic post.

 

Btw - I'd love it if perhaps you maybe wrote an article, not necessarily for the board, but about the whole academy system, why we've missed out on our players over the years, and what you expect from the future, not just Newcastle wise, but of England as a whole. One of my pals coaches some kids at Seaton Burn, and he said the standard of youngsters coming through from this generation, are a lot better footballing wise, than in previous generations. Which in his opinion is down to the change in coaching ethos, about how winning isn't the only thing, and kids are spending a lot more time practicing basic technical skills, and it's not just about how big you are anymore.

[thenige]

Always read this thread last as it's always the one least likely to be filled with doomongering, great stuff Chris and wholeheartedly agree that finally we're in a strong position to bring through prospects which in the long run can only be a good thing.

[Tooj]

Does this also meant that on FM2012 our youth facilities are going to be mint?

[Guest ObiChrisKenobi]

Does this also meant that on FM2012 our youth facilities are going to be mint?

 

Shh man, cannit talk about FM12 when The Brock is on prowl.  

 

Fantastic post.

 

Btw - I'd love it if perhaps you maybe wrote an article, not necessarily for the board, but about the whole academy system, why we've missed out on our players over the years, and what you expect from the future, not just Newcastle wise, but of England as a whole. One of my pals coaches some kids at Seaton Burn, and he said the standard of youngsters coming through from this generation, are a lot better footballing wise, than in previous generations. Which in his opinion is down to the change in coaching ethos, about how winning isn't the only thing, and kids are spending a lot more time practicing basic technical skills, and it's not just about how big you are anymore.

 

Fully agree with him, I mean I can't speak for all community/boy's clubs in the area, but I know a few have 'nursery' groups now for 5-7 year olds now, where they basically just have a ball for an hour and learn how to 'look after it' (kick it, control it, dribble, etc). So most of the ground work has been done by the time they come into development teams and eventually Mini-Soccer.

[Tooj]

Do you coach any kids teams btw OCK?

[Guest icemanblue]

Shit post, like. Proper shit. It was geet boring, and the formatting was garbage.

 

Balance.

[Guest ObiChrisKenobi]

Do you coach any kids teams btw OCK?

 

U8's-U12's

 

Prefer Mini-Soccer format, think 9v9 will be a good introduction.

[Tooj]

Do you coach any kids teams btw OCK?

 

U8's-U12's

 

Prefer Mini-Soccer format, think 9v9 will be a good introduction.

 

You might have came across my mate then.

[Guest ObiChrisKenobi]

Do you coach any kids teams btw OCK?

 

U8's-U12's

 

Prefer Mini-Soccer format, think 9v9 will be a good introduction.

 

You might have came across my mate then.

 

Maybe! Depends what league he's in.

[ponsaelius]

Kinky post that like, very much enjoyed reading 

[High Five o]

Brilliant read Chris.

Thanks, very good info there.

[aussiemag]

Agreed positive stuff on here for once

[Guest geoffasenna]

Darnel Situ set to sign for £250,000 plus future add ons. good signing if he devlopes like his reputation. No word on the other lad.

[AlanSkÃrare]

Darnel Situ set to sign for £250,000 plus future add ons. good signing if he devlopes like his reputation. No word on the other lad.

 

According to?

[taxfree]

Darnel Situ set to sign for £250,000 plus future add ons. good signing if he devlopes like his reputation. No word on the other lad.

 

According to?

 

Douglas.

 

No wonder we took our time with a fee involved. Reckon Remy won't sign seeing as he's not mentioned.

[Guest MrSundlofer]

Darnel Situ set to sign for £250,000 plus future add ons. good signing if he devlopes like his reputation. No word on the other lad.

 

According to?

 

The Journal I think.

[oldtype]

Excellent news. Good prospect by all accounts and gives us an option for fourth choice cb

[ponsaelius]

Mehdi Abeid and Darnel Situ both start for France on my FM in 2018.

 

Cissokho and Roux on the bench.

[Guest Slarth]

Mehdi Abeid and Darnel Situ both start for France on my FM in 2018.

 

Cissokho and Roux on the bench.

 

Going at this rate we'll have most of the youngsters in France in our youth squad.

[Geordie Ahmed]

U18's lost yesterday, 2-1 away to Villa

 

Adam Campbell scoring our goal

[Stu]

Fantastic post that!

 

This I've also been quite impressed with the movement for foreign youngsters, even if it's a couple of Zamblera's for every Vuckic - at least we're appealing to these youngsters. Krul came here when he was v v young and pretty much grew up in Gosforth (IIRC) so now he feels 'at home' - he's a brilliant example for us to use for any other promising youngsters: come to Newcastle and you can not only be first choice for the club, but play for the number 1 team in the world

 

 

Frazzle - not sure why you seemed to want to pin OCK down to a pro/anti Ashley stance. It's a good observational piece about the youth set-up, something that has occurred under Ashley's ownership.

 

Whether or not we will be ultimately successful - i.e. producing one or two Premier League quality players each season, maybe an international quality player every 3/4 years - will not be down to Ashley, but at least he's seen the commercial sense (if little else) in putting the money back into the youth system so NUFC can compete with the mackems and smoggies for local talent.

 

 

[Revolution Number 9]

Always had a big hang up over how bad our youth system seemed to be, so that was reassuring reading

[Doug]

U18's lost yesterday, 2-1 away to Villa

 

Adam Campbell scoring our goal

I watched the first half before the teeming rain got the better of me. We were winning 1-0 and could have had 2 or 3 in the first half. We looked far the better side and played patient controlled football from the back. I am surprised we lost. The team line ups must have been changed a bit after half time. The little no.7 and the centre backs looked very good for us I thought.