Kimbo Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Hoddle wants Gerrard and Lampard in midfield. He was literally begging Gerrard on ITV not to retire, his argument was "look at Pirlo, how old is he". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Hodgson > nearly everyone else for a development role though. Don't think he's done that badly, just think we're not good enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toondave Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 The idea that a foreigner shouldn't manage a country's national team is almost as much of an anachronism as international football itself. What does this even mean? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Probably a stale Greggs but: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 The idea that a foreigner shouldn't manage a country's national team is almost as much of an anachronism as international football itself. What does this even mean? The idea that foreigners shouldn't manage a country's national team is dated, and international football itself, as much as I love it, is probably a bit dated as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 I thought this was a good read, and relevant to the current discussion: http://www.espnfc.us/blog/tactics-and-analysis/67/post/1901941/michael-cox-the-nuances-of-managing-clubs-vs-national-teams Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toondave Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 The idea that a foreigner shouldn't manage a country's national team is almost as much of an anachronism as international football itself. What does this even mean? The idea that foreigners shouldn't manage a country's national team is dated, and international football itself, as much as I love it, is probably a bit dated as well. I know what an anachronism is, and I agree somewhat with the first part I'm just wondering how and why you think international football is dated? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TruToon94 Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Wish Stevie G would should up. "Need a holiday!", Well he's got an early one considering we pretty much went out due to his errors. Good riddance to bad rubbish soon hopefully. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Americans don't understand international sports, ignore him Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 The idea that a foreigner shouldn't manage a country's national team is almost as much of an anachronism as international football itself. What does this even mean? The idea that foreigners shouldn't manage a country's national team is dated, and international football itself, as much as I love it, is probably a bit dated as well. I know what an anachronism is, and I agree somewhat with the first part I'm just wondering how and why you think international football is dated? International football had its heyday when footballers, for the most part, played their club football in their own countries. If you were an English footballer, you only got to play against Brazilians once every 4 years, for example. Maybe it's not accurate for me to say international football is totally an anachronism, because it's arguably more popular in many countries than club football is, especially outside Europe. The World Cup is still the greatest sporting competition in the world, bar none. And I still love international football. The U.S. is my favorite team, which has a lot to do with the fact that I never had a local club team to identify with. So the only sense of identity I had as a football fan was with my national team. I'm a fan of Newcastle, but that's something that's really only become possible (i.e. a foreigner with no connection to the city or club becoming a fan) within the past 20 years or so. And I'll never have the connection to the club that people who've grown-up in Newcastle have with it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbo Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 I used to think international football was dated, but the more financial inequality increases in club football, with teams that can spend £100m in a window "competing" with clubs that can spend nothing, and with clubs actually being owned by states, the more I see international football as the true competition. It's a test of long term planning and team spirit. It's just a shame FIFA are cunts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Deuce is right like, foreign fans like him are pure scum that only dampen the chances of their own national team through lack of interest and investment in the product whilst ruining the league the follow as it gets an inflated sense of self worth and due to said interest money driven attitudes from weak FAs take over to the detriment of the overall game Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 I used to think international football was dated, but the more financial inequality increases in club football, with teams that can spend £100m in a window "competing" with clubs that can spend nothing, and with clubs actually being owned by states, the more I see international football as the true competition. It's a test of long term planning and team spirit. It's just a shame FIFA are cunts. Good way of looking at it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.S.R. Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Hoddle wants Gerrard and Lampard in midfield. He was literally begging Gerrard on ITV not to retire, his argument was "look at Pirlo, how old is he". I saw that and wondered how a in couple more years Gerrard would magically transform into Pirlo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Hoddle wants Gerrard and Lampard in midfield. He was literally begging Gerrard on ITV not to retire, his argument was "look at Pirlo, how old is he". I saw that and wondered how a in couple more years Gerrard would magically transform into Pirlo. I saw that too. Bearing in mind he ended Gazza's international career with no pomp and ceremony, I wouldn't read too much into it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Lineker's little video blog was great/brutal!: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27960776 [/don't know if Giggs] Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Spain, Germany, Italy, Netherlands, France - none of these countries would entertain the idea of a foreign coach, and none have had one for a very long time. I don't think England should be any different in that approach personally, given our resources and the strength of our domestic competition. Doing otherwise is a tacit acceptance that our coaching isn't good enough, not something I'd want to be doing ideally. Think as a nation, we would go a long way if we just admitted we are a genuine second-rate footballing nation. We have won 1 knockout round of international football since 2006. We need to find a way to get on their level - not trying to compare ourselves. We need to focus on getting the coaching right out grassroots, the academies, the reserves/B teams etc. The level of talent we have compared to those teams is embarrassing. When we accept we are second-rate and in need of a re-build, having a foreign manager becomes an option. An option I wouldn't take but one all second-rate international football teams must consider. We are more Chile, than the Netherlands. Also the strength of our club team is 99% dependant on foreign players. It's a null point. Netherlands & France have had second-rate club competitions for a long period now. A skinny guy trying to train like his experienced bodybuilder friend isn't going to make the necessary gains. We are in a much earlier development stage i'm afraid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Lineker's little video blog was great/brutal!: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27960776 [/don't know if Giggs] This is why match of the day is annoying, Linekar is a far better pundit than anyone they get in and he's shackled presenting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 I see that Gerrard is undecided on his future. What you need is a manager who will decide his future for him. JK didn't wait for Landycakes to call it a day, neither should Hodgson wait for Gerrard's decision. Speaks negatively of the man that he hasn't called it a day already. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Think as a nation, we would go a long way if we just admitted we are a genuine second-rate footballing nation. We have won 1 knockout round of international football since 2006. It's actually 1 since 2002. 2 since 1996. Ecuador and Denmark. Second rate is generous. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 I used to think international football was dated, but the more financial inequality increases in club football, with teams that can spend £100m in a window "competing" with clubs that can spend nothing, and with clubs actually being owned by states, the more I see international football as the true competition. It's a test of long term planning and team spirit. It's just a shame FIFA are c***s. Agreed. Globalism of football probably slightly benefits the less established countries than the bigger ones which is an advantage too. It's more competitive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Lineker's little video blog was great/brutal!: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27960776 [/don't know if Giggs] This is why match of the day is annoying, Linekar is a far better pundit than anyone they get in and he's shackled presenting. Yeah, I agree. It'd be interesting to hear him in a different role. Hard to disagree with anything he said in that blog. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicago_shearer Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Think as a nation, we would go a long way if we just admitted we are a genuine second-rate footballing nation. We have won 1 knockout round of international football since 2006. It's actually 1 since 2002. 2 since 1996. Ecuador and Denmark. Second rate is generous. Did anyone with half an interest in football not recognize that fact though? It's been at least a decade of talking down expectations, missing Euro 2008 etc. A poor qualifying campaign for this tournament. Lowering expectations was the relevant conversation after Euro 2000. I personally don't know anyone who didn't go into this tournament expecting any more than a QF appearance, and that was considered optimism. Quite a few "second-rate" or even third rate countries are on track for that target. The problem isn't that England didn't live up to lofty expectations. They didn't live up to fairly modest expectations, which I believe they had the talent already on-hand to meet. There's a deeper problem when it comes to character and performance under pressure. They stop enjoying themselves and this "we're not good enough - 40/50/60 years of hurt" BS takes over. It's football FFS. Other nations are enjoying themselves. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Baines and Oxlade kippered for the CR game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Think as a nation, we would go a long way if we just admitted we are a genuine second-rate footballing nation. We have won 1 knockout round of international football since 2006. It's actually 1 since 2002. 2 since 1996. Ecuador and Denmark. Second rate is generous. Did anyone with half an interest in football not recognize that fact though? It's been at least a decade of talking down expectations, missing Euro 2008 etc. A poor qualifying campaign for this tournament. Lowering expectations was the relevant conversation after Euro 2000. I personally don't know anyone who didn't go into this tournament expecting any more than a QF appearance, and that was considered optimism. Quite a few "second-rate" or even third rate countries are on track for that target. The problem isn't that England didn't live up to lofty expectations. They didn't live up to fairly modest expectations, which I believe they had the talent already on-hand to meet. There's a deeper problem when it comes to character and performance under pressure. They stop enjoying themselves and this "we're not good enough - 40/50/60 years of hurt" BS takes over. It's football FFS. Other nations are enjoying themselves. They haven't cobbled together a team and a new(ish) playing style for this tournament however. This is what I mentioned earlier. With the possible exception of Mexico, the other less established teams came to the tournament with better game plans. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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