Mike Williamson (now managing MK Dons)

[Beren]

[magorific]

Colo and Williamson both got raped at Bolton without Tiote in front of them and the anonymous midfield inviting pressure on them time and time again, but by all means continue to single out the player you have an agenda against to suit the purposes of your argument.

 

No agenda with me, just addressing the simple argument - which was started by other people on here - about whether Williamson or Taylor are the better player.

As you should well know, as an administrator, if there is an agenda concerning this subject on this foum, it's against Taylor, at least in part because so many have chosen to swallow the club's side of his contract "saga". That's the club run by liars.

I've made my point re Colo many times (check if you want): he's a fantastic talent - as good a footballing defender as I've seen anywhere - but can be found wanting when met with serious pace and power. Is he our No 1 centre-half? Undoubtedly, and Taylor would be well off realising he will never be half the footballer Colo is.

But, sorry, I won't turn a blind eye to Williamson's frailties, which have cost us goals and points against several teams other than Bolton, and - in my opinion - are more glaring than Taylor's.

Mine's an opinion - an opinion voiced in a thread entitled Mike Williamson.

If it was an agenda, I'd start off a whole new thread.

 

[Beren]

Colo and Williamson both got raped at Bolton without Tiote in front of them and the anonymous midfield inviting pressure on them time and time again, but by all means continue to single out the player you have an agenda against to suit the purposes of your argument.

 

No agenda with me, just addressing the simple argument - which was started by other people on here - about whether Williamson or Taylor are the better player.

As you should well know, as an administrator, if there is an agenda concerning this subject on this foum, it's against Taylor, at least in part because so many have chosen to swallow the club's side of his contract "saga". That's the club run by liars.

I've made my point re Colo many times (check if you want): he's a fantastic talent - as good a footballing defender as I've seen anywhere - but can be found wanting when met with serious pace and power. Is he our No 1 centre-half? Undoubtedly, and Taylor would be well off realising he will never be half the footballer Colo is.

But, sorry, I won't turn a blind eye to Williamson's frailties, which have cost us goals and points against several teams other than Bolton, and - in my opinion - are more glaring than Taylor's.

Mine's an opinion - an opinion voiced in a thread entitled Mike Williamson.

If it was an agenda, I'd start off a whole new thread.

 

 

Good post. Apologies for lumping you in with other posters who chime in with their rehashed restated boilerplate convictions irrespective of individual performances or, more egregiously, a series of individual performances.

 

My bad though, seriously - this thread is particularly weighed down by such posters, but I was wrong to assume you were one of them.

 

That said, I still can't agree with you about Williamson's shortcomings being more glaring than Taylor's. With so little evidence of Taylor's performance to go on from this season, I can see such a discussion becoming cyclical very quickly - but in the five full games Taylor played this season we conceded 10 goals. [i'm willing to accept that was his "come back" after a long time out, and much of it was paired alongside Sol Campbell against pretty decent opposition.]

 

As my parting shot though, I will say that Taylor at centre-back makes me nervous - he's a hothead, often cheats and doesn't look as an intelligent a player as Williamson - who I think is learning from Colo and showing progress. Perhaps by virtue of all his injuries/time out, Taylor doesn't look to have matured significantly as a defender in his time here. So, without trying to forcibly change your opinion, for these reasons and those stated above for me I'd definitely rank Williamson over Colo - and I'd rate him high enough (relative to a club of our standing) not to bring in another first-choice centre back this summer either.

 

The real world isn't fantasy football (Man City, Chelski etc aside) and realistically, even with a possible £35m war chest this summer - I'd much rather have the three or four signings we bring in be:

 

LB cover

CM 1st team

CM cover

CF 1st team

[Cajun]

I don't think we need two centre mids.

 

We already have Tiote, Nolan, Guthrie and Gosling. One more defensive minded player to cover Tiote should be enough.

[magorific]

Colo and Williamson both got raped at Bolton without Tiote in front of them and the anonymous midfield inviting pressure on them time and time again, but by all means continue to single out the player you have an agenda against to suit the purposes of your argument.

 

 

 

 

No agenda with me, just addressing the simple argument - which was started by other people on here - about whether Williamson or Taylor are the better player.

As you should well know, as an administrator, if there is an agenda concerning this subject on this foum, it's against Taylor, at least in part because so many have chosen to swallow the club's side of his contract "saga". That's the club run by liars.

I've made my point re Colo many times (check if you want): he's a fantastic talent - as good a footballing

 

 

 

defender as I've seen anywhere - but can be found wanting when met with serious pace and power. Is he our No 1 centre-half? Undoubtedly, and Taylor would be well off realising he will never be half the footballer Colo is.

But, sorry, I won't turn a blind eye to Williamson's frailties, which have cost us goals and points against several teams other than Bolton, and - in my opinion - are more glaring than Taylor's.

Mine's an opinion - an opinion voiced in a thread entitled Mike Williamson.

If it was an agenda, I'd start off a whole new thread.

 

 

Good post. Apologies for lumping you in with other posters who chime in with their rehashed restated

 

boilerplate convictions irrespective of individual performances or, more egregiously, a series of individual performances.

 

My bad though, seriously - this thread is particularly weighed down by such posters, but I was wrong to assume you were one of them.

 

 

 

 

That said, I still can't agree with you about Williamson's shortcomings being more glaring than Taylor's. With so little evidence of Taylor's performance to go on from this season, I can see such a discussion becoming cyclical very quickly - but in the five full games Taylor played this season we conceded 10 goals. [i'm willing to accept that was his "come back" after a long time out, and much of it was paired alongside Sol Campbell against pretty decent opposition.]

 

As my parting shot though, I will say that Taylor at centre-back makes me nervous - he's a hothead, often cheats and doesn't look as an intelligent a player as Williamson - who I think is learning from Colo and showing progress. Perhaps by virtue of all his injuries/time out, Taylor doesn't look to have matured significantly as a defender in his time here. So, without trying to forcibly change your opinion, for these

 

 

reasons and those stated above for me I'd definitely rank Williamson over Colo - and I'd rate him high enough (relative to a club of our standing) not to bring in another first-choice centre back this summer either.

 

The real world isn't fantasy football (Man City, Chelski etc aside) and realistically, even with a possible £35m war chest this summer - I'd much rather have the three or four signings we bring in be:

 

LB cover

CM 1st team

CM cover

CF 1st team

 

Prior to the last couple of months, I'd have happily seen Taylor come back in at right-back, as I think he's a solid bet there. But Simpson has more than earned his place now.

Personally, I'd love to see us buy a top-class centre-back. Gary Cahill or Hangeland would be great, but

that's fantasy stuff.

[Mick]

I don't think we need two centre mids.

 

We already have Tiote, Nolan, Guthrie and Gosling. One more defensive minded player to cover Tiote should be enough.

 

An upgrade on Nolan would help the team move on more than cover for Tiote would.

[Cajun]

Gosling might be that player?

 

I'm not even anti-Nolan anyway, he is more than adequate imo and we need to fill other positions before looking to replace him.

[TRon]

There's not much to choose between Taylor and Williamson tbh. Taylor is probably a bit stronger and better able to stand up to a battering, but Williamson reads the game better. Taylor and Colo as a pair used to look all at seas but they have done well this season as a pair, so for me it's whoever has the shirt and has earned it...which is Williamson for now.

[Mick]

Gosling might be that player?

 

I'm not even anti-Nolan anyway, he is more than adequate imo and we need to fill other positions before looking to replace him.

 

Apart from a forward, I'd say a Nolan replacement should be next on the wishlist.

[TRon]

Gosling might be that player?

 

I'm not even anti-Nolan anyway, he is more than adequate imo and we need to fill other positions before looking to replace him.

 

He's adequate for this season. If we want to be the team we can be we'll need to get someone else in that position next season whether it's Gosling, Vukic or a new signing. Or maybe even Barton.

[Cajun]

Gosling might be that player?

 

I'm not even anti-Nolan anyway, he is more than adequate imo and we need to fill other positions before looking to replace him.

 

He's adequate for this season. If we want to be the team we can be we'll need to get someone else in that position next season whether it's Gosling, Vukic or a new signing. Or maybe even Barton.

 

I would sign two forwards, a left winger, back up right winger, back up left back, back up right back, a quality centre back and someone to back up Tiote before thinking about replacing Nolan.

 

I am all for progressing and improving on the players we have but we need to fill gaps first.

 

If Nolan was crocked we should have someone (Guthrie or Gosling) to step in his place.

 

We would really struggle to fill the place of Barton, Enrique, Colo, Simpson, Tiote, Ben Arfa (currently being filled by Loven who will be older). Even Jonas who I am not a big fan of is a big miss at the moment simply because we only have a mostly untested kid in reserve.

 

 

 

 

[TRon]

Gosling might be that player?

 

I'm not even anti-Nolan anyway, he is more than adequate imo and we need to fill other positions before looking to replace him.

 

He's adequate for this season. If we want to be the team we can be we'll need to get someone else in that position next season whether it's Gosling, Vukic or a new signing. Or maybe even Barton.

 

I would sign two forwards, a left winger, back up right winger, back up left back, back up right back, a quality centre back and someone to back up Tiote before thinking about replacing Nolan.

 

I am all for progressing and improving on the players we have but we need to fill gaps first.

 

If Nolan was crocked we should have someone (Guthrie or Gosling) to step in his place.

 

We would really struggle to fill the place of Barton, Enrique, Colo, Simpson, Tiote, Ben Arfa (currently being filled by Loven who will be older). Even Jonas who I am not a big fan of is a big miss at the moment simply because we only have a mostly untested kid in reserve.

 

 

 

 

 

Tiote can be covered by Guthrie, Barton by Ireland if he stays, Simpson by Perch and Jonas by Ben Arfa or Marveaux if the rumours are true he's coming here next season. I would say Nolan's position is probably a key weakness in that for most teams it's the hub of the pass and move mantra. Not so much for long ball teams though, in which case he'd be a very strong player.

[Cajun]

I just have a very different opinion. Guthrie covering Tiote or Perch covering Simpson long term would be a disaster imo.

 

Ben Arfa could cover Jonas but then we are a striker short meaning someone like Loven coming in.

 

The rest are signing we haven't made yet which kind of backs up my point that we need to sign players in other areas before replacing Nolan.

[JH]

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

[Stu]

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

 

I don't see Williamson throwing himself to the ground when he gets caught out of position, repeatedly.

 

Then again, I don't see Williamson bombing forward down the right flank like the "White Cafu".

[colinmk]

I just have a very different opinion. Guthrie covering Tiote or Perch covering Simpson long term would be a disaster imo.

 

Ben Arfa could cover Jonas but then we are a striker short meaning someone like Loven coming in.

 

The rest are signing we haven't made yet which kind of backs up my point that we need to sign players in other areas before replacing Nolan.

 

Serious disaster, swap the hardest working player in our team with Guthrie or Ireland and the midfield is immediately fucked. Dunno about Gosling because I don't really know what sort of players he is...apart from an injured one.

[magorific]

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

 

So you're denying that there was significant dissent on this forum towards Taylor while the contract thing dragged on? You're denying that coloured people's opinions of him, despite him barely putting a foot wrong when fit last season?

Yep, heard it all now...

[magorific]

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

 

I don't see Williamson throwing himself to the ground when he gets caught out of position, repeatedly.

 

 

No, but he's been left literally on his arse enough times in recent months. Not to mention the wrestling at every free kick/corner.

[Dave]

Plenty of folks don't rate Taylor, and didn't before the contract situation. That's why some reacted so badly to his supposed demands.

[JH]

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

 

So you're denying that there was significant dissent on this forum towards Taylor while the contract thing dragged on? You're denying that coloured people's opinions of him, despite him barely putting a foot wrong when fit last season?

Yep, heard it all now...

 

I'm not denying that at all Nor am I denying that it coloured people's opinions of him.

 

But many see Williamson as the safer and simpler defender. It's got nothing to do with what he what he demanded in his contract.

[Ronaldo]

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

 

So you're denying that there was significant dissent on this forum towards Taylor while the contract thing dragged on? You're denying that coloured people's opinions of him, despite him barely putting a foot wrong when fit last season?

Yep, heard it all now...

 

Got to be said, Taylor's had 6 seasons in the PL. The fact you're pointing to half a season in The Championship as proof of his quality says it all.

 

Ultimately, both Taylor and Williamson are lower-end PL defenders. The players around them on the pitch have lots of quality and consistency, so replacing one or both is not a major priority at this moment.

[JH]

Ultimately, both Taylor and Williamson are lower-end PL defenders. The players around them on the pitch have lots of quality and consistency, so replacing one or both is not a major priority at this moment.

 

http://www.pursuit.eu/rimages/hammare.jpg

[madras]

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

 

So you're denying that there was significant dissent on this forum towards Taylor while the contract thing dragged on? You're denying that coloured people's opinions of him, despite him barely putting a foot wrong when fit last season?

Yep, heard it all now...

 

Got to be said, Taylor's had 6 seasons in the PL. The fact you're pointing to half a season in The Championship as proof of his quality says it all.

 

Ultimately, both Taylor and Williamson are lower-end PL defenders. The players around them on the pitch have lots of quality and consistency, so replacing one or both is not a major priority at this moment.

the lower end of the PL is about 14 or 15 clubs strong.

[magorific]

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

 

So you're denying that there was significant dissent on this forum towards Taylor while the contract thing dragged on? You're denying that coloured people's opinions of him, despite him barely putting a foot wrong when fit last season?

Yep, heard it all now...

 

Got to be said, Taylor's had 6 seasons in the PL. The fact you're pointing to half a season in The Championship as proof of his quality says it all.

 

Ultimately, both Taylor and Williamson are lower-end PL defenders. The players around them on the pitch have lots of quality and consistency, so replacing one or both is not a major priority at this moment.

 

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

 

So you're denying that there was significant dissent on this forum towards Taylor while the contract thing dragged on? You're denying that coloured people's opinions of him, despite him barely putting a foot wrong when fit last season?

Yep, heard it all now...

 

I'm not denying that at all Nor am I denying that it coloured people's opinions of him.

 

But many see Williamson as the safer and simpler defender. It's got nothing to do with what he what he demanded in his contract.

 

So people's opinion of Taylor is coloured, but their opinion of him has nothing to do with what he demanded in his contract. Mmm...

Again, I'm not saying Taylor is as good as Colo, just that I can't see why people should see Williamson as in any way "safe" after mistakes in the numerous games mentioned. Mistakes which, to my mind, were worse than I've seen Taylor make.

As for the argument re Taylor only performing in the Championship, I don't remember him being particularly to blame for us getting relegated. In fact, I remember him as one of our better performers.

[magorific]

People prefer Williamson because they 'swallowed the club's story about Taylor's wage saga' - I've heard it all now

 

I can't see many holding that opinion, and as someone who prefers Williamson it's got nothing to do with Taylor's contract.

 

So you're denying that there was significant dissent on this forum towards Taylor while the contract thing dragged on? You're denying that coloured people's opinions of him, despite him barely putting a foot wrong when fit last season?

Yep, heard it all now...

 

Got to be said, Taylor's had 6 seasons in the PL. The fact you're pointing to half a season in The Championship as proof of his quality says it all.

 

Ultimately, both Taylor and Williamson are lower-end PL defenders. The players around them on the pitch have lots of quality and consistency, so replacing one or both is not a major priority at this moment.

 

Says a man who insisted not so long ago that Taylor would and should come in for Williamson when fit.