Ronaldo

[Tooj]

You're forgetting Romario.

[Vinny Green Balls]

When transvestite identifying inevitably becomes a professional sport, Ronaldo will have to improve his skills if he wants to be a legend.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

This thread has become ridiculous, comparing who's the better player between one three times world-best player against one one european player of the year.

 

Like I said, Shearer is the best striker that I have watched in the Premier League in his prime, Drogba is also up there, but Shearer just had this extra bit.

 

However, it's strange to compare Ronaldo who played in three different league, scored more goals per game and never had to adapt due to his genuine talent. Ronaldo is probably the second or third best striker inside of the box but he created so much space and his pace was  threat for 90 minutes at his prime. Also don't forget that from 96 onwards he didn't have more than one injury free season. But he came back stronger than ever after 2 years of injuries and setbacks and scored 8 goals for a team that wasn't considered favourites in the World Cup.

 

In the end it's obvious that Ronaldo > Shearer, but then again this is a Newcastle forum so.

 

 

 

When I judge a footballer I don't look at honours won etc. I judge a footballer based on their attributes and Shearer for me had the better all-round game as a centre-forward than any striker of his generation. This isn't a Newcastle fans' biased opinion either. My boyhood hero was Andy Cole, a phenomenal goalscorer for this club but I knew back then that Shearer was several levels above Cole as a centre-forward long before he signed for Newcastle.

 

Ronaldo of course will be remembered as a world great because he performed on the world stage and won many honours, including the greatest of all, the World Cup, for an iconic national side in Brazil. Shearer will be remembered as a Premier League all-time great and a Newcastle United legend. He will not be remembered as a world great like Ronaldo.

 

In that sense, of course it is strange to compare the two. But as footballers and as centre-forwards, stripping away what they as individuals won (or didn't in Shearer's case) and looking only at their attributes as footballers and as centre-forwards the two were clearly at the time at the very very top of their art - both absolute world-class. That cannot be denied.

 

As to my own opinion, I rated Shearer's all-round game as a centre-forward a tad above Ronaldo's so as a centre-forward or striker, and therefore for me, Shearer was the better of the two. Not by a massive margin but slightly.

 

People forget just how good he was and with Shearer you get the impression he loses points if you like because he's English and didn't win anything as a player which is bull shit. I imagine a Shearer in a Barcelona side which under Sir Bobby was one of the most attack minded sides in their history, or in a Brazil side, and I imagine record goal numbers being scored.

 

Had he joined Man Utd rather than Newcastle which will pain me to say, we'd be talking about a world great as we would when we think and talk about Ronaldo. In that side, especially the one that contained Sheringham, Giggs, Keane, Scholes and Beckham, he'd have been unstoppable.

 

He played in some serious dross of a side at Newcastle yet continued to perform to the highest of standards as an individual and scored over 20 a season on average.

 

I'll never forget his performance away to Fulham a few years back when he scored twice or his performance at home to Charlton in a 3-1 win, He was immense, he was everything you'd want in the ideal centre-forward, this coming in his final years at the club where he was half the player he used to be apparently.

 

People talk about Ronaldo's injuries but Shearer had two devastating injuries of his own remember and the way he transformed his game and adapted showed amazing skill and technique, to become a totally different player. Ronaldo did amazingly well to recover from his injuries but he couldn't adapt his game and if anything become weaker as a player whereas Shearer become stronger.

 

I used to watch him regularly for Real Madrid and Brazil post injuries and while the goals still flowed his general performance during a game was often average to the point where many a time he was regarded as "finished", Shearer's performances in the main however were often of a very high standard. He rarely gave the ball away, rarely lost a header, rarely went a game without notching or testing the 'keeper and he rarely had a quiet game even when he wasn't scoring, all this in for the most part, shitty sides. He carried Newcastle United for a decade putting in world-class peformances on a consistet basis.

 

For me Shearer is is the most complete centre-forward I've ever seen and certainly of his generation.

 

Again, he had the lot.

 

He was a ten out of ten centre-forward for all-round shooting, heading, strength both physically and mentally, technique, crossing, general all-round link up play, leading of the line, leadership, goalscoring, positioning, awareness and consistency.

 

Ronaldo wasn't the best with his back to goal or heading the ball whereas his all-round shooting technique wasn't as clinical as Shearer's. His crossing and passing wasn't as good as Shearer's either and nor was his ability to use his body off the ball better. Shearer was more of a leader on the pitch as well as being a more industrious player work-wise. Ronaldo of course was simply amazing at running with the ball and using his skills to manipulate the ball to do whatever he so desired really, often to mesmerising effect that at times was outrageous hence the spectacular moments of play. He was far more dangerous with the ball at his feet than Shearer when facing defenders or running towards goal and he was more naturally talented football ability wise, far more. Simply as a footballer, i.e. with the ball at his feet, he wipes the floor with Shearer, but as these freestyle 'footballers' show, being a great with a football at your feet, isn't what football is all about. Far from it and that is where Ronaldo falls short as the centre-forward to Shearer. For me anyway.

 

By the way I recall Sir Bobby thought of only one striker to replace Ronaldo when he left Barcelona, and that was Shearer, but our board rightly refused to sell. Instead Sir Bobby recommended Rivaldo to the Barca board, one of my favourite players of all time.

 

Speaking of Brazilian strikers, for me Romario was better than Ronaldo, I loved watching him play.

 

Looking at the current pool of strikers, the generation of Shearer and Ronaldo was a real high point for the art of goalscoring and centre-forward play. The best all-rounder today is probably Drogba and for me he is a level below your Shearer or Ronaldo and as for Torres don't get me started on him. Shearer in his pomp today would go for double what Chelsea paid for him. Same for Ronaldo too.

[Ronaldo]

To see Shearer performed well when we were dross is a slight exaggeration. He generally looked average when we were average.

[Flip]

HTT.

 

I see where you coming from, but I still believe that a striker is judged on goal and how much he helps a team. Ronaldo was exceptional in creating spaces, in drawing two-three defenders, taking them on and above all scoring. Shearer was real hard worker, but Ronaldo made it much easier to his team he took pressure of his team. People were saying Ronaldo was past it but he still scored once every two games for Milan as fat as he was so he also adapted his game in a marvellous matter.

 

For me Romario is the closest you'll find a striker in the 90's to Ronaldo. Romario had more raw talent but he just couldn't bother enough. Ronaldo fought back from injuries time after time, he felt he never won enough and wanted more all the time. People say that he wasn't loyal but remember he never wanted to leave Barca and before going to Real he offered his services back to Barcelona but the club couldn't afford it. He was loved by everyone.

 

Don't get me wrong I love Shearer and at his prime he was unstoppable my only match I've watched live in Newcastle, Shearer contributed so much and won every single header. But in his prime I don't think he was as feared by the opposition as Ronaldo was.

 

Talking about Rivaldo, he might be one of the most underrated players of all time. Won world best player once but people forget he was Brazils best player in the 2002 world cup. I was at the world cup and saw two games and he tracked back so much and did so much for the team it's ridiculous. And still at 38 he showed his quality two weeks ago in his debut for Sao Paulo. Quality. Just sad that todays Brazilian players are average and non-spectacular players (Elias, Lucas, Ramires (good players but nothing spectacular)). I'm keeping my hopes up that Pato, Coutinho, Neymar and Ganso will develop into their full potential.

 

 

[Shearer9]

Was just watching more Ronaldo highlights from his time at Barca and it made me think about what a Ronaldo-Owen partnership would have looked like circa 97-99.  Would have just been an incredible selection of pace and skill, a lot of Michael Owen and Ronaldo highlights from that time display scoring aptitude on very similar types of goals. 

[M4]

Speaking of Ronaldo, Romario and Shearer... latest Four Four Two has features or interviews of all three as well as Dennis "there was lucky involved in the Newcastle goal" Bergkamp.

[tmonkey]

My ranking of goalscoring strikers since 1990 would be:

 

1. Ronaldo

2. Van Basten

3. Romario

4. Batistuta

5. Shearer

6. Weah

7. Shevchenko

8. Henry

9. van Nistelrooy

10. Any of Drogba/Eto'o/Torres/Crespo

 

Regarding HTT's post, I'd argue that the same arguments would apply better to Batigol. Absolutely lethal striker who scored every type of goal for a pretty mediocre Fiorentina side (Rui Costa aside). A huge chunks of his goals are spectucular ones out of nothing. Went to Roma after he was past his prime and led them to a Serie A title. And his prime was back when Serie A was at a considerably higher level than the Premiership (complete reverse of today almost). Just imagine Batigol in the Premiership from 93-99 in those open, action packed, poorly defended, end-to-end Premiership games...

[Guest neesy111]

To see Shearer performed well when we were dross is a slight exaggeration. He generally looked average when we were average.

 

Hmm, I wouldn't say that in comparison to Ronaldo.  Also when the fuck did Ronaldo play is such dross in his career because he play in some excellent sides when in europe.

 

Great striker but had the privilege to be in some of the best sides in europe at the time.

[Ronaldo]

It wasn't in comparison to Ronaldo, it was in response to HTT's comment.

[kingxlnc]

My ranking of goalscoring strikers since 1990 would be:

 

1. Ronaldo

2. Van Basten

3. Romario

4. Batistuta

5. Shearer

6. Weah

7. Shevchenko

8. Henry

9. van Nistelrooy

10. Any of Drogba/Eto'o/Torres/Crespo

 

Regarding HTT's post, I'd argue that the same arguments would apply better to Batigol. Absolutely lethal striker who scored every type of goal for a pretty mediocre Fiorentina side (Rui Costa aside). A huge chunks of his goals are spectucular ones out of nothing. Went to Roma after he was past his prime and led them to a Serie A title. And his prime was back when Serie A was at a considerably higher level than the Premiership (complete reverse of today almost). Just imagine Batigol in the Premiership from 93-99 in those open, action packed, poorly defended, end-to-end Premiership games...

 

I was thinking of Batistuta when I was reading HTT's post also - absolute beast of a striker. Lethal as they come - one of my faves growing up. On a par with Shearer at his peak for me.

I would also argue Henry should perhaps be above Shevchenko. But Henry, Van Nistelrooy and Shevchenko are more 00's strikers as that is when they were in their peak.

As silly as it sounds, but Kluivert was also phenomenal in the 90's - the complete centre forward. Pure class, at Ajax and Barcelona - used to love watching him play. And then we are forgetting Raul in the early days - also clinical as they come. Klinsmann also was an excellent 90's striker.

 

The 90's were a real golden age for centre forwards - even just for England we were blessed with Shearer, Sheringham, Owen, Cole, Beardsley, Ferdinand, Wright, Collymore, Fowler, etc etc. When comparing to the dross of the 00's - only Owen and Rooney stand out - we had the likes of Vassell, Crouch and Heskey as England regulars. It is criminal that they probably have way more caps individually than the aforementioned England strikers (probably put together in the cases of Ferdinand, Cole, Collymore, Fowler, Wright, Sutton etc) in the 90's.

 

The prolific goalscorers today are Messi and C.Ronaldo - not traditional strikers - indicative of how the game has evolved perhaps. Comparing the 'best' traditional type of centre forward today with Ronaldo - or any of those strikers on that list or already mentioned, where would they come?

 

The likes of David Villa, Ibrahimovic, Drogba, Eto'o?

 

[Ronaldo]

Owen and Rooney being our best strikers of the last 10 years is the biggest reason for failure in the tournaments. There are about 10 Argentine strikers from the same period that absolutely piss all over those two.

[Village Idiot]

Kluivert was just 5 goals per season away of being one of the best strikers of the last 25 years. Great on the floor, great on the air... he had amazing technique and the body of a tall striker. He created a lot of play but always was this little bit wasteful in front of goal...

[Ronaldo]

I loved Kluivert.

 

[Village Idiot]

Rivaldo on the left, Kluivert on top, Figo on the right. What a trident that was.

[tmonkey]

Prefer Figo to Messi in all honesty. Such a classy, slick footballer with perfect abilities for every attacking situation (crossing, creating, shooting, dribbling, etc etc). Even had a deceptive burst of pace. Not as direct or effective at drilling straight through a defence like Messi, but more like an ice sculptor, constantly chipping away at the outside till he gets the shape he desires.

 

Him towards the end of his Barca career (or early Madrid years), Xavi (of today), Redondo (peak Madrid form), Rivaldo (peak Barca form) - that's my dream midfield. Messi can piss off up front behind Ronaldo, he'll only get the ball if the others get tired of playing around with it.

[Flip]

Rivaldo on the left, Kluivert on top, Figo on the right. What a trident that was.

 

Rivaldo is probably the most underrated player and I've stated that many times. People forget how much he did for the team, his left foot was deadly. I will never forget the fact that people talked more about Oliver Kahn and Ronaldo in the 2002 WC when in fact Rivaldo was the best player by a mile there. What a fucking player.

 

Figo on the other hand was also a great player, probably one of the best portuguese players of all time. But I'd still pick Messi any day over him.

 

[Disco]

Owen and Rooney being our best strikers of the last 10 years is the biggest reason for failure in the tournaments. There are about 10 Argentine strikers from the same period that absolutely piss all over those two.

 

And yet in the same time Argentina have won just as little as we have.

[Village Idiot]

Owen and Rooney being our best strikers of the last 10 years is the biggest reason for failure in the tournaments. There are about 10 Argentine strikers from the same period that absolutely piss all over those two.

 

And yet in the same time Argentina have won just as little as we have.

 

You just made me check, didn't realize they hadn't won the Copa América since the early 90s!

[Disco]

Owen and Rooney being our best strikers of the last 10 years is the biggest reason for failure in the tournaments. There are about 10 Argentine strikers from the same period that absolutely piss all over those two.

 

And yet in the same time Argentina have won just as little as we have.

 

You just made me check, didn't realize they hadn't won the Copa América since the early 90s!

 

They've got as big a chance this year as they'll ever have. Brazil in transition & on home soil. You can never trust their defence though. Promises to be a bloody good tournament if Chile, Paraguay and Uruguay turn up & play to their full potential too.

[Village Idiot]

Owen and Rooney being our best strikers of the last 10 years is the biggest reason for failure in the tournaments. There are about 10 Argentine strikers from the same period that absolutely piss all over those two.

 

And yet in the same time Argentina have won just as little as we have.

 

You just made me check, didn't realize they hadn't won the Copa América since the early 90s!

 

They've got as big a chance this year as they'll ever have. Brazil in transition & on home soil. You can never trust their defence though. Promises to be a bloody good tournament if Chile, Paraguay and Uruguay turn up & play to their full potential too.

 

They never seem to get a reliable defence. Lately they have been calling Gaby Milito who has turned to shambles overnight (guess injuries finally taking its toll). They need to settle a proper midfield to fuel all that dynamite upfront too.

[Disco]

Owen and Rooney being our best strikers of the last 10 years is the biggest reason for failure in the tournaments. There are about 10 Argentine strikers from the same period that absolutely piss all over those two.

 

And yet in the same time Argentina have won just as little as we have.

 

You just made me check, didn't realize they hadn't won the Copa América since the early 90s!

 

They've got as big a chance this year as they'll ever have. Brazil in transition & on home soil. You can never trust their defence though. Promises to be a bloody good tournament if Chile, Paraguay and Uruguay turn up & play to their full potential too.

 

They never seem to get a reliable defence. Lately they have been calling Gaby Milito who has turned to shambles overnight (guess injuries finally taking its toll). They need to settle a proper midfield to fuel all that dynamite upfront too.

 

So true their defence is generally poor as is the keeper. Problem with Argentina, at centre back, is that they only seem to produce one kind. The small, terrier type who is decent on the ball. Doesn't help that in the recent squad you've got G.Milito, Garay and Otamendi all of whom are not first team regulars for their club teams.

 

The list of strikers that doesn't even get in the Argentine squad is eye watering though, most countries would settle for many of them as their number 9.

[Village Idiot]

Leo Messi

Pipita Higuaín

Carlos Tévez

Diego Milito

Sergio Agüero

 

Fucking mental.

[Disco]

Leo Messi

Pipita Higuaín

Carlos Tévez

Diego Milito

Sergio Agüero

 

Fucking mental.

 

No San Martín?

[Dave]

I hadn't even realised there was an international tournament this summer. Yay. \o/