Liverpool and their fans

[Guest toonlass]

WTF? They opened the gate because people were getting crushed outside due to police cordons that had been in place the year before not being in place that year, because traffic delays on the motorways meant that a lot of coaches were held up and ended up all arriving at the same time, and because police directed fans to the Leppings Lane end whether they had a ticket for that end or not! They also failed to block off the middle passageway to the pens, and if you have ever been to Hillsborough you will know that because of the signage you are automatically drawn to that centre passageway (which is still there) and you don't even notice the smaller entrances to the side pens.

[1878]

My best friend is a Liverpool fan and he's very grounded. He's very critical of Rafa-haters.

 

And I don't believe we booed Bobby that season. For one, it wasn't for coming 5th, because we hadn't finished the season. There were 2 games left, and 4th was still possible. The team were booed for the Wolves performance, and Robert and Viana got special boos.

 

The ones who support Rafa are the deluded ones. Long may he stay there!

 

Not really. He's done very well there, they came 2nd last season. They have a bad year, with Gerrard in rubbish form and 2 clubs around them spending loads, and no credible alternative has been offered.  If they had someone lined up that was better than Rafa, it would maybe make sense, but they're not going to get a better manager.

 

Not sure how City's takeover has affected the figures but until last year Benitez had a higher net spend over his period in charge than any other manager in the country. Don't buy into the absolute rubbish spouted by him in the press (and lapped up by their fans) that he hasn't had the financial backing to succeed. It's just a lie to protect himself.

 

iirc he's been there for about 6 years. Despite his massive spending on a squad which Houllier had already spent a fortune assembling they have won only 2 trophies and challenged for the title only once. He's about to finish outside the top 4 for the second time in his reign.

 

I'm sure there's more than a few managers out there who could match or better his record with that kind of money and an already decent squad.

[Stifler]

...or the fans for behaving like a pack of animals to get passed the safety measures in place in order to rush into the ground.

 

All bad mistakes, but the behaviour of the fans is the main (not only) reason.

 

I agree that there wasn't a single reason and that the fans weren't blameless.. but the fact that it had been waiting to happen for years doesn't absolve the police or put any more blame on the fans. The police should have seen what was inevitably coming (not just in that circumstance; for years before), and didn't. Crowd control, lest we forget, was supposed to be the main part of their job there.

Thats what I've been trying to say, though I'm not very good at it.

All of them, the police, the fans, and others, they all had a part in what happend, but arn't all entirely to blame. But Liverppol fans who go around saying they had no part in it, trying to put the blame soley on the police and everyone else is the wrong attitude, I'm not saying all Liverpool fans are like that, but their is Liverpool fans and other fans of toher clubs who go around with that perception.

[Village Idiot]

Liverpool are about to get in really deep shit. It's not losing the CL money what's going to hurt, is the fact that they won't be able to attract the kind of talent they need so much (since their squad is dire bar a few players), and they might even lose some of their top players. Another title challenge could be half a decade away, at the earliest, since ManCity's money is going to make them very hard to displace.

 

Still, they could find themselves another rich Arab since they are a big name still.

[Doctor Zaius]

WTF? They opened the gate because people were getting crushed outside due to police cordons that had been in place the year before not being in place that year, because traffic delays on the motorways meant that a lot of coaches were held up and ended up all arriving at the same time, and because police directed fans to the Leppings Lane end whether they had a ticket for that end or not! They also failed to block off the middle passageway to the pens, and if you have ever been to Hillsborough you will know that because of the signage you are automatically drawn to that centre passageway (which is still there) and you don't even notice the smaller entrances to the side pens.

 

Yeah I noticed that too. I must admit i found it a bit eerie walking in through at middle tunnel and out through the side passageways next to the wall and blue fencing think about the disaster like.

[Guest firetotheworks]

The whole generalising fans by the team that they support is EXACTLY, repeat EXACTLY what a lot of people on here complain, whinge, and feel sorry for themselves about when it's said about us. The bitterness, and hypocrisy here is astounding.

 

Oh, a few Villa fans made a banner = All Villa fans are twats

 

Liverpool fans are whinging = Liverpool fans whinge despite being in the Champions League

 

 

 

How about:

 

Some Newcastle fans boo the team for finishing 5th = All Newcastle fans are deluded? Nah, didn't think so.

 

Some Newcastle fans boo Nicky Butt onto the field, he then goes on to score 2 goals in the same match and have a good season, the same Newcastle fans then kiss his arse = Newcastle fans are fickle? Nah, didn't think so.

 

A couple of fat fans don't wear their shirts, thats a couple in 52,000, the same 52,000 you can see if you look to your left or right, but no = Newcastle fans are fat, tattooed idiots? Nah didn't think so.

 

A few charvs are asked their opinion outside SJP = All Newcastle fans are mongs? Nah, didn't think so.

 

 

If you can see it's not true with us, then why believe the very same s*** spouted about a full set of other teams supporters? It is the very definition of hypocrisy.

 

 

One does not = all. Grow the f*** up ffs.

 

 

 

Saying that, as a team, I hate Liverpool. Nothing wrong with their general fans, just like there's nothing wrong with the generally intelligent minded supporters of any team. Although, ironically, some of the rubbish in this thread is making me think twice.

[LooneyToonArmy]

I know we'll have our fair few. And i know some of them will travel everywhere to watch the club, and some will be fantastic supporters. But on the interview not one had a Scouse accent. They all sounded cockney and a few brummie etc

 

Most people from Liverpool are Evertonians anyway......a bit like people from Barcelona are Espanyol fans (though they don't all go to the games)...at least what I was told when I visited there. Maybe Village Idiot can confirm/deny this.  I was talking to a proper die hard Espanyol fan though so perhaps an element of bias

[johnnypd]

dont think that is true about espanyol, my understanding is that they were established by and for the 'spanish' minority in the city, poor migrants from other parts of spain, hence the name.

[Village Idiot]

I know we'll have our fair few. And i know some of them will travel everywhere to watch the club, and some will be fantastic supporters. But on the interview not one had a Scouse accent. They all sounded cockney and a few brummie etc

 

Most people from Liverpool are Evertonians anyway......a bit like people from Barcelona are Espanyol fans (though they don't all go to the games)...at least what I was told when I visited there. Maybe Village Idiot can confirm/deny this.  I was talking to a proper die hard Espanyol fan though so perhaps an element of bias

 

:lol:

 

Espanyol fans are not a majority in town, not even by a long shot. There's a reason we average 80,000 souls in our stadium, and they 25,000. The "they don't go to games" is a shit excuse.

[Village Idiot]

dont think that is true about espanyol, my understanding is that they were established by and for the 'spanish' minority in the city, poor migrants from other parts of spain, hence the name.

 

That's actually not completely true. They were founded by a mixture of Catalans and Spaniards. The thing is they chose the name "Español" to oppose us (their full name means "Spanish football club of Barcelona"), as we were founded by a mixture of Swiss, Englishmen, Spaniards and Catalans. Even at the moment of their birth they were already obsessed with us 

 

A few months later there was even a third team, called "Català", which was only made up by Catalans, created to oppose both us and Espanyol  . Disappeared in the 1920s but we had a great rivalry apparently.

 

Español becoming the team of the Spanish minority in Barcelona is a thing of the Franco era, as the regime - in a smaller scale as to what they did for Real Madrid - adopted them as a symbol of "good Spanish club" as opposed to us, the unloyal separatists. But if you look at the "oldschool" Espanyol fans, those whose parents, grandparents, etc... were Espanyol fans, they are actually Catalans mostly from the neighborhood of Sarrià - which is pretty middle-class. But since the 1960s they have had a huge following from Spanish immigrants in Barcelona. Although that's been balanced out these past years.

[Delima]

Will Laporta become the president of Cataluna ?

[Village Idiot]

Will Laporta become the president of Cataluna ?

 

The day I marry Cheryl Tweety.

 

In case you overrate my Spanish sexiness: no. Not a single major party will take him as their candidate, so if he really attempts a political career (he already tried in his times before the Barça presidency) it will be in a fringe party with no chance of getting elected. He might, might get a seat if his popularity translates into the political arena, but that's all he can aspire to.

[Guest ObiChrisKenobi]

I hate how they blame everyone else for Hillsbrough and such, yet it was their own fans who without tickets who forced their way in past the police (untill the police had to give up because they had already lost control of them), the same goes for Hysel, and they want justice, look at nooneelse but those fans who went in regardless, then the fuckers did the same thing a few years ago when the played Milan in the Champions League final (the second time around I think it was).

 

Remember watching that on telly and thinking something bad was going to happen.

[Mowen]

I wish the rest of the country would join them in boycotting the Sun.

[Colos Short and Curlies]

I hate how they blame everyone else for Hillsbrough and such, yet it was their own fans who without tickets who forced their way in past the police (untill the police had to give up because they had already lost control of them), the same goes for Hysel, and they want justice, look at nooneelse but those fans who went in regardless, then the fuckers did the same thing a few years ago when the played Milan in the Champions League final (the second time around I think it was).

 

Remember watching that on telly and thinking something bad was going to happen.

 

Was that the time when fans jumped the gates with blank pieces of paper in lieu of tickets whilst wearing 'Justice for the 96' T-Shirts?

[merlin]

I hate how they blame everyone else for Hillsbrough and such, yet it was their own fans who without tickets who forced their way in past the police (untill the police had to give up because they had already lost control of them), the same goes for Hysel, and they want justice, look at nooneelse but those fans who went in regardless, then the fuckers did the same thing a few years ago when the played Milan in the Champions League final (the second time around I think it was).

 

Remember watching that on telly and thinking something bad was going to happen.

 

An unforgettable quote from Brian Clough about this ; was being interviewed by a journalist after the book he wrote about Hillsborough didn't sell well in Merseyside because Clough had blamed Liverpool fans for rushing the turnstile/gates. He was asked why he thought this was, and Clough replied;-

 

'Well, young man, half of 'em can't read, and the other half are too busy pinching hub-caps..!"

 

Classic.

[Cronky]

Just watching some coverage on Sky from the 0-0 with Fulham, and the Liverpool fans seem to think they have it so bloody hard. I can't be bothered to rant, but i cannot stand them!!!

 

Unreasonable expectations, self-pity, anger at the villains who are running the club – that’s widespread among football fans everywhere.

 

The only ones who I don’t understand are the Arsenal fans who criticise Wenger because he hasn’t won a trophy in five years. If I was watching great football in a great stadium with regular appearances in the Champions League, I wouldn’t be complaining.

 

[Pandamninator]

Liverpool are about to get in really deep shit. It's not losing the CL money what's going to hurt, is the fact that they won't be able to attract the kind of talent they need so much (since their squad is dire bar a few players), and they might even lose some of their top players. Another title challenge could be half a decade away, at the earliest, since ManCity's money is going to make them very hard to displace.

 

Still, they could find themselves another rich Arab since they are a big name still.

 

Liverpool will have trouble finding themselves a Oil Sugar Daddy, for the same reason Portsmouth are fucked and Chelsea will be too if Roman ever abandons ship, not only would you inherit a mountain of debt if you took over any of those clubs, but all three have rickety old shacks they call stadiums that need to be replaced if you ever want to furnish that debt.

 

Man City was probably an attractive option for that reason alone - a shiny new stadium built 5 years ago which you could cram 48,000 corporate suits into once you start winning.

[brummie]

The whole generalising fans by the team that they support is EXACTLY, repeat EXACTLY what a lot of people on here complain, whinge, and feel sorry for themselves about when it's said about us. The bitterness, and hypocrisy here is astounding.

 

Oh, a few Villa fans made a banner = All Villa fans are twats

 

Liverpool fans are whinging = Liverpool fans whinge despite being in the Champions League

 

 

 

How about:

 

Some Newcastle fans boo the team for finishing 5th = All Newcastle fans are deluded? Nah, didn't think so.

 

Some Newcastle fans boo Nicky Butt onto the field, he then goes on to score 2 goals in the same match and have a good season, the same Newcastle fans then kiss his arse = Newcastle fans are fickle? Nah, didn't think so.

 

A couple of fat fans don't wear their shirts, thats a couple in 52,000, the same 52,000 you can see if you look to your left or right, but no = Newcastle fans are fat, tattooed idiots? Nah didn't think so.

 

A few charvs are asked their opinion outside SJP = All Newcastle fans are mongs? Nah, didn't think so.

 

 

If you can see it's not true with us, then why believe the very same s*** spouted about a full set of other teams supporters? It is the very definition of hypocrisy.

 

 

One does not = all. Grow the f*** up ffs.

 

 

 

Saying that, as a team, I hate Liverpool. Nothing wrong with their general fans, just like there's nothing wrong with the generally intelligent minded supporters of any team. Although, ironically, some of the rubbish in this thread is making me think twice.

 

Halle-fucking-llujah.

 

At the end of the day, we're all football supporters.

 

Every club has its own collection of witless mongs. Every club has its knowledgeable fans.

 

 

[summerof69]

Just watching some coverage on Sky from the 0-0 with Fulham, and the Liverpool fans seem to think they have it so bloody hard. I can't be bothered to rant, but i cannot stand them!!!

 

Unreasonable expectations, self-pity, anger at the villains who are running the club – that’s widespread among football fans everywhere.

 

The only ones who I don’t understand are the Arsenal fans who criticise Wenger because he hasn’t won a trophy in five years. If I was watching great football in a great stadium with regular appearances in the Champions League, I wouldn’t be complaining.

 

 

 

Well ok, i take your point about the football but the one about the stadium is wrong, imo, st james' is better than the emirates. ok it's smaller but our stadium has character therir's just looks like any other stadium built with in the last few years.

[Gash]

Just watching some coverage on Sky from the 0-0 with Fulham, and the Liverpool fans seem to think they have it so bloody hard. I can't be bothered to rant, but i cannot stand them!!!

 

Unreasonable expectations, self-pity, anger at the villains who are running the club – that’s widespread among football fans everywhere.

 

The only ones who I don’t understand are the Arsenal fans who criticise Wenger because he hasn’t won a trophy in five years. If I was watching great football in a great stadium with regular appearances in the Champions League, I wouldn’t be complaining.

 

They aren't real fans that criticise Wenger, talk to a proper non arm chair fan and they'll all tell you how much they love Arsene and the work he has done. I adore the man, if we don't win a trophy until he retires i will still love what he has done for the club, at the end of the day there are some clubs that are at risk of going out of business and play shit football. We play amazing football, are financially secure and have qualified for Europe for the last 15 years or something stupid. He's an unquestionable god amongst genuine Arsenal fans.

My dad tells me of the boring Arsenal days, i cant remember this but i'm proud of where we are.

[Colos Short and Curlies]

Anyone else want to take the bet that should Liverpool win the Europa League then the winners will magically qualify for the Champions League?

[Elliottman]

Anyone else want to take the bet that should Liverpool win the Europa League then the winners will magically qualify for the Champions League?

 

was just thinking this yesterday. would it fuck suprise me

[summerof69]

Anyone else want to take the bet that should Liverpool win the Europa League then the winners will magically qualify for the Champions League?

 

 

Why would they be let through to the champions league when its unlikely they won't finish 4th, i doubt they would be let through just for winning the Europa league.

[QBG]

Seen as I spend 75% of my year in Liverpool I feel somehow sort of qualified to come in and debate this topic. First off a rant:

 

I don't see why half of you jumped down Stifler's throat for blaming the fans. It was their fault, simple as. Yes it could have been any set of fans, it was the 80s the vast majority of clubs had a large set of scummy cunt supporters, yes the Police could have dealt with it better, but the fact remains no matter who opened what gate, a large amount of fans who didn't have tickets charged into the stands and ended up killing some of their own fans through their own stupidity. End of. They talk about Hillsborough constantly because they still have someone to blame, hence why they don't talk about Heysel, because its been proven beyond all doubt that it was their fault. Living in the city its an opinion I keep to myself but its my opinion on the matter nonetheless.

 

To answer the original question, I have a few mates who support Liverpool who are fairly balanced and accept that they've been shit this year and put it down to the ownership more than anything, they understand that they're in trouble if they don't finish 4th, which I don't think they will. They have every right to moan though and around the city its about half and half. Half accept that they've been shit and have no right to success, and the other half talk utter bollocks. The worst I had was a cab driver who told me that Liverpool should be finishing 1st every year, regardless of the fact they haven't won the league for 20 years. He also had a good laugh at me being a Newcastle fan and my mate being a Forest fan, all in all he was a cunt. Most of them actually like Newcastle and our fans though. That's going from my experience anyway.