NUFC 2009 Accounts

[OzzieMandias]

We'll see. He's kept his word on that one so far.

 

I'm certainly not wetting the bed with worry that he'll decide to bankrupt a major asset in order to move money from one pocket into another.

[ToonTastic]

Am I the only one that doesn't have a clue what anyone's talking about in this thread?   

 

Would anyone care to sum up what all of this means for those of us who don't have a clue about converting debt into equity and who owes who what etc etc.

The club are about £200m in debt, of which about £150m is owed to Mike Ashley. If he wants his money back Newcastle will be run like Happy Shopper for the foreseeable future. He could wipe the debt by using it's value to purchase new shares in the club, but hasn't.

 

And has no reason to.

 

 

The debt to Ashley arises from his crass decision not to check out which loans were repayable. Effectively he's refinancing out of his own pocket a debt that was easily manageable under its previous arrangement.

 

 

The banks didnt want us to have an overdraft, chances of them being happy for us to continue with the loan with the problems banks were having is very very slim

 

The club has an overdraft. That's not where the £111m came from.

 

What ?? I said the banks didn't want to give us an overdraft due to the state of the club. Ashley had to agree to cover the debt to get one. So if they were happy to recall our overdraft do you think the banks would have been happy to keep the loan we had ? Would they hell they would have wanted there money back causing the club in turn to go under or at the very least go the way of Portsmouth.

[Colos Short and Curlies]

Still think he is going to float the club again to reduce the burden on his shoulders and/or recover some of the money.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

Still think he is going to float the club again to reduce the burden on his shoulders and/or recover some of the money.

 

It's certainly an option.

 

My worry would be that the club will then have to be more self financing again obviously, which I'm not sure it's yet ready for.

[Happy Face]

Well the accounts are available now. I've had a quick look.

 

The highlights:

 

Turnover was only £86 million (all 3 areas of revenue matchday, media and commercial were down on the previous year)

 

Wages (including Keegan's £2.2m payoff) £73m

 

Profit on transfers £23m

 

Other costs £51m

 

Therefore the Loss = £15m so it was an improvement on 2008 but, due to the fall in turnover, not a massive one.

 

As at 30th June Ashley had loaned £111m making his investment a total of £247m. He took no money out in interest. At one point in the year his loan was up to £112m. Not surprisingly, as the club is technically insolvent by £51m,  he was required to give a personal guarantee to satisfy the going concern status.

 

Sorry if i'm repeating anything but i just want to make sure i've got the picture right here.

 

£111m was outstanding in June 2009, he's added £25m to that in the season gone and there's a £35m overdraft, so the clubs debt stands over £170m at the moment, right?  Or is the overdraft just a facility not being fully utilised?

[Happy Face]

the one thing that has hit us badly, was shepherd spending our sponsership money upfront on owen and luque!

 

There were other things like....relegation for example.  And sacking Allardyce and Keegan cost as much as Luque.

 

 

[Happy Face]

Well the accounts are available now. I've had a quick look.

 

The highlights:

 

Turnover was only £86 million (all 3 areas of revenue matchday, media and commercial were down on the previous year)

 

Wages (including Keegan's £2.2m payoff) £73m

 

Profit on transfers £23m

 

Other costs £51m

 

Therefore the Loss = £15m so it was an improvement on 2008 but, due to the fall in turnover, not a massive one.

 

As at 30th June Ashley had loaned £111m making his investment a total of £247m. He took no money out in interest. At one point in the year his loan was up to £112m. Not surprisingly, as the club is technically insolvent by £51m,  he was required to give a personal guarantee to satisfy the going concern status.

 

Sorry if i'm repeating anything but i just want to make sure i've got the picture right here.

 

£111m was outstanding in June 2009, he's added £25m to that in the season gone and there's a £35m overdraft, so the clubs debt stands over £170m at the moment, right?   Or is the overdraft just a facility not being fully utilised?

 

Ignore this.  Just read Mick's handy overview.

 

ta

[Guest toonlass]

This basically covers us up until last year doesn't it? So we are looking really at what we were at financially at the end of last season?

[Liam Liam Liam O]

This basically covers us up until last year doesn't it? So we are looking really at what we were at financially at the end of last season?

 

 

With a few bits in the commentary about things which have happened since, for example how much he's put in since then.

[quayside]

If anyone is interested the St James Holdings accounts have now been filed for year ended 30th June 2009, this is the parent company of NUFC. There are a few points that come out, some of these are already known and some clarify certain rumours that have been doing the rounds.

 

- As at 30th June Ashley's total investment (ie purchase cost plus loan) was £242.9 million. Since the year end the accounts report that he loaned a further £25.5 million making his investment up to £268.4 million.

 

- Obviously, since St James (like NUFC) is in an insolvent position it was necessary for him to personally guarantee to fund it for the next 12 months. Also, as with NUFC, he has shunted all his investment into current creditors instead of creditors due in more than 1 year.

 

- The rumour that Ashley has set up another company to act as the parent to St James Holdings is true.  the company is called MASH Holdings Limited. It is a new company and has not filed any accounts and is not due to do so until late December. If there is any significance to the setting up of this company it is not apparent from the St James accounts.

 

- At one point in the year Ashley's investment had risen to £248.8 million, indicating that between that point and the year end about £6 million of his loan was repaid. This may be where the rumour about Ashley taking money out of the club came from. Although as I said above he put £25.5 million back in some time after he had received this repayment. Ashley has taken no money out by way of interest, salary or dividends.

 

- St James Holdings has a bank overdraft of £36 million, secured on the Group's fixed assets. This is a sharp increase from the previous year end where the overdraft stood at £1 million.

 

- As at the year end the Group was owed £17 million in transfer fees, of which £4 million was due in more than 1 year. The accounts repeat the club's philosophy of paying up front for players purchased even though this is not the case when players are sold, as is apparent from the £17 million still owing.

 

There may be some other points in the accounts which I've missed,  but I've just had a quick look and those are the things that stood out for me.

 

 

 

 

[Thespence]

I don't class the money he used to buy the club as investment. Of course if I was him I would  be counting the beans spent on this bit of  "FUN".

[madras]

wonder if there is any significance in MASH. an acronym starting with Mike Ashley maybe or a pun on the film/book/tv serial where they get by day to day on as little as is possible, ran by crazies and with many fans claiming their former stars were much better.

[jdckelly]

mike ashley sports holdings? all i can think of that it means

[madras]

mike ashley sports holdings? all i can think of that it means

wouldn't that make it mike ashley sports holdings holdings ?

[Incognito]

Mike Ashley Shit Happens more like.

[Broadsword]

Come on guys its obviosuly M ASHley Holdings.

[madras]

Come on guys its obviosuly M ASHley Holdings.

well dah but we were looking to have some fun with it as an acronym.

[Broadsword]

If anyone is interested the St James Holdings accounts have now been filed for year ended 30th June 2009, this is the parent company of NUFC. There are a few points that come out, some of these are already known and some clarify certain rumours that have been doing the rounds.

 

- As at 30th June Ashley's total investment (ie purchase cost plus loan) was £242.9 million. Since the year end the accounts report that he loaned a further £25.5 million making his investment up to £268.4 million.

 

- Obviously, since St James (like NUFC) is in an insolvent position it was necessary for him to personally guarantee to fund it for the next 12 months. Also, as with NUFC, he has shunted all his investment into current creditors instead of creditors due in more than 1 year.

 

- The rumour that Ashley has set up another company to act as the parent to St James Holdings is true.  the company is called MASH Holdings Limited. It is a new company and has not filed any accounts and is not due to do so until late December. If there is any significance to the setting up of this company it is not apparent from the St James accounts.

 

- At one point in the year Ashley's investment had risen to £248.8 million, indicating that between that point and the year end about £6 million of his loan was repaid. This may be where the rumour about Ashley taking money out of the club came from. Although as I said above he put £25.5 million back in some time after he had received this repayment. Ashley has taken no money out by way of interest, salary or dividends.

 

- St James Holdings has a bank overdraft of £36 million, secured on the Group's fixed assets. This is a sharp increase from the previous year end where the overdraft stood at £1 million.

 

- As at the year end the Group was owed £17 million in transfer fees, of which £4 million was due in more than 1 year. The accounts repeat the club's philosophy of paying up front for players purchased even though this is not the case when players are sold, as is apparent from the £17 million still owing.

 

There may be some other points in the accounts which I've missed,  but I've just had a quick look and those are the things that stood out for me.

 

 

 

 

 

Don't forget that those accounts are consolidated in the NUFC accounts, which means the holding company is insolvent in itself, but NUFC Ltd is not.  There is no guarantee from Ashley in the NUFC accounts and the auditors are perfectly happy to sign them off without anything to say.

 

Ive not seen the holdings accounts so take your word that is not the case in those and that a guarantee is in place.

[quayside]

If anyone is interested the St James Holdings accounts have now been filed for year ended 30th June 2009, this is the parent company of NUFC. There are a few points that come out, some of these are already known and some clarify certain rumours that have been doing the rounds.

 

- As at 30th June Ashley's total investment (ie purchase cost plus loan) was £242.9 million. Since the year end the accounts report that he loaned a further £25.5 million making his investment up to £268.4 million.

 

- Obviously, since St James (like NUFC) is in an insolvent position it was necessary for him to personally guarantee to fund it for the next 12 months. Also, as with NUFC, he has shunted all his investment into current creditors instead of creditors due in more than 1 year.

 

- The rumour that Ashley has set up another company to act as the parent to St James Holdings is true.  the company is called MASH Holdings Limited. It is a new company and has not filed any accounts and is not due to do so until late December. If there is any significance to the setting up of this company it is not apparent from the St James accounts.

 

- At one point in the year Ashley's investment had risen to £248.8 million, indicating that between that point and the year end about £6 million of his loan was repaid. This may be where the rumour about Ashley taking money out of the club came from. Although as I said above he put £25.5 million back in some time after he had received this repayment. Ashley has taken no money out by way of interest, salary or dividends.

 

- St James Holdings has a bank overdraft of £36 million, secured on the Group's fixed assets. This is a sharp increase from the previous year end where the overdraft stood at £1 million.

 

- As at the year end the Group was owed £17 million in transfer fees, of which £4 million was due in more than 1 year. The accounts repeat the club's philosophy of paying up front for players purchased even though this is not the case when players are sold, as is apparent from the £17 million still owing.

 

There may be some other points in the accounts which I've missed,  but I've just had a quick look and those are the things that stood out for me.

 

 

 

 

 

Don't forget that those accounts are consolidated in the NUFC accounts, which means the holding company is insolvent in itself, but NUFC Ltd is not.  There is no guarantee from Ashley in the NUFC accounts and the auditors are perfectly happy to sign them off without anything to say.

 

Ive not seen the holdings accounts so take your word that is not the case in those and that a guarantee is in place.

 

You've lost me there - can you explain?

 

The NUFC balance sheet shows an insolvent position of £58 million as at 30th June 2009, and Ashley's commitment is specifically referred to on page 11 (under the heading Fundamental Accounting concept). Because of that commitment the NUFC accounts were prepared on a going concern basis and the auditors signed off on that.

[madras]

If anyone is interested the St James Holdings accounts have now been filed for year ended 30th June 2009, this is the parent company of NUFC. There are a few points that come out, some of these are already known and some clarify certain rumours that have been doing the rounds.

 

- As at 30th June Ashley's total investment (ie purchase cost plus loan) was £242.9 million. Since the year end the accounts report that he loaned a further £25.5 million making his investment up to £268.4 million.

 

- Obviously, since St James (like NUFC) is in an insolvent position it was necessary for him to personally guarantee to fund it for the next 12 months. Also, as with NUFC, he has shunted all his investment into current creditors instead of creditors due in more than 1 year.

 

- The rumour that Ashley has set up another company to act as the parent to St James Holdings is true.  the company is called MASH Holdings Limited. It is a new company and has not filed any accounts and is not due to do so until late December. If there is any significance to the setting up of this company it is not apparent from the St James accounts.

 

- At one point in the year Ashley's investment had risen to £248.8 million, indicating that between that point and the year end about £6 million of his loan was repaid. This may be where the rumour about Ashley taking money out of the club came from. Although as I said above he put £25.5 million back in some time after he had received this repayment. Ashley has taken no money out by way of interest, salary or dividends.

 

- St James Holdings has a bank overdraft of £36 million, secured on the Group's fixed assets. This is a sharp increase from the previous year end where the overdraft stood at £1 million.

 

- As at the year end the Group was owed £17 million in transfer fees, of which £4 million was due in more than 1 year. The accounts repeat the club's philosophy of paying up front for players purchased even though this is not the case when players are sold, as is apparent from the £17 million still owing.

 

There may be some other points in the accounts which I've missed,  but I've just had a quick look and those are the things that stood out for me.

 

 

 

 

 

Don't forget that those accounts are consolidated in the NUFC accounts, which means the holding company is insolvent in itself, but NUFC Ltd is not.  There is no guarantee from Ashley in the NUFC accounts and the auditors are perfectly happy to sign them off without anything to say.

 

Ive not seen the holdings accounts so take your word that is not the case in those and that a guarantee is in place.

 

You've lost me there - can you explain?

 

The NUFC balance sheet shows an insolvent position of £58 million as at 30th June 2009, and Ashley's commitment is specifically referred to on page 11 (under the heading Fundamental Accounting concept). Because of that commitment the NUFC accounts were prepared on a going concern basis and the auditors signed off on that.

when accountants attack

[Happy Face]

If anyone is interested the St James Holdings accounts have now been filed for year ended 30th June 2009, this is the parent company of NUFC. There are a few points that come out, some of these are already known and some clarify certain rumours that have been doing the rounds.

 

- As at 30th June Ashley's total investment (ie purchase cost plus loan) was £242.9 million. Since the year end the accounts report that he loaned a further £25.5 million making his investment up to £268.4 million.

 

- Obviously, since St James (like NUFC) is in an insolvent position it was necessary for him to personally guarantee to fund it for the next 12 months. Also, as with NUFC, he has shunted all his investment into current creditors instead of creditors due in more than 1 year.

 

- The rumour that Ashley has set up another company to act as the parent to St James Holdings is true.  the company is called MASH Holdings Limited. It is a new company and has not filed any accounts and is not due to do so until late December. If there is any significance to the setting up of this company it is not apparent from the St James accounts.

 

- At one point in the year Ashley's investment had risen to £248.8 million, indicating that between that point and the year end about £6 million of his loan was repaid. This may be where the rumour about Ashley taking money out of the club came from. Although as I said above he put £25.5 million back in some time after he had received this repayment. Ashley has taken no money out by way of interest, salary or dividends.

 

- St James Holdings has a bank overdraft of £36 million, secured on the Group's fixed assets. This is a sharp increase from the previous year end where the overdraft stood at £1 million.

 

- As at the year end the Group was owed £17 million in transfer fees, of which £4 million was due in more than 1 year. The accounts repeat the club's philosophy of paying up front for players purchased even though this is not the case when players are sold, as is apparent from the £17 million still owing.

 

There may be some other points in the accounts which I've missed,  but I've just had a quick look and those are the things that stood out for me.

 

 

 

Thanks Quayside.  Always an interesting read.

 

Just to clarify the bold bits, is it right to say there are now 3 companies....

 

Newcastle united - £20m overdraft

 

Owned by St James Holdiongs - £36m overdraft

 

Owned by MASH Holdings - No figures available

 

Or was the £20m overdraft referenced in the recent club statement a red herring?

[Parky]

Rather be looking at these accounts than Liverpool's. 

[quayside]

If anyone is interested the St James Holdings accounts have now been filed for year ended 30th June 2009, this is the parent company of NUFC. There are a few points that come out, some of these are already known and some clarify certain rumours that have been doing the rounds.

 

- As at 30th June Ashley's total investment (ie purchase cost plus loan) was £242.9 million. Since the year end the accounts report that he loaned a further £25.5 million making his investment up to £268.4 million.

 

- Obviously, since St James (like NUFC) is in an insolvent position it was necessary for him to personally guarantee to fund it for the next 12 months. Also, as with NUFC, he has shunted all his investment into current creditors instead of creditors due in more than 1 year.

 

- The rumour that Ashley has set up another company to act as the parent to St James Holdings is true.  the company is called MASH Holdings Limited. It is a new company and has not filed any accounts and is not due to do so until late December. If there is any significance to the setting up of this company it is not apparent from the St James accounts.

 

- At one point in the year Ashley's investment had risen to £248.8 million, indicating that between that point and the year end about £6 million of his loan was repaid. This may be where the rumour about Ashley taking money out of the club came from. Although as I said above he put £25.5 million back in some time after he had received this repayment. Ashley has taken no money out by way of interest, salary or dividends.

 

- St James Holdings has a bank overdraft of £36 million, secured on the Group's fixed assets. This is a sharp increase from the previous year end where the overdraft stood at £1 million.

 

- As at the year end the Group was owed £17 million in transfer fees, of which £4 million was due in more than 1 year. The accounts repeat the club's philosophy of paying up front for players purchased even though this is not the case when players are sold, as is apparent from the £17 million still owing.

 

There may be some other points in the accounts which I've missed,  but I've just had a quick look and those are the things that stood out for me.

 

 

 

Thanks Quayside.  Always an interesting read.

 

Just to clarify the bold bits, is it right to say there are now 3 companies....

 

Newcastle united - £20m overdraft

 

Owned by St James Holdiongs - £36m overdraft

 

Owned by MASH Holdings - No figures available

 

Or was the £20m overdraft referenced in the recent club statement a red herring?

 

Yes that's about it although the numbers are a bit different. MASH owns St James which owns Newcastle United Ltd, which owns Newcastle United Football Company Ltd. Overdrafts in the various accounts are:

 

MASH - Unknown

St James - £36m

Newcastle United Ltd - the same £36m as St James

NUFC LTD - £48M

 

I suspect the £20 million figure you quote came from a journalist, and it may be what the bank demanded that the overdraft was reduced to.

 

I am now hoping this thread is not going to head off into the world of how consolidated accounts are prepared....

[jdckelly]

If anyone is interested the St James Holdings accounts have now been filed for year ended 30th June 2009, this is the parent company of NUFC. There are a few points that come out, some of these are already known and some clarify certain rumours that have been doing the rounds.

 

- As at 30th June Ashley's total investment (ie purchase cost plus loan) was £242.9 million. Since the year end the accounts report that he loaned a further £25.5 million making his investment up to £268.4 million.

 

- Obviously, since St James (like NUFC) is in an insolvent position it was necessary for him to personally guarantee to fund it for the next 12 months. Also, as with NUFC, he has shunted all his investment into current creditors instead of creditors due in more than 1 year.

 

- The rumour that Ashley has set up another company to act as the parent to St James Holdings is true.  the company is called MASH Holdings Limited. It is a new company and has not filed any accounts and is not due to do so until late December. If there is any significance to the setting up of this company it is not apparent from the St James accounts.

 

- At one point in the year Ashley's investment had risen to £248.8 million, indicating that between that point and the year end about £6 million of his loan was repaid. This may be where the rumour about Ashley taking money out of the club came from. Although as I said above he put £25.5 million back in some time after he had received this repayment. Ashley has taken no money out by way of interest, salary or dividends.

 

- St James Holdings has a bank overdraft of £36 million, secured on the Group's fixed assets. This is a sharp increase from the previous year end where the overdraft stood at £1 million.

 

- As at the year end the Group was owed £17 million in transfer fees, of which £4 million was due in more than 1 year. The accounts repeat the club's philosophy of paying up front for players purchased even though this is not the case when players are sold, as is apparent from the £17 million still owing.

 

There may be some other points in the accounts which I've missed,  but I've just had a quick look and those are the things that stood out for me.

 

 

 

Thanks Quayside.  Always an interesting read.

 

Just to clarify the bold bits, is it right to say there are now 3 companies....

 

Newcastle united - £20m overdraft

 

Owned by St James Holdiongs - £36m overdraft

 

Owned by MASH Holdings - No figures available

 

Or was the £20m overdraft referenced in the recent club statement a red herring?

 

Yes that's about it although the numbers are a bit different. MASH owns St James which owns Newcastle United Ltd, which owns Newcastle United Football Club Ltd. Overdrafts in the various accounts are:

 

MASH - Unknown

St James - £36m

Newcastle United Ltd - the same £36m as St James

NUFC LTD - £48M

 

I suspect the £20 million figure you quote came from a journalist, and it may be what the bank demanded that the overdraft was reduced to.

 

I am now hoping this thread is not going to head off into the world of how consolidated accounts are prepared....

do go on

[quayside]

I'd rather not - but some people may wonder why NUFC had an overdraft of £48m and the Group only had £36m, and I'd rather they didn't.