cp40 Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 we were favoured for relegation by a good number of people at the start of the season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 What do you think the minimum should be Ian? This season, top 10 would be progress and top 6 would be unreal. He has managed us into a position where 4th or 5th is achievable, but I don't think it's fair to suddenly revise expectations because of the good job he's done so far. Our squad isn't that good, 3/4 of our first team is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 I'm all for being positive, but do people genuinely believe that our SQUAD is even close to the strength of Man City, Man Utd, Spurs, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool? Becuase it really really isn't. it's pretty close to liverpool. their squad is a step down from the rest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 i'd say 7th is our natural level at the moment, so anyone who gets us to 7th has done their job. anything above that is over-achieving, so credit to pardew for having us in 6th at the moment, even if i think we've gotten worse as the season has gone on, he has some deep flaws and has made mistakes along the way. we do have some excellent players in the side, some of whom haven't been used all that well, but we also have championship players like Simpson and Williamson, as well as mediocre players like Raylor and Obertan. so i wouldn't say we're better than liverpool. Agree, problem with Pardew is he persists with the mediocre players though. Guthrie or ben Arfa should be ahead of Obertan or even Raylor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minhosa Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 6th is the minimum we should be looking at? No wonder the manager doesn't stand a chance. In this division, with the squad he has at his disposal, yes. He has 3/4 of a good first team that should be top 6 quality, the rest is bottom 3 material really. Ian, you've only got to look at the lack of quality around us to know that top 6 should be where we are aiming. We've got a spine of a team that verging on C.L quality imho with Krul, Colo, Cabate, Tiote and the Dembii. His should be concentrating his efforts on getting the fuckers wide of this lot to perform to a level condusive to the rest imho. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 3 or 4 players good enough for the top seven? Is that a joke? Krul, Colo, Santon, HBA, Cabaye, Tiote, Cisse and Ba - there's 8, there's only 11 in a team! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 What do you think the minimum should be Ian? This season, top 10 would be progress and top 6 would be unreal. He has managed us into a position where 4th or 5th is achievable, but I don't think it's fair to suddenly revise expectations because of the good job he's done so far. Our squad isn't that good, 3/4 of our first team is. Norwich are 8th. So if they finish above us we should still be happy? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Prophet has it pretty much bang on and at the start of the season I think between 7th and 10th would have been a successful, or decent season. With this squad we are definitely over-achieving, saying as we're within touching distance of fourth. Chelsea could struggle at WBA next weekend and Arsenal and Liverpool might draw. So once we beat the scum we're right back amongst it.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 What do you think the minimum should be Ian? This season, top 10 would be progress and top 6 would be unreal. He has managed us into a position where 4th or 5th is achievable, but I don't think it's fair to suddenly revise expectations because of the good job he's done so far. Our squad isn't that good, 3/4 of our first team is. Norwich are 8th. So if they finish above us we should still be happy? I don't understand the point of the question. I've already said what I think would be a fair finish, I don't give a fuck where Norwich end up. I mean, if Arsenal finish 11th is it OK for us to finish 12th? It's a pointless argument. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagten Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Has anyone else noticed our tendency to float balls in at set pieces. Pardews doing? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 6th is the minimum we should be looking at? No wonder the manager doesn't stand a chance. In this division, with the squad he has at his disposal, yes. He has 3/4 of a good first team that should be top 6 quality, the rest is bottom 3 material really. Ian, you've only got to look at the lack of quality around us to know that top 6 should be where we are aiming. We've got a spine of a team that verging on C.L quality imho with Krul, Colo, Cabate, Tiote and the Dembii. His should be concentrating his efforts on getting the fuckers wide of this lot to perform to a level condusive to the rest imho. As I said, the majority of the first team are good players but the rest of the squad aren't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Prophet has it pretty much bang on and at the start of the season I think between 7th and 10th would have been a successful, or decent season. With this squad we are definitely over-achieving, saying as we're within touching distance of fourth. Chelsea could struggle at WBA next weekend and Arsenal and Liverpool might draw. So once we beat the scum we're right back amongst it.. As stated before, we are better than all these teams from 8th to 20th. We should finish 7th, anything else is a failure. Norwich, WBA and Sunderland will probably fight for the number 8th spot, and any of them above us would boil my piss ffs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Seriously why the fuck does everyone keep going on about Norwich, if we qualify for the Champions League and Norwich finish 6th does that mean we should have won the league. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 I disagree. There have been some underlying tactical flaws that have been prevalent within our game throughout the season. I don't perceive pardew to responsible for our current standing. Our margins have been small and we have been fortunate, there can be no denial of that. Benefited by the brilliance of a ba and the astuteness of carr, that has masked our inability to develop any style of sorts, and a tactical game plan in which our best players can come to the fore. If the reason for our ascent is only the brilliance of certain individuals, surely you can say that the turgid shite like Simpson, Obertan and (to a lesser extent) Williamson have prevented us from getting higher. Pards is rough around the edges, but we've got an unripe squad that is still incredibly unbalanced. Pardew isn't blameless for the really awful results this season (ie, yesterday and WBA), but the reality is we're not good enough to be higher than what we are. I agree with those that say the Top 4 is penetrable, but if you compare the squads, i'd still put us miles behind Chelsea and Arsenal. I don't know why we didn't win yesterday. Pards fucked up with the subs - you don't bring two players on when you're defending a dangerous FK - and all of the players were generally poor. It isn't the manager's fault that Danny Guthrie couldn't pass the ball ten feet across the grass. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Prophet has it pretty much bang on and at the start of the season I think between 7th and 10th would have been a successful, or decent season. With this squad we are definitely over-achieving, saying as we're within touching distance of fourth. Chelsea could struggle at WBA next weekend and Arsenal and Liverpool might draw. So once we beat the scum we're right back amongst it.. As stated before, we are better than all these teams from 8th to 20th. We should finish 7th, anything else is a failure. Norwich, WBA and Sunderland will probably fight for the number 8th spot, and any of them above us would boil my p*ss ffs. I agree with that, but there clubs who were in and around these positions at the end of last season who you would have expected to be in and around there this season. Said clubs have under-achieved. I would be well and truly fucked off if we finished below 7th now, but at the same time, I would have took 8th or 9th at the start of the season. you have to take the rough with the smooth. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Seriously why the f*** does everyone keep going on about Norwich, if we qualify for the Champions League and Norwich finish 6th does that mean we should have won the league. Obviously not, however it does prove that this - massive over-achieving - because we were in the Championship two seasons ago is a crap and utter ridiculous argument. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minhosa Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 6th is the minimum we should be looking at? No wonder the manager doesn't stand a chance. In this division, with the squad he has at his disposal, yes. He has 3/4 of a good first team that should be top 6 quality, the rest is bottom 3 material really. Ian, you've only got to look at the lack of quality around us to know that top 6 should be where we are aiming. We've got a spine of a team that verging on C.L quality imho with Krul, Colo, Cabate, Tiote and the Dembii. His should be concentrating his efforts on getting the fuckers wide of this lot to perform to a level condusive to the rest imho. As I said, the majority of the first team are good players but the rest of the squad aren't. So, on that basis, surely you must fancy us to progres up the table given this if first time we've got a chance of a run of them together with Tiote, Cisse and Ba back? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 This season, top 10 would be progress and top 6 would be unreal. He has managed us into a position where 4th or 5th is achievable, but I don't think it's fair to suddenly revise expectations because of the good job he's done so far. Our squad isn't that good, 3/4 of our first team is. We were 1 point off top 10 last season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Seriously why the f*** does everyone keep going on about Norwich, if we qualify for the Champions League and Norwich finish 6th does that mean we should have won the league. Obviously not, however it does prove that this - massive over-achieving - because we were in the Championship two seasons ago is a crap and utter ridiculous argument. Lets just see where they are next season before we start jumping to those conclusions, still a long way to go yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 This season, top 10 would be progress and top 6 would be unreal. He has managed us into a position where 4th or 5th is achievable, but I don't think it's fair to suddenly revise expectations because of the good job he's done so far. Our squad isn't that good, 3/4 of our first team is. We were 1 point off top 10 last season. we were basically 8th until the players inexplicably went off on their hols 30 mins before the season ended. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 6th is the minimum we should be looking at? No wonder the manager doesn't stand a chance. In this division, with the squad he has at his disposal, yes. He has 3/4 of a good first team that should be top 6 quality, the rest is bottom 3 material really. Ian, you've only got to look at the lack of quality around us to know that top 6 should be where we are aiming. We've got a spine of a team that verging on C.L quality imho with Krul, Colo, Cabate, Tiote and the Dembii. His should be concentrating his efforts on getting the fuckers wide of this lot to perform to a level condusive to the rest imho. As I said, the majority of the first team are good players but the rest of the squad aren't. So, on that basis, surely you must fancy us to progres up the table given this if first time we've got a chance of a run of them together with Tiote, Cisse and Ba back? I hope we'll do well, aye, whether we progress up the table depends on a lot of other teams as well. The rest of the squad, and Pardew, have to take credit for how they ground out some results when most people expected us to drop down the table. It doesn't necessarily follow that we'll start shooting up the league now, I hope we start picking up a good number of points though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Seriously why the f*** does everyone keep going on about Norwich, if we qualify for the Champions League and Norwich finish 6th does that mean we should have won the league. Obviously not, however it does prove that this - massive over-achieving - because we were in the Championship two seasons ago is a crap and utter ridiculous argument. Lets just see where they are next season before we start jumping to those conclusions, still a long way to go yet. ? Well we might be relegated next season, whats your point? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughesy Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 I want to know where all these people who are now saying 6th is a bare minimum for our league position were at the beginning of the season. Because I don't remember there being many ppl, if any, who said that. And that was with the squad as it now is, bar Cisse. Expectations have shot through the roof as a result of our start. We do not have s squad close to the top 6. So to be where we are is a great achievement. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minhosa Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 I want to know where all these people who are now saying 6th is a bare minimum for our league position were at the beginning of the season. Because I don't remember there being many ppl, if any, who said that. And that was with the squad as it now is, bar Cisse. Expectations have shot through the roof as a result of our start. We do not have s squad close to the top 6. So to be where we are is a great achievement. Well that and the fact no bugger else is anywhere near challenging. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 I want to know where all these people who are now saying 6th is a bare minimum for our league position were at the beginning of the season. Because I don't remember there being many ppl, if any, who said that. And that was with the squad as it now is, bar Cisse. Expectations have shot through the roof as a result of our start. We do not have s squad close to the top 6. So to be where we are is a great achievement. Exactly, it's like if we were fourth now people would be saying the minimum is to win the league or something. I can't recall anyone predicting Europe or anywhere near it at the start of the season. And when we went up to sixth I don't think many people were saying it wasn't a big achievement because it was the minimum we should expect. People need to think about what we were expecting at the start of the season, it's been a great campaign so far. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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