BONTEMPI Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 We should have never sold Best Certainly not if Ba fucks off and fatty arbuckle isn't preprared to take one in the balls just to get a couple of strikers over the line. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 We should have never sold Best Certainly not if Ba fucks off and fatty arbuckle isn't preprared to take one in the balls just to get a couple of strikers over the line. To put it in context we would be trying to replace to two for £5m each. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderson Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 The thing is, just as an example, say we replace Ba with Hoilett, it would lead us to play in a more rigid formation almost resembling a 4-5-1. That's because someone like him would be too similar to Ben Arfa so you'd end up with those two on either wing with Cisse having to stay completely central, so you're essentially restricting both Cisse and Ben Arfa and tying them down to one specific position, which would be to the detriment of the team. It's a subtle, but, IMO, massive change. Obviously, like Shak suggested, someone like Remy who is capable of playing both centrally as a striker and out wide would be ideal, but I don't think there are many players in that mould and more importantly players like that who would be available to us. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I can only guess that the people who think Ba going wouldn't be a problem don't actually go to games and think he must have been shite because he wasn't scoring. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 The thing is, just as an example, say we replace Ba with Hoilett, it would lead us to play in a more rigid formation almost resembling a 4-5-1. That's because someone like him would be too similar to Ben Arfa so you'd end up with those two on either wing with Cisse having to stay completely central, so you're essentially restricting both Cisse and Ben Arfa and tying them down to one specific position, which would be to the detriment of the team. It's a subtle, but, IMO, massive change. Obviously, like Shak suggested, someone like Remy who is capable of playing both centrally as a striker and out wide would be ideal, but I don't think there are many players in that mould and more importantly players like that who would be available to us. I can only guess that the people who think Ba going wouldn't be a problem don't actually go to games and think he must have been shite because he wasn't scoring. Completely agree (despite not being to a game in a while...). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderson Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I can only guess that the people who think Ba going wouldn't be a problem don't actually go to games and think he must have been shite because he wasn't scoring. Definitely. I'd be willing to wager a fair amount that if Ba had offered the same level of performances in the second half of the season, but managed to net a couple tap-ins that there would be non of this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shak Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I can only guess that the people who think Ba going wouldn't be a problem don't actually go to games and think he must have been shite because he wasn't scoring. No, as I said I think he's a good player but if he's going to refuse to play in the position that he occupied when the team played by far it's best football last year then that's a problem. Nice snide dig all the same. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I can only guess that the people who think Ba going wouldn't be a problem don't actually go to games and think he must have been s**** because he wasn't scoring. are many saying it wouldn't be a problem ? just not a problem of the cisse, colo, tiote or cabaye leaving magnitude Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Duper Branko Strupar Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 He'll not go Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 No, as I said I think he's a good player but if he's going to refuse to play in the position that he occupied when the team played by far it's best football last year then that's a problem. Nice snide dig all the same. It wasn't aimed at you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATB Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Excuse me. But for f*** sake. Not many here wants to sell him just like that. Just questing his starting position. We already are short of forwards and I think that you at least should have 3 really good ones and 1 up and coming. Right now - with Ba - we only have him and Cissé. Shola. nja. Good for 15-20 minutes, at best. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Excuse me. But for fuck sake. Not many here wants to sell him just like that. Just questing his starting position. We already are short of forwards and I think that you at least should have 3 really good ones and 1 up and coming. I think any comments are directed to those who aren't bothered about him leaving, just a hunch though mind Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Chances are he'll come good again IMO. Towards the end of the season he was getting more and more chances. A couple of those hit the net and he'll be firing again. There are issues with whether he's ideal for a 4-3-3, but it remains to be seen if we'll even be playing that system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 are many saying it wouldn't be a problem ? just not a problem of the cisse, colo, tiote or cabaye leaving magnitude I didn't say that "many" were saying it wouldn't be a problem. Also Ba had as good a first half of the season as Cisse had a 2nd half so why is losing Ba less of a problem? Ba has a record which is close to a goal every other game for us, he didn't do that by luck, I would say that it was bad luck that kept his record lower than it deserved to be. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 are many saying it wouldn't be a problem ? just not a problem of the cisse, colo, tiote or cabaye leaving magnitude I didn't say that "many" were saying it wouldn't be a problem. Also Ba had as good a first half of the season as Cisse had a 2nd half so why is losing Ba less of a problem? Ba has a record which is close to a goal every other game for us, he didn't do that by luck, I would say that it was bad luck that kept his record lower than it deserved to be. ba had a good start due to the way we played. as the style changed so did his performances. the move in position affetcted him to the point where the ball stuck to him early on in the season in a way it didn't later on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 ba had a good start due to the way we played. as the style changed so did his performances. the move in position affetcted him to the point where the ball stuck to him early on in the season in a way it didn't later on. I thought Ba mainly played well on the left, the main difference was bad luck and he was having shots in the 2nd half of the season which were going in during the 1st half. I didn't see much of a decrease in his performances, just his goals tally. I watched a prolific goal scorer in the first half of the season who proved in the 2nd half of the season that he can offer more than just goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 ba had a good start due to the way we played. as the style changed so did his performances. the move in position affetcted him to the point where the ball stuck to him early on in the season in a way it didn't later on. I thought Ba mainly played well on the left, the main difference was bad luck and he was having shots in the 2nd half of the season which were going in during the 1st half. I didn't see much of a decrease in his performances, just his goals tally. I watched a prolific goal scorer in the first half of the season who proved in the 2nd half of the season that he can offer more than just goals. i saw that same player in the first half of the season. in the second half i watched a through the middle striker lose confidence through playing wider. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 i saw that same player in the first half of the season. in the second half i watched a through the middle striker lose confidence through playing wider. He played well throughout the season with a few games where he didn't perform, a bit like every other player last season apart from cisse who wasn't here for the full season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
midds Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Losing Ba at this stage in the pre-season would be a massive blow, no point sugar-coating it. He's proven to be a fantastic striker and a very good footballer in the final third for us. To lose him now, coupled with letting Best go too, would be a big headache for us. We need another quality forward/striker in as it stands now, losing Ba means we need 2. And quality forwards are hard to come by. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 i saw that same player in the first half of the season. in the second half i watched a through the middle striker lose confidence through playing wider. He played well throughout the season with a few games where he didn't perform, a bit like every other player last season apart from cisse who wasn't here for the full season. in a way yes, but the longer he was played wide the more the performances werent what they had been. keep him playing wide and i can only see it going one way. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shak Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 No, as I said I think he's a good player but if he's going to refuse to play in the position that he occupied when the team played by far it's best football last year then that's a problem. Nice snide dig all the same. It wasn't aimed at you. Mick, you spent most of last year complaining about how poor our football was. It was only when we switched to 4-3-3 and brought in Ben Arfa that it improved. I'd be happy for Ba to keep playing that spot out left but he's seemingly made it clear he doesn't want to do so. Only option I can see for Pardew in that case is to revert to a 4-4-2, does that not concern you at all? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 No, as I said I think he's a good player but if he's going to refuse to play in the position that he occupied when the team played by far it's best football last year then that's a problem. Nice snide dig all the same. It wasn't aimed at you. Mick, you spent most of last year complaining about how poor our football was. It was only when we switched to 4-3-3 and brought in Ben Arfa that it improved. I'd be happy for Ba to keep playing that spot out left but he's seemingly made it clear he doesn't want to do so. Only option I can see for Pardew in that case is to revert to a 4-4-2, does that not concern you at all? with debuchy (i know) and santon we could have a 4-4-2 that wasn't a 4-4-2 that could work with a forward 2 and get the best out of the squad. with the current squad though 4-4-2 isn't getting the best out of it and playing ba wider won't get the best out of him and (in my opinion) will want to be off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BooBoo Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Post January Ba was somewhere between average and poor on the whole although in one or two games he did well in a selfless role. He looked a round peg in a square hole. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sifu Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 One competitive goal - that elusive one goal is all he needs to get himself up and running again. He'll be fine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 Having to cope with losing Ba because someone invokes his release clause and he wants to go is one thing, it's the way some seem to imply that he's holding us back which baffles me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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