Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 The sad thing about all of this is that in NUFC he has something that could be huge, mega fucking huge. Globally we already a "brand" but we could be so so much more. With some ambition and money we could be playing at the Nou Camp in front of 90,000 people with tens of millions watching world-wide, competing for honours. We are arguably Europe's biggest sleeping giant. Under Ashley though we are credible relegation candidates.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 The sad thing about all of this is that in NUFC he has something that could be huge, mega fucking huge. Globally we already a "brand" but we could be so so much more. With some ambition and money we could be playing at the Nou Camp in front of 90,000 people with tens of millions watching world-wide, competing for honours. We are arguably Europe's biggest sleeping giant. Under Ashley though we are credible relegation candidates.... The club has huge potential, but that would require investment and vision. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 The sad thing about all of this is that in NUFC he has something that could be huge, mega fucking huge. Globally we already a "brand" but we could be so so much more. With some ambition and money we could be playing at the Nou Camp in front of 90,000 people with tens of millions watching world-wide, competing for honours. We are arguably Europe's biggest sleeping giant. Under Ashley though we are credible relegation candidates.... Maybe once, but I genuinely don't believe we have that potential any more. A lot of fans will never return fully, they know the next shitstorm would just be round the corner. Also loads of other clubs have stolen the march abroad and we won't ever get a foothold in those markets. Most we can ever expect is to pop in and out of the CL, maybe win the FA cup. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 The sad thing about all of this is that in NUFC he has something that could be huge, mega f***ing huge. Globally we already a "brand" but we could be so so much more. With some ambition and money we could be playing at the Nou Camp in front of 90,000 people with tens of millions watching world-wide, competing for honours. We are arguably Europe's biggest sleeping giant. Under Ashley though we are credible relegation candidates.... Wants his money out...if he reinvested what the club makes on its own and allowed sponsor space on th stadium we could generate enough to pay him back quicker and maybe be a better product to sell. Madness, we've done all this before. Wants his cash back asap, the club and fans will sufer as he plays the dangerous game of running it on a shoe string. Like a taxi driver putting the bare minimum of petrol into his car for a nights work...he'll end up running out one night. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I thought it was 60 mil per season for 3 seasons. Could pay it off tgat way but we would be on the bones of our arse for 3 more season...while every other team progresses. Ashley will be nearing being paid off tho Its on average an extra £15-18m every season for 3 seasons. Take that off the debt and the club could probably be bought for a minus £200m outlay, much more likely. It's more than that, if you finish bottom of the league, it's an extra £23m on top of what the bottom club received last season, if you finish top, around £40m extra. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 The sad thing about all of this is that in NUFC he has something that could be huge, mega f***ing huge. Globally we already a "brand" but we could be so so much more. With some ambition and money we could be playing at the Nou Camp in front of 90,000 people with tens of millions watching world-wide, competing for honours. We are arguably Europe's biggest sleeping giant. Under Ashley though we are credible relegation candidates.... Maybe once, but I genuinely don't believe we have that potential any more. A lot of fans will never return fully, they know the next shitstorm would just be round the corner. Also loads of other clubs have stolen the march abroad and we won't ever get a foothold in those markets. Most we can ever expect is to pop in and out of the CL, maybe win the FA cup. Nah, i think its there but will take some real doing. I think the sigh of relief (if) when ashley leaves will be massive...until we find out the new buyer is another cluess pleb. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanSkÃrare Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Imagine the feeling if someone with acutal visions and ambition comes in after his tenure of torture. That's a nice thing. No matter how fucked up things are, we're just around the corner. It won't take much to have us back up there. Can't wait. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Going over old ground here, but can anybody explain to me why there appears to be this mass assumption that whatever debt gets paid off will be taken off the asking price? It doesn't make any sens to me at all in the real world, where a company's value is based on its assets and profitability mainly. The assets remain the same, and the company would be more profitable for the debt repayments to take place, no? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Going over old ground here, but can anybody explain to me why there appears to be this mass assumption that whatever debt gets paid off will be taken off the asking price? It doesn't make any sens to me at all in the real world, where a company's value is based on its assets and profitability mainly. The assets remain the same, and the company would be more profitable for the debt repayments to take place, no? The club's not worth 300m. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Going over old ground here, but can anybody explain to me why there appears to be this mass assumption that whatever debt gets paid off will be taken off the asking price? It doesn't make any sens to me at all in the real world, where a company's value is based on its assets and profitability mainly. The assets remain the same, and the company would be more profitable for the debt repayments to take place, no? yep Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 The sad thing about all of this is that in NUFC he has something that could be huge, mega f***ing huge. Globally we already a "brand" but we could be so so much more. With some ambition and money we could be playing at the Nou Camp in front of 90,000 people with tens of millions watching world-wide, competing for honours. We are arguably Europe's biggest sleeping giant. Under Ashley though we are credible relegation candidates.... Maybe once, but I genuinely don't believe we have that potential any more. A lot of fans will never return fully, they know the next shitstorm would just be round the corner. Also loads of other clubs have stolen the march abroad and we won't ever get a foothold in those markets. Most we can ever expect is to pop in and out of the CL, maybe win the FA cup. I do, football is fickle. A few years ago Chelsea and Man City were a bit like us today, possible relegation candidates. Ambition and money, albeit a huge fucking amount, sees them at the very top of the table of world football powers so to speak. Spurs are the template like. We can do it, we can compete, we can aim high and do good things. We have the tools but we lack the craftsmen... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Going over old ground here, but can anybody explain to me why there appears to be this mass assumption that whatever debt gets paid off will be taken off the asking price? It doesn't make any sens to me at all in the real world, where a company's value is based on its assets and profitability mainly. The assets remain the same, and the company would be more profitable for the debt repayments to take place, no? The club's not worth 300m. Huh? My point is this: why would a company with 100 million in debt and posting yearly losses be MORE valuable to a prospective buyer than one (same assets) with no debts and posting a 20 million or so yearly profit? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
quayside Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Going over old ground here, but can anybody explain to me why there appears to be this mass assumption that whatever debt gets paid off will be taken off the asking price? It doesn't make any sens to me at all in the real world, where a company's value is based on its assets and profitability mainly. The assets remain the same, and the company would be more profitable for the debt repayments to take place, no? The club's not worth 300m. Huh? My point is this: why would a company with 100 million in debt and posting yearly losses be MORE valuable to a prospective buyer than one (same assets) with no debts and posting a 20 million or so yearly profit? Can see your point but I think the key to this is that it has always been assumed that Ashley would aim at least to get back what he had spent on the club. So say he spent £140 million buying it and then put another £110 million in as loan, he's out of pocket by £250 million. So if he's selling the club then the assumption is he'd want that sum (at least) for the club to cover his costs. On the other hand if he ever manages to recover all of the debt out of the clubs cash flows then he would only be out of pocket by £140 million. So if he sold the club at that point for say £200 million he's made a £60 million profit overall. And potentially therefore the asking price for the club could be less without the debt. I don't know if that helps... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Going over old ground here, but can anybody explain to me why there appears to be this mass assumption that whatever debt gets paid off will be taken off the asking price? It doesn't make any sens to me at all in the real world, where a company's value is based on its assets and profitability mainly. The assets remain the same, and the company would be more profitable for the debt repayments to take place, no? The club's not worth 300m. Huh? My point is this: why would a company with 100 million in debt and posting yearly losses be MORE valuable to a prospective buyer than one (same assets) with no debts and posting a 20 million or so yearly profit? Can see your point but I think the key to this is that it has always been assumed that Ashley would aim at least to get back what he had spent on the club. So say he spent £140 million buying it and then put another £110 in as loan, he's out of pocket by £250 million. So if he's selling the club then the assumption is he's want that sum (at least) for the club to cover his costs. On the other hand if he ever manages to recover all of the debt out of the clubs cash flows then he would only be out of pocket by £140 million. So if he sold the club at that point for say £200 million he's made a £60 million profit overall. And potentially therefore the asking price for the club could be less without the debt. I don't know if that helps... He could, say in 5 years have the debt cleared by running us on the bare minimum...Once its all paid off, why sell? Could be a nice little earner and free sponsorship for his flagship company. The club (business) has paid for itself and is now passing profit his way without having to do much. The next TV deal will only get bigger imho...BT are going to push sky and with the economy slowly picking up it could be a good earner for Ashley. He could be here 20 years or more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
henke Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Going over old ground here, but can anybody explain to me why there appears to be this mass assumption that whatever debt gets paid off will be taken off the asking price? It doesn't make any sens to me at all in the real world, where a company's value is based on its assets and profitability mainly. The assets remain the same, and the company would be more profitable for the debt repayments to take place, no? The club's not worth 300m. Huh? My point is this: why would a company with 100 million in debt and posting yearly losses be MORE valuable to a prospective buyer than one (same assets) with no debts and posting a 20 million or so yearly profit? Can see your point but I think the key to this is that it has always been assumed that Ashley would aim at least to get back what he had spent on the club. So say he spent £140 million buying it and then put another £110 in as loan, he's out of pocket by £250 million. So if he's selling the club then the assumption is he's want that sum (at least) for the club to cover his costs. On the other hand if he ever manages to recover all of the debt out of the clubs cash flows then he would only be out of pocket by £140 million. So if he sold the club at that point for say £200 million he's made a £60 million profit overall. And potentially therefore the asking price for the club could be less without the debt. I don't know if that helps... He could, say in 5 years have the debt cleared by running us on the bare minimum...Once its all paid off, why sell? Could be a nice little earner and free sponsorship for his flagship company. The club (business) has paid for itself and is now passing profit his way without having to do much. The next TV deal will only get bigger imho...BT are going to push sky and with the economy slowly picking up it could be a good earner for Ashley. He could be here 20 years or more. I've been saying that for a while. If you have a business earning you twenty mil a year, why would you get rid? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Going over old ground here, but can anybody explain to me why there appears to be this mass assumption that whatever debt gets paid off will be taken off the asking price? It doesn't make any sens to me at all in the real world, where a company's value is based on its assets and profitability mainly. The assets remain the same, and the company would be more profitable for the debt repayments to take place, no? The club's not worth 300m. Huh? My point is this: why would a company with 100 million in debt and posting yearly losses be MORE valuable to a prospective buyer than one (same assets) with no debts and posting a 20 million or so yearly profit? Can see your point but I think the key to this is that it has always been assumed that Ashley would aim at least to get back what he had spent on the club. So say he spent £140 million buying it and then put another £110 in as loan, he's out of pocket by £250 million. So if he's selling the club then the assumption is he's want that sum (at least) for the club to cover his costs. On the other hand if he ever manages to recover all of the debt out of the clubs cash flows then he would only be out of pocket by £140 million. So if he sold the club at that point for say £200 million he's made a £60 million profit overall. And potentially therefore the asking price for the club could be less without the debt. I don't know if that helps... He could, say in 5 years have the debt cleared by running us on the bare minimum...Once its all paid off, why sell? Could be a nice little earner and free sponsorship for his flagship company. The club (business) has paid for itself and is now passing profit his way without having to do much. The next TV deal will only get bigger imho...BT are going to push sky and with the economy slowly picking up it could be a good earner for Ashley. He could be here 20 years or more. I've been saying that for a while. If you have a business earning you twenty mil a year, why would you get rid? The sale value would massively go up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Going over old ground here, but can anybody explain to me why there appears to be this mass assumption that whatever debt gets paid off will be taken off the asking price? It doesn't make any sens to me at all in the real world, where a company's value is based on its assets and profitability mainly. The assets remain the same, and the company would be more profitable for the debt repayments to take place, no? The club's not worth 300m. Huh? My point is this: why would a company with 100 million in debt and posting yearly losses be MORE valuable to a prospective buyer than one (same assets) with no debts and posting a 20 million or so yearly profit? Can see your point but I think the key to this is that it has always been assumed that Ashley would aim at least to get back what he had spent on the club. So say he spent £140 million buying it and then put another £110 in as loan, he's out of pocket by £250 million. So if he's selling the club then the assumption is he's want that sum (at least) for the club to cover his costs. On the other hand if he ever manages to recover all of the debt out of the clubs cash flows then he would only be out of pocket by £140 million. So if he sold the club at that point for say £200 million he's made a £60 million profit overall. And potentially therefore the asking price for the club could be less without the debt. I don't know if that helps... He could, say in 5 years have the debt cleared by running us on the bare minimum...Once its all paid off, why sell? Could be a nice little earner and free sponsorship for his flagship company. The club (business) has paid for itself and is now passing profit his way without having to do much. The next TV deal will only get bigger imho...BT are going to push sky and with the economy slowly picking up it could be a good earner for Ashley. He could be here 20 years or more. http://i.imgur.com/TZ9uB.gif Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I think he wants an exit though in all honesty. Pontious Pilate style. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I think he wants an exit though in all honesty. Pontious Pilate style. He nailed the chosen to a cross before he did one tho. Apparently. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I think he wants an exit though in all honesty. Pontious Pilate style. He nailed the chosen to a cross before he did one tho. Apparently. Well there is defintiely more blood to be shed before the end. We in a war of attrition. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I think he wants an exit though in all honesty. Pontious Pilate style. He nailed the chosen to a cross before he did one tho. Apparently. Well there is defintiely more blood to be shed before the end. We in a war of attrition. 35k season ticket sales say he is winning. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I think he wants an exit though in all honesty. Pontious Pilate style. He nailed the chosen to a cross before he did one tho. Apparently. Well there is defintiely more blood to be shed before the end. We in a war of attrition. 35k season ticket sales say he is winning. Well quite. We're at the destruction of Alderaan rather than the deathstar trench. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Geordie Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 A huge drop in s/t sales will be the only thing to convince him to move on. How many or wor lot are gonna shell out £600 a season to watch a team that has even less ambition then we did under McKeag? I know a lot of packed in, some are going to with others thinking about it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Haris Vuckic Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Season ticket sales are a drop in the ocean compared to TV money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Season ticket sales are a drop in the ocean compared to TV money. He'd not be able to run the club on shoe string if the season ticket money went up in smoke. Funding a club with TV money alone and small crowds wouldn't work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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