Disco Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:15, Wullie said: I'm not really interested in aesthetics, I'm only interested in getting the best out of the players we have. A direct style when we played with Barton, Carroll and Nolan I enjoyed watching because that was the style that suited our players - we created plenty of chances and scored plenty goals. I think we play far more long balls now than we did then and with players who clearly prefer it into feet and it clearly does not work. I have no issue with us playing more 'direct' football either but to do that you need a certain type of personnel and gameplan, at the moment we don't appear to have either. There is a difference between focused 'direct' and just hoying it 'long', at the moment we're the latter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtype Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:29, Interpolic said: Quote I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. Find that very far fetched personally. I find the idea that Pardew would specifically instruct the players to always just lump it forward to be significantly less probable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:29, Interpolic said: Quote I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. Find that very far fetched personally. Same. Williamson, Simpson and Cabaye are lesser players in our squad who do most of the long balls... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:31, oldtype said: Quote Quote I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. Find that very far fetched personally. I find the idea that Pardew would specifically instruct the players to always just lump it forward to be significantly less probable. He's stated in previous interviews that he likes for our midfielders to try and "hit the front men early". It's not much of a stretch from there! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:31, oldtype said: Quote Quote I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. Find that very far fetched personally. I find the idea that Pardew would specifically instruct the players to always just lump it forward to be significantly less probable. I've added to my post, I think it's mainly due to his conservative and overly defensive approach tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:28, Inochi said: Quote Quote I don't get it. What are we complaining about? Is it purely an aesthetics thing? Or, is it results driven? The thing is Inochi, IMO (and maybe this is where we diverge in footballing philosophy terms ), results eventually follow performances. It may take five games, it may take ten, it may take forty-eight () but a failure to address our inability/unwillingness to control games - particularly against weaker opposition (the Norwichs, QPRs, Wolves, Blackburns etc) will begin to effect results too, because any streak of results which isn't driven by performance is very, very vulnerable to a loss of momentum*. I fear for our immediate future. [* - except for those teams who wholeheartedly and unashamedly commit to grinding - ie. Stoke, who consequently also have a glass ceiling on how good they can ever be - something we do not want] Within reason, I just like to see us winning games and being successful. It's likely because of this that I'm not overly concerned with the particulars of last season. I don't particularly fear for our future, because the evidence is there, from our past, that we are well equipped to perform admirably in this league. I expect results and performances to improve. I do worry, however, that some will never be happy. Agree that some will never be happy. Think most would be if we fulfilled our potential. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudil Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:18, oldtype said: I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. Nah, the fundamental problem is that we spend little to no time coaching attacking play which results in the disjointed football seen for the vast majority of last season, and this season. This much is easy to decipher and has been more or less alluded to by the management. Surely everyone can agree that this is the fundamental problem with our poor play!? So essentially,unless Pardew changes his philosophy significantly the same problems will persist as long as Pardew is here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:34, Beren said: Quote Quote Quote I don't get it. What are we complaining about? Is it purely an aesthetics thing? Or, is it results driven? The thing is Inochi, IMO (and maybe this is where we diverge in footballing philosophy terms ), results eventually follow performances. It may take five games, it may take ten, it may take forty-eight () but a failure to address our inability/unwillingness to control games - particularly against weaker opposition (the Norwichs, QPRs, Wolves, Blackburns etc) will begin to effect results too, because any streak of results which isn't driven by performance is very, very vulnerable to a loss of momentum*. I fear for our immediate future. [* - except for those teams who wholeheartedly and unashamedly commit to grinding - ie. Stoke, who consequently also have a glass ceiling on how good they can ever be - something we do not want] Within reason, I just like to see us winning games and being successful. It's likely because of this that I'm not overly concerned with the particulars of last season. I don't particularly fear for our future, because the evidence is there, from our past, that we are well equipped to perform admirably in this league. I expect results and performances to improve. I do worry, however, that some will never be happy. Agree that some will never be happy. Think most would be if we fulfilled our potential. What is our potential? With our current squad, that is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I think it's very naive to believe that the players are playing it long against the manager's instructions and simply because they're incompetent. Cabaye and Colo both play significantly more long balls than Williamson and Simpson for a start, which I have been saying for months and months. It's clearly the way the manager wants to play, with the intention that the ball gets to our dangerous players as soon as possible and no-one's in any danger of being caught out of position. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:35, Inochi said: Quote Quote Quote Quote I don't get it. What are we complaining about? Is it purely an aesthetics thing? Or, is it results driven? The thing is Inochi, IMO (and maybe this is where we diverge in footballing philosophy terms ), results eventually follow performances. It may take five games, it may take ten, it may take forty-eight () but a failure to address our inability/unwillingness to control games - particularly against weaker opposition (the Norwichs, QPRs, Wolves, Blackburns etc) will begin to effect results too, because any streak of results which isn't driven by performance is very, very vulnerable to a loss of momentum*. I fear for our immediate future. [* - except for those teams who wholeheartedly and unashamedly commit to grinding - ie. Stoke, who consequently also have a glass ceiling on how good they can ever be - something we do not want] Within reason, I just like to see us winning games and being successful. It's likely because of this that I'm not overly concerned with the particulars of last season. I don't particularly fear for our future, because the evidence is there, from our past, that we are well equipped to perform admirably in this league. I expect results and performances to improve. I do worry, however, that some will never be happy. Agree that some will never be happy. Think most would be if we fulfilled our potential. What is our potential? With our current squad, that is. Pardew said we could challenge 4th () so something between that and 8th. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:35, Inochi said: Quote Quote Quote Quote I don't get it. What are we complaining about? Is it purely an aesthetics thing? Or, is it results driven? The thing is Inochi, IMO (and maybe this is where we diverge in footballing philosophy terms ), results eventually follow performances. It may take five games, it may take ten, it may take forty-eight () but a failure to address our inability/unwillingness to control games - particularly against weaker opposition (the Norwichs, QPRs, Wolves, Blackburns etc) will begin to effect results too, because any streak of results which isn't driven by performance is very, very vulnerable to a loss of momentum*. I fear for our immediate future. [* - except for those teams who wholeheartedly and unashamedly commit to grinding - ie. Stoke, who consequently also have a glass ceiling on how good they can ever be - something we do not want] Within reason, I just like to see us winning games and being successful. It's likely because of this that I'm not overly concerned with the particulars of last season. I don't particularly fear for our future, because the evidence is there, from our past, that we are well equipped to perform admirably in this league. I expect results and performances to improve. I do worry, however, that some will never be happy. Agree that some will never be happy. Think most would be if we fulfilled our potential. What is our potential? With our current squad, that is. First XI - challenging for top 5/6 Squad - challenging for top 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:36, Wullie said: I think it's very naive to believe that the players are playing it long against the manager's instructions and simply because they're incompetent. Cabaye and Colo both play significantly more long balls than Williamson and Simpson for a start, which I have been saying for months and months. It's clearly the way the manager wants to play, with the intention that the ball gets to our dangerous players as soon as possible and no-one's in any danger of being caught out of position. Where is this from btw? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:31, oldtype said: Quote Quote I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. Find that very far fetched personally. I find the idea that Pardew would specifically instruct the players to always just lump it forward to be significantly less probable. And yet Krul very rarely attempts to play it short, one of our coaches is quoted is saying 'we kicked it longer' after the defeat on the weekend and our own manager describes our style as 'fast, front-foot football', which is just code for get it into a dangerous area as quickly as possible. There are worse footballers and teams that play better than us, so blaming it on one or two individuals is simply unfair. The lack of movement is also to do with coaching and poor tactics. Some of our players (each one of our starting front 6) have previously played for sides with great movement, yet they're suddenly statues here? It doesn't add up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:36, Disco said: Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote I don't get it. What are we complaining about? Is it purely an aesthetics thing? Or, is it results driven? The thing is Inochi, IMO (and maybe this is where we diverge in footballing philosophy terms ), results eventually follow performances. It may take five games, it may take ten, it may take forty-eight () but a failure to address our inability/unwillingness to control games - particularly against weaker opposition (the Norwichs, QPRs, Wolves, Blackburns etc) will begin to effect results too, because any streak of results which isn't driven by performance is very, very vulnerable to a loss of momentum*. I fear for our immediate future. [* - except for those teams who wholeheartedly and unashamedly commit to grinding - ie. Stoke, who consequently also have a glass ceiling on how good they can ever be - something we do not want] Within reason, I just like to see us winning games and being successful. It's likely because of this that I'm not overly concerned with the particulars of last season. I don't particularly fear for our future, because the evidence is there, from our past, that we are well equipped to perform admirably in this league. I expect results and performances to improve. I do worry, however, that some will never be happy. Agree that some will never be happy. Think most would be if we fulfilled our potential. What is our potential? With our current squad, that is. First XI - challenging for top 5/6 Squad - challenging for top 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlelunchbox Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:18, oldtype said: I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. the worrying thing is problem of lack of movement is very much by design. The more movement the more holes you got in the team, Pardew does not like that. The are told to keep their shape and not move unless they have to. Our team only begins to move when its for the second ball straight after the long ball. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:39, Gallowgate Toon said: Quote Quote Quote I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. Find that very far fetched personally. I find the idea that Pardew would specifically instruct the players to always just lump it forward to be significantly less probable. And yet Krul very rarely attempts to play it short, one of our coaches is quoted is saying 'we kicked it longer' after the defeat on the weekend and our own manager describes our style as 'fast, front-foot football', which is just code for get it into a dangerous area as quickly as possible. There are worse footballers and teams that play better than us, so blaming it on one or two individuals is simply unfair. The lack of movement is also to do with coaching and poor tactics. Some of our players (each one of our starting front 6) have previously played for sides with great movement, yet they're suddenly statues here? It doesn't add up. Exactly, all the facts go against your beliefs Oldtype. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:36, neesy111 said: Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote I don't get it. What are we complaining about? Is it purely an aesthetics thing? Or, is it results driven? The thing is Inochi, IMO (and maybe this is where we diverge in footballing philosophy terms ), results eventually follow performances. It may take five games, it may take ten, it may take forty-eight () but a failure to address our inability/unwillingness to control games - particularly against weaker opposition (the Norwichs, QPRs, Wolves, Blackburns etc) will begin to effect results too, because any streak of results which isn't driven by performance is very, very vulnerable to a loss of momentum*. I fear for our immediate future. [* - except for those teams who wholeheartedly and unashamedly commit to grinding - ie. Stoke, who consequently also have a glass ceiling on how good they can ever be - something we do not want] Within reason, I just like to see us winning games and being successful. It's likely because of this that I'm not overly concerned with the particulars of last season. I don't particularly fear for our future, because the evidence is there, from our past, that we are well equipped to perform admirably in this league. I expect results and performances to improve. I do worry, however, that some will never be happy. Agree that some will never be happy. Think most would be if we fulfilled our potential. What is our potential? With our current squad, that is. Pardew said we could challenge 4th () so something between that and 8th. If we played to the level we all know we can i don't see why it's funny... it's not like Spurs and Arsenal are miles ahead. We are just playing well below our level this season for a number of reasons which are well documented. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:36, Disco said: Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote I don't get it. What are we complaining about? Is it purely an aesthetics thing? Or, is it results driven? The thing is Inochi, IMO (and maybe this is where we diverge in footballing philosophy terms ), results eventually follow performances. It may take five games, it may take ten, it may take forty-eight () but a failure to address our inability/unwillingness to control games - particularly against weaker opposition (the Norwichs, QPRs, Wolves, Blackburns etc) will begin to effect results too, because any streak of results which isn't driven by performance is very, very vulnerable to a loss of momentum*. I fear for our immediate future. [* - except for those teams who wholeheartedly and unashamedly commit to grinding - ie. Stoke, who consequently also have a glass ceiling on how good they can ever be - something we do not want] Within reason, I just like to see us winning games and being successful. It's likely because of this that I'm not overly concerned with the particulars of last season. I don't particularly fear for our future, because the evidence is there, from our past, that we are well equipped to perform admirably in this league. I expect results and performances to improve. I do worry, however, that some will never be happy. Agree that some will never be happy. Think most would be if we fulfilled our potential. What is our potential? With our current squad, that is. First XI - challenging for top 5/6 Squad - challenging for top 10 I'm a little less inclined than Disco to ascribe definitive league placings to the squad's potential (far too many variables inside the squad and in the league etc ) but I'd say we have the platform (in terms of personnel/resource) to become a top 8 stalwart and a dark horse for cups. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlelunchbox Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:37, neesy111 said: Quote I think it's very naive to believe that the players are playing it long against the manager's instructions and simply because they're incompetent. Cabaye and Colo both play significantly more long balls than Williamson and Simpson for a start, which I have been saying for months and months. It's clearly the way the manager wants to play, with the intention that the ball gets to our dangerous players as soon as possible and no-one's in any danger of being caught out of position. Where is this from btw? Simpson plays alot of long balls, but yes i agree i would include Cabaye and Colo as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtype Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I highly doubt that any manager specifically instructs his players to "always play it long" or "always play it short." (Okay, there might be a couple exceptions...) There's no question Pardew does prefer a direct style as his primary mode of attack, but that doesn't mean that he tells the players to always hit it up to Demba even if there's an easy pass 5~6 yards away. We'll be set up to primarily exploit longer passes, but the players should also be ready to take opportunities to bring it up from deep when possible. A lot of our strength last year was our ability to mix it up. We were primarily focused on being solid defensively and relying on getting it up to the final third quickly for our attacking players, but when space was there, we had the capability to set up deeper, more gradual attacks. This made it difficult for the opposition to stifle us by adapting to a singular mode of play. This year it's all Plan A and no Plan B. As far as I'm concerned that's down to the players who had previously been responsible to the transition phase of our less direct attacks being horrendously out of form. Not because the tactical instructions have changed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:18, oldtype said: I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. I think Pardew absolutely does tell them to play it long, in fact he's been seen screaming at the players to do so on the touchlines in recent games. This may happen more in the 2nd half when we are chasing a game but every minute of the 90 counts. And if you look back at the times when we had Best in the side along Ba - we used to hit it to his head at the earliest opportunity, and then you look at our pursuit of Carroll and De Jong - all clear signs that Pardew is a long ball merchant and wants his sides to play that way. The fact we are pumping direct aerial passes to Cisse of all people proves that long-ball is our default option and has been drummed into our players over the past season or so, whether it happens to be an appropriate strategy or not (not, in our case). The stats show that we play a higher percentage of long balls than any other side in the league - even Stoke and West Ham. That's no accident or coincidence. Of course what you point out also plays a part - albeit indirectly. Pardew's reluctance to use training time to build a team ethos or identity based on movement, passing etc will also result in players uncomfortable on the ball and limited passing options. The problem is that this strategy of working on OUR style of play regardless of the opposition is the only way out for him imo- he has to give up, or at least curtail, some of the strategies that brought success last season because this isn't last season. we have players out of form, lacking confidence, tired after last season's exertions, teams more clued up on us and of course the extra games midweek which have thrown Pardew's usually meticulous preparations into total disarray (judging by how we start games). Thing is this seems to be what has happened at his previous clubs as well - his style of management just seems to lose steam after a while. What's more - recent quotes suggest that far from tinkering with things, freshening up or trying something new, Pardew is more focused on doubling his resolve and sticking to his guns - conservative, safety first, hoofball. And maybe this will start yielding results in a few weeks or in the New Year, but I don't think it is a blueprint for any sort of long term evolution. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 But the signs were creeping through that the tactics weren't working last year too, until 'that' run. He was getting criticism around February time for consecutive poor performances and results. I think we got something like 17 points from 17 games? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:37, neesy111 said: Quote I think it's very naive to believe that the players are playing it long against the manager's instructions and simply because they're incompetent. Cabaye and Colo both play significantly more long balls than Williamson and Simpson for a start, which I have been saying for months and months. It's clearly the way the manager wants to play, with the intention that the ball gets to our dangerous players as soon as possible and no-one's in any danger of being caught out of position. Where is this from btw? http://www.whoscored.com/Teams/23/Show/England-Newcastle-United via Opta. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudil Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:46, johnnypd said: Quote I think there's a bit of a "Chicken/Egg" problem with the whole "only plays long balls" thing. I sincerely doubt that the players are specifically instructed to hoof it long. I think it's just that a lot of our less talented players end up reverting to that because overall movement off the ball is extremely poor so there's rarely an easy pass to pick out. The fundamental problem is a lack of movement and understanding between the players, everything stems from that. I think Pardew absolutely does tell them to play it long, in fact he's been seen screaming at the players to do so on the touchlines in recent games. This may happen more in the 2nd half when we are chasing a game but every minute of the 90 counts. And if you look back at the times when we had Best in the side along Ba - we used to hit it to his head at the earliest opportunity, and then you look at our pursuit of Carroll and De Jong - all clear signs that Pardew is a long ball merchant and wants his sides to play that way. The fact we are pumping direct aerial passes to Cisse of all people proves that long-ball is our default option and has been drummed into our players over the past season or so, whether it happens to be an appropriate strategy or not (not, in our case). The stats show that we play a higher percentage of long balls than any other side in the league - even Stoke and West Ham. That's no accident or coincidence. Of course what you point out also plays a part - albeit indirectly. Pardew's reluctance to use training time to build a team ethos or identity based on movement, passing etc will also result in players uncomfortable on the ball and limited passing options. The problem is that this strategy of working on OUR style of play regardless of the opposition is the only way out for him imo- he has to give up, or at least curtail, some of the strategies that brought success last season because this isn't last season. we have players out of form, lacking confidence, tired after last season's exertions, teams more clued up on us and of course the extra games midweek which have thrown Pardew's usually meticulous preparations into total disarray (judging by how we start games). Thing is this seems to be what has happened at his previous clubs as well - his style of management just seems to lose steam after a while. What's more - recent quotes suggest that far from tinkering with things, freshening up or trying something new, Pardew is more focused on doubling his resolve and sticking to his guns - conservative, safety first, hoofball. And maybe this will start yielding results in a few weeks or in the New Year, but I don't think it is a blueprint for any sort of long term evolution. Aye, that some people try and blame Simpson and Willo for the fact that we play the most long balls in the league is quite something really Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 On 21/11/2012 at 16:41, Beren said: Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote I don't get it. What are we complaining about? Is it purely an aesthetics thing? Or, is it results driven? The thing is Inochi, IMO (and maybe this is where we diverge in footballing philosophy terms ), results eventually follow performances. It may take five games, it may take ten, it may take forty-eight () but a failure to address our inability/unwillingness to control games - particularly against weaker opposition (the Norwichs, QPRs, Wolves, Blackburns etc) will begin to effect results too, because any streak of results which isn't driven by performance is very, very vulnerable to a loss of momentum*. I fear for our immediate future. [* - except for those teams who wholeheartedly and unashamedly commit to grinding - ie. Stoke, who consequently also have a glass ceiling on how good they can ever be - something we do not want] Within reason, I just like to see us winning games and being successful. It's likely because of this that I'm not overly concerned with the particulars of last season. I don't particularly fear for our future, because the evidence is there, from our past, that we are well equipped to perform admirably in this league. I expect results and performances to improve. I do worry, however, that some will never be happy. Agree that some will never be happy. Think most would be if we fulfilled our potential. What is our potential? With our current squad, that is. First XI - challenging for top 5/6 Squad - challenging for top 10 I'm a little less inclined than Disco to ascribe definitive league placings to the squad's potential (far too many variables inside the squad and in the league etc ) but I'd say we have the platform (in terms of personnel/resource) to become a top 8 stalwart and a dark horse for cups. That can still happen though, yeah? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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