Alan Pardew

[captainhaircut]

Re the long ball stuff, I honestly don't care if we play long ball.

 

We beat Man U last season playing it, we played it under Bobby.

 

My main gripe is that we do it really poorly. Other than Shola, none of our strikers can hold it up. We don't get our midfielders around the strikers or in the box when we have it wide.

 

Direct football is fine if done well. You can get your dangerous players into dangerous areas quickly and effectively. We often went long to Shearer who got hold of it or flicked on it to Bellamy. We'd then turned defences and gave Robert and Solano a real platform to work off.

 

At the moment it's just aimless and even if we do win it up top, it ends up just being played backwards with the hope that Hatem will skin everyone.

[Jagten]

Re the long ball stuff, I honestly don't care if we play long ball.

[Gallowgate Toon]

Theoretically we could still pull the long ball game off, if we actually moved the midfield up a little bit. No centre forward wins every single header (I know we rarely win any), what's really important is to have people following up to pick up the second balls but our central midfielders are always so deep, we always end up surrendering possession.

 

Ironically, Pards played Anita at the tip of a diamond for much of the first half and a bit in the second on the weekend, that's not his position at all and you could tell he wasn't confident enough to collect the ball in such a congested area. However I think Cabaye (or even HBA or Marveaux) could actually do some damage there but he's always played used as defensive cover and I think there lies the key to our problems, the complete mis-use of our main central midfielder.

 

I'm not at all condoning playing long ball as it really doesn't suit our players but if we're going to do it, we might as well do it properly.

[colinmk]

We'd be a laughing stock for sacking Pardew.

 

What if Everton had sacked Moyes during one of their poor seasons?

 

They knew we'd be a laughing stock if we sacked Hughton and they still did it. I hope they have learned from their (many)mistakes this time but who knows.

[Dr Venkman]

We should of course be talking about our problems and what the solutions might be, I just think it's insanely premature to talk about changing the manager. I would be very disappointed if it happened, because yet again we would be letting fear of a short term downturn ruin any chance of stability.

 

The way I see it there's 2 ways out of this:

 

1) Pardew changes his entire footballing philosophy and starts focusing in what WE do with the ball first and foremost.

 

2) Pardew, Ashley, Llambias and Carr have a bit of a heart to heart, admit we're a keep it tight, direct, long ball team and we will be for the foreseeable future and start buying the players necessary to make the style work.

 

Number 1 seems unlikely, especially mid season, and 2 won't happen successfully, even if that conversation were to take place and the plan put into action it would get derailed every time someone like Marveuax became available on a free, because we always go for the cheaper option when given a choice.

 

My faith in Pardew is at an all time low but I do think if we got some players in to suit his style (specifically a new centre forward, De Jong or Carroll as he tried) that we can still be a solid top 8 team under him, particularly if we phase out the likes of Simpson and replace with quality. The hard part is continuing to con the quality players into coming.

[TRon]

We should of course be talking about our problems and what the solutions might be, I just think it's insanely premature to talk about changing the manager. I would be very disappointed if it happened, because yet again we would be letting fear of a short term downturn ruin any chance of stability.

 

The way I see it there's 2 ways out of this:

 

1) Pardew changes his entire footballing philosophy and starts focusing in what WE do with the ball first and foremost.

 

2) Pardew, Ashley, Llambias and Carr have a bit of a heart to heart, admit we're a keep it tight, direct, long ball team and we will be for the foreseeable future and start buying the players necessary to make the style work.

 

Number 1 seems unlikely, especially mid season, and 2 won't happen successfully, even if that conversation were to take place and the plan put into action it would get derailed every time someone like Marveuax became available on a free, because we always go for the cheaper option when given a choice.

 

My faith in Pardew is at an all time low but I do think if we got some players in to suit his style (specifically a new centre forward, De Jong or Carroll as he tried) that we can still be a solid top 8 team under him, particularly if we phase out the likes of Simpson and replace with quality. The hard part is continuing to con the quality players into coming.

 

I wouldn't disagree with much of that but the thought of us bringing in players like Carroll to suit Pardew's playing style depresses the hell out of me. Yes we could be a solid top 8 side but that's all we'll ever be playing that way. If we invested that Carroll money on a full back and a central defender we could be challenging the top 4 if we developed the football instead of the long ball strategy.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over their heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

The fact that he's so interested in Carroll depresses me as well like, I really don't want him back.

[Dave]

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over there heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

I think I agree with that, but I'm not sure if it's more a case of me clinging to it out of desperation.

 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over there heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

I think I agree with that, but I'm not sure if it's more a case of what I'm clinging to out of desperation or what.

 

I've wondered that myself TBH. But I do think Pardew would want his team to play better football - none of our signings have been long ball players really.

 

I just think we've got into a bit of a rut with our energy and confidence, and that is making everything seem worse than it really is. FWIW I thought we played some decent stuff for periods against Swansea, but when they scored everything went to pieces and Krul/Williamson just start launching it in desperation. Maybe the players just need to trust eachother a bit more.

 

Anyway, I'm hoping we stumble across a good win soon to give us a boost, but we might have to face that this is going to be a thoroughly average season.

[nufc4eva]

A good manager adapts his style to suit the players he has. I had every faith in him at beginning of season but one thing sticking in my throat now is the excuses and him clearly not seeing what is wrong with the tactics and formation, he must look at statistics and see that we have done nothing with the long ball in just about every game this season

[Hughesy]

You can almost see the players trying to play the ball on the ground a bit more I think - Krul seems much more content to play the ball short to our defenders or roll the ball out.  The problem is that with certain players in the team, when put under pressure or when a goal down, they revert to type and the ball gets launched.  And as somebody has pointed out, it isn't even a good direct ball.  It's just aimless.

[Dr Venkman]

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over there heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

I think I agree with that, but I'm not sure if it's more a case of what I'm clinging to out of desperation or what.

 

I've wondered that myself TBH. But I do think Pardew would want his team to play better football - none of our signings have been long ball players really.

 

 

Howay Ian man, he's got very little to do with who we sign, it's all about price and resale value and that's the bottom line.

[merlin]

our team is too conditioned in the Pardew way.  As in cautious football, defend deep and hit on the counter attack.

 

its great when it works to a certain extent, as in terms of giving us a solid foundation and a defense thats hard to break down, we are organized in the back four.

 

the problem is ....that is the only way the team knows how to play,  when they are encouraged to attack as in vs Swansea, Bruge etc,  the whole defense turns to shyt because they are not accustomed to that form of football, like being coached out of their game, too conditioned, sort of like institutionalized in school of Pardew.

 

the only way our team knows how to flourish is be on the backfoot, and hope to catch teams out on the counter. 

 

 

We haven't got the pace or wide players of quality to play this type of game - you need fast forwards who will frighten defenders into staying back in order to play this type of game successfully.

 

The tactics being used are useless for the players we have.

cisse and ba are no slouches and ben arfa is pretty good out wide (even though i don't think it gets the best out of him)

 

Cisse and Ba are OK for pace, but that is all - OK. They are not especially fast off the mark and Ba tends to get goal-side of players well rather than beating defenders for pace. HBA is quick but often crowded out by heavy marking or forced to make a hurried pass because he is not getting support from team mates who don't move into space.

[Guest malandro]

Too much importance is being placed on this 433 stuff. Formations aren't magic wands, you can't simply shift a couple of players and turn a pig's ear into a silk purse. The problem is a lack of clarity. Nobody has any idea what style of football Pardew wants his team to play

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over there heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

I think I agree with that, but I'm not sure if it's more a case of what I'm clinging to out of desperation or what.

 

I've wondered that myself TBH. But I do think Pardew would want his team to play better football - none of our signings have been long ball players really.

 

 

Howay Ian man, he's got very little to do with who we sign, it's all about price and resale value and that's the bottom line.

 

Well nobody knows really, I fully accept that he doesn't choose all the players but I would be surprised if he doesn't have a significant input.

[Dr Venkman]

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over there heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

I think I agree with that, but I'm not sure if it's more a case of what I'm clinging to out of desperation or what.

 

I've wondered that myself TBH. But I do think Pardew would want his team to play better football - none of our signings have been long ball players really.

 

 

Howay Ian man, he's got very little to do with who we sign, it's all about price and resale value and that's the bottom line.

 

Well nobody knows really, I fully accept that he doesn't choose all the players but I would be surprised if he doesn't have a significant input.

 

Ok nobody knows. What we DO know is the we've watched two years of direct football, I think it's safe to say that's where Pardew feels comfortable. I also agree that if we had better players we'd play better football but that doesn't say an awful lot for the manager does it?

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over there heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

I think I agree with that, but I'm not sure if it's more a case of what I'm clinging to out of desperation or what.

 

I've wondered that myself TBH. But I do think Pardew would want his team to play better football - none of our signings have been long ball players really.

 

 

Howay Ian man, he's got very little to do with who we sign, it's all about price and resale value and that's the bottom line.

 

Well nobody knows really, I fully accept that he doesn't choose all the players but I would be surprised if he doesn't have a significant input.

 

Ok nobody knows. What we DO know is the we've watched two years of direct football, I think it's safe to say that's where Pardew feels comfortable. I also agree that if we had better players we'd play better football but that doesn't say an awful lot for the manager does it?

 

We've watched two years of mixed football, often playing brilliantly sometimes playing poorly. When we're playing poorly more is made of the 'long ball' thing obviously.

 

You're right that Pardew theoretically should be able to get his players to do what he wants, but in reality I don't think it's quite as simple as that. Defenders in particularly have had a lifetime of being told to play the percentages and launch it rather than lose it.

 

I agree with everyone that we are playing too many long balls at the moment and in general we're playing badly.

[Guest malandro]

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over there heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

I think I agree with that, but I'm not sure if it's more a case of what I'm clinging to out of desperation or what.

 

I've wondered that myself TBH. But I do think Pardew would want his team to play better football - none of our signings have been long ball players really.

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over there heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

I think I agree with that, but I'm not sure if it's more a case of what I'm clinging to out of desperation or what.

 

I've wondered that myself TBH. But I do think Pardew would want his team to play better football - none of our signings have been long ball players really.

 

 

Howay Ian man, he's got very little to do with who we sign, it's all about price and resale value and that's the bottom line.

 

Well nobody knows really, I fully accept that he doesn't choose all the players but I would be surprised if he doesn't have a significant input.

 

 

Howay Ian man, he's got very little to do with who we sign, it's all about price and resale value and that's the bottom line.

 

Well nobody knows really, I fully accept that he doesn't choose all the players but I would be surprised if he doesn't have a significant input.

 

This is one of the reasons I had doubts about last season. It's unclear whether Pardew assembled a team that matched his vision, or was just handed a random collection of players and got lucky. For example, we don't know if he really wanted Ba and he just happened to be available on a free, or if he had to get Ba because he was 'good value'.

 

The whole set up at SJP is murky and confused, it's no surprise these traits are spreading to the field of play.

 

[Wullie]

We play poorly far more often then we play brilliantly, or even competently.

[Dr Venkman]

I don't really believe that 'long ball' is Pardew's philosophy, it's more that he concentrates more on defence than attack in his thinking.

 

If we replaced Simpson and Williamson with some actual footballers we would send it long a lot less. The lack of movement in midfield is also an issue, but maybe it's a vicious circle. The midfielders constantly see the ball flying over there heads, so they stop coming short to receive it, so the defenders have to launch it.

 

I think I agree with that, but I'm not sure if it's more a case of what I'm clinging to out of desperation or what.

 

I've wondered that myself TBH. But I do think Pardew would want his team to play better football - none of our signings have been long ball players really.

 

 

Howay Ian man, he's got very little to do with who we sign, it's all about price and resale value and that's the bottom line.

 

Well nobody knows really, I fully accept that he doesn't choose all the players but I would be surprised if he doesn't have a significant input.

 

Ok nobody knows. What we DO know is the we've watched two years of direct football, I think it's safe to say that's where Pardew feels comfortable. I also agree that if we had better players we'd play better football but that doesn't say an awful lot for the manager does it?

 

We've watched two years of mixed football, often playing brilliantly sometimes playing poorly. When we're playing poorly more is made of the 'long ball' thing obviously.

 

You're right that Pardew theoretically should be able to get his players to do what he wants, but in reality I don't think it's quite as simple as that. Defenders in particularly have had a lifetime of being told to play the percentages and launch it rather than lose it.

 

I agree with everyone that we are playing too many long balls at the moment and in general we're playing badly.

 

We had a run of 6 or 7 games playing passing football and we were fantastic, it's been completely and utterly abandoned, I can't think of many other games where we played well and passed it? Can you? There's wins over Man U and Stoke but they were direct, nothing wrong with that of course. What's even more worrying is I can't think of a game this season where we've played well, other than Bordeaux at home.

 

Pardew's main concern is what we do without the ball, until he gets the players to focus on what we do with it I can't take your second paragraph seriously, he's not doing anything positive to affect the way we attack teams, he's severely limiting us with the rigidity based on not conceding. Even our set pieces are defensive, I'm convinced after watching it for so long that the loft to the back post is designed to stop us being caught on the break.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Yeah, I share the worry about him spending too much time on making us hard to beat. I think this season has been exceptionally bad though, and I don't think it's time to draw conclusions about Pardews entire management.

[taxfree]

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2012/11/19/pardew-papiss-cisse-withdrawal-hit-players-hard-72703-32259569/

 

“You can bet your life our players would have been thinking if we had had Papiss we might have won. We can never answer that question.”

 

“You take Suarez out of Liverpool or Torres out of Chelsea it would be tough to take.”

 

“A lot of our experienced players were not available and we had a real good go at it. We would not let Swansea play.”

 

Bit of the same as mentioned before, but

 

 

[LRD]

“You take Suarez out of Liverpool or Torres out of Chelsea it would be tough to take.”

 

[Dr Venkman]

Yeah, I share the worry about him spending too much time on making us hard to beat. I think this season has been exceptionally bad though, and I don't think it's time to draw conclusions about Pardews entire management.

 

Well by definition we can only do that once he's gone, the sum total is deeply concerning right now though. We'll be better once these injuries and suspensions clear up but again that's not saying anything for the manager.

[Wullie]

We would not let Swansea play ffs. And they still won!