Alan Pardew

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I still haven't really changed my opinion on Pardew, it would be highly fickle to do so now, I feel like the new signings are masking huge deficiencies and that a better coach would be getting a lot more out of this side. There was almost mass condemnation for the sacking of Adkins, but Pochettino has come in and made Southampton look extremely good.

 

Was that your opinion last season as well?

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I still haven't really changed my opinion on Pardew, it would be highly fickle to do so now, I feel like the new signings are masking huge deficiencies and that a better coach would be getting a lot more out of this side. There was almost mass condemnation for the sacking of Adkins, but Pochettino has come in and made Southampton look extremely good.

 

Was that your opinion last season as well?

 

My opinion last season was that while the results were brilliant, there was a clear lack in style to our play, and that individual brilliance carried us through certain games.  We finished 5th last season, I gave pardew his due for that, despite what I felt about the way we played. However that does not make him immune for criticism this season. Its frankly ridiculous to let one great season then dictate that you can't criticise a manager for how awful we've been this season. It's fairly plain for everyone to see. You take the praise expect the criticism too.

 

Fair enough, genuinely just wondered.

[mrmojorisin75]

I still haven't really changed my opinion on Pardew, it would be highly fickle to do so now, I feel like the new signings are masking huge deficiencies and that a better coach would be getting a lot more out of this side. There was almost mass condemnation for the sacking of Adkins, but Pochettino has come in and made Southampton look extremely good.

 

Was that your opinion last season as well?

 

last season his deficiencies were masked by a lack of injuries (meaning a stable team but most importantly defence) and 2 strikers scoring on runs at exactly the right time meaning in effect we had a 30 goal striker in the team...don't get me wrong he did a lot to commend last season and overall it was a success but some of us were pointing out that it couldn't last and it didn't

 

could not agree more with SanToon on pardew, can't comment on southampton

[TheGuv]

I still haven't really changed my opinion on Pardew, it would be highly fickle to do so now, I feel like the new signings are masking huge deficiencies and that a better coach would be getting a lot more out of this side. There was almost mass condemnation for the sacking of Adkins, but Pochettino has come in and made Southampton look extremely good.

 

Was that your opinion last season as well?

 

My opinion last season was that while the results were brilliant, there was a clear lack in style to our play, and that individual brilliance carried us through certain games.  We finished 5th last season, I gave pardew his due for that, despite what I felt about the way we played. However that does not make him immune for criticism this season. Its frankly ridiculous to let one great season then dictate that you can't criticise a manager for how awful we've been this season. It's fairly plain for everyone to see. You take the praise expect the criticism too.

 

Totally agree with you there Santoon

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I still haven't really changed my opinion on Pardew, it would be highly fickle to do so now, I feel like the new signings are masking huge deficiencies and that a better coach would be getting a lot more out of this side. There was almost mass condemnation for the sacking of Adkins, but Pochettino has come in and made Southampton look extremely good.

 

Was that your opinion last season as well?

 

My opinion last season was that while the results were brilliant, there was a clear lack in style to our play, and that individual brilliance carried us through certain games.  We finished 5th last season, I gave pardew his due for that, despite what I felt about the way we played. However that does not make him immune for criticism this season. Its frankly ridiculous to let one great season then dictate that you can't criticise a manager for how awful we've been this season. It's fairly plain for everyone to see. You take the praise expect the criticism too.

 

Fair enough, genuinely just wondered.

 

  No worries, apologies if the tone was a bit harsh, its just I see the argument a lot that he's somehow immune due to last season.  Would you keep him at the end of the season?

 

I probably would keep him, aye, in the name of stability and squad harmony mainly. I just can't be bothered with changing managers all the time.

 

FWIW I don't think he's a brilliant manager by any stretch, but I also think it's strange to just assume the bad season is more an example of his ability than the good season.

 

I'm hoping that now he has better players at his disposal he will focus on setting them out to play. Sounds like that is what he is planning with HBA back. As much as injuries etc can sometimes be an excuse, the biggest factor in a team's success is how many good players are available.

[Tooj]

He certainly deserves credit for deploying Sissoko further up the pitch and at the moment that looks like a masterstroke due to the gains we're seeing from it.

 

Last night was another case though where you look at our overall game plan and I really don't see any impetus at all when it comes to our attacking play as well as how we build up to that. Now it just seems to be give it to Sissoko who will run at people and something might come from that.

 

With the squad we've now got we should in all honesty be looking at bringing in a manager who can get the very best out of them.

 

At the end of the day you need to ask yourself, do you think Pardew is getting the best out of what he has got? The answer to me is a no.

[mrmojorisin75]

I still haven't really changed my opinion on Pardew, it would be highly fickle to do so now, I feel like the new signings are masking huge deficiencies and that a better coach would be getting a lot more out of this side. There was almost mass condemnation for the sacking of Adkins, but Pochettino has come in and made Southampton look extremely good.

 

Was that your opinion last season as well?

 

last season his deficiencies were masked by a lack of injuries (meaning a stable team but most importantly defence) and 2 strikers scoring on runs at exactly the right time meaning in effect we had a 30 goal striker in the team...don't get me wrong he did a lot to commend last season and overall it was a success but some of us were pointing out that it couldn't last and it didn't

 

could not agree more with SanToon on pardew, can't comment on southampton

 

Put it better than I did. I think the effect of Ben Arfa's individual brilliance, Ba/Cisse's goals, Cabaye's influence, and Krul being at his best was key. Like you say he did a lot last season that was good, however this season has shown up his huge limitations. The squad we have is brilliant imo, but they look so devoid of any sort of tactical plan/style of play its scary. Anita is the perfect example for me, I genuinely don't think Pardew knows what to do with a player like him. That worries me.

 

yep, all my thoughts exactly....now that he's been handed 4 new first team players and LB cover on a plate we're suddenly not looking so shit but i still feel he's making little decisions that are ultimately wrong and they're all based in his ultra-cautious nature and approach, anita/jonas being a prime example for me

 

we'll be alright next season assuming we stay (which is still not a done deal let's be honest) but i don't expect a repeat of a CL challenge or anything myself, he's not got the balls or ability for it imo

[Flip]

I still haven't really changed my opinion on Pardew, it would be highly fickle to do so now, I feel like the new signings are masking huge deficiencies and that a better coach would be getting a lot more out of this side. There was almost mass condemnation for the sacking of Adkins, but Pochettino has come in and made Southampton look extremely good.

 

Was that your opinion last season as well?

 

My opinion last season was that while the results were brilliant, there was a clear lack in style to our play, and that individual brilliance carried us through certain games.  We finished 5th last season, I gave pardew his due for that, despite what I felt about the way we played. However that does not make him immune for criticism this season. Its frankly ridiculous to let one great season then dictate that you can't criticise a manager for how awful we've been this season. It's fairly plain for everyone to see. You take the praise expect the criticism too.

 

Totally agree with you there Santoon

 

Cheers

 

The thing is, I really don't like having a pop at managers. I've only ever done it with Allardyce and Pardew. But I feel we are at a very important time in the clubs history, we could go forward from here to have a squad capable of challenging for something. And I want that to happen,like we all do, but I feel we need a new manager to do this

 

Me and I think it was Mick argued this last year around the same time of the year. It's hard on Pardew to say that individual brilliance made us finish fifth, but in a way it did. You can see that he doesn't get any results without the players, and when we were in a terrible run last year we only really changed the curve whenever Cisse came and started smashing in goals.

 

I like Pardew as personality and his passion on the sidelines, but his abilities as a football manager aren't that good tbf. He doesn't have an idea of how his team wants to play and attack.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

At the end of the day you need to ask yourself, do you think Pardew is getting the best out of what he has got? The answer to me is a no.

 

Hard to answer as we're coming off the back of such a bad spell of form/injuries/results.

 

Is our current league position the best we could achieve? Obviously not. But the difference between our current position and potential position is big when we have all out top players, but once you start considering a starting 11 containing Perch, Williamson and Obertan etc it's probably only a few points behind the curve.

 

What I'm saying is that he has underperformed compared to our ultimate potential, but less so compared to potential of the team he has been able to play. Then you add in the crushing effect on confidence of a long period of bad results.

[mrmojorisin75]

I also think it's strange to just assume the bad season is more an example of his ability than the good season.

 

see this needles me a bit, there's no assumption going on if you ask me - when things went his way he was ok, better than ok if you like

 

but things didn't go his way this season and he literally, literally had no answer...if ashley had chosen to gamble in january there is no doubt in my mind we'd have gone down

 

tooj just made a good point about a lack of play/impetus and now we're just expecting sissoko to run at people and something to happen...same as it was with ba when we'd hoy it up and hope he could make something happen alone...don't get me wrong again we've looked better overall of late but there are still precious few signs of visible development for me, just better players on the pitch

 

 

[Tooj]

He deserved a lot of credit last season for the work on the defence, as we were really solid at times yet in certain games we just folded such as Fulham away. However because of that defensive solidity at times we looked toothless attacking and managed to get something due to the clinical finishing of both Ba and Cisse.

 

Then this season when we went to Old Trafford and The Emirates and tried to give it a go we played well attacking wise yet looked really poor at the back.

 

He seems to be unable to strike that balance of looking solid at the back and being able to be have us playing at our optimum attacking wise too.

 

The best time we've saw that balance struck in his tenure here was the 4-3-3 last season we played for about six games. Then he completely abandoned that due to our defeat at Wigan. Even though we conceded a few goals that day and looked shell-shocked early on we did actually give a good account of ourselves in the second half and were unlucky not to come away with even a few more goals that day. Ben Arfa was fantastic.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I also think it's strange to just assume the bad season is more an example of his ability than the good season.

 

see this needles me a bit, there's no assumption going on if you ask me - when things went his way he was ok, better than ok if you like

 

but things didn't go his way this season and he literally, literally had no answer...if ashley had chosen to gamble in january there is no doubt in my mind we'd have gone down

 

tooj just made a good point about a lack of play/impetus and now we're just expecting sissoko to run at people and something to happen...same as it was with ba when we'd hoy it up and hope he could make something happen alone...don't get me wrong again we've looked better overall of late but there are still precious few signs of visible development for me, just better players on the pitch

 

 

Aye all fair points, we are still looking to find a set way of playing and I agree with you about the importance of the new signings.

 

Guess we'll never know how a better manager might have done with the players we had available at the start of the season. I definitely disagreed with a lot of his decisions.

[Tooj]

At the end of the day you need to ask yourself, do you think Pardew is getting the best out of what he has got? The answer to me is a no.

 

Hard to answer as we're coming off the back of such a bad spell of form/injuries/results.

 

Is our current league position the best we could achieve? Obviously not. But the difference between our current position and potential position is big when we have all out top players, but once you start considering a starting 11 containing Perch, Williamson and Obertan etc it's probably only a few points behind the curve.

 

What I'm saying is that he has underperformed compared to our ultimate potential, but less so compared to potential of the team he has been able to play. Then you add in the crushing effect on confidence of a long period of bad results.

 

You say that but he had us at the very echelon of the table last season using those players at the very start.

 

As I've stated before several managers in the Premier League have a lot worse to work with than he has had this season and have been producing better results than he has.

[mrmojorisin75]

Nail on head. Alright is where we will stay, despite the fact we have a squad that is capable of much, much more than that. It's a crying shame imo

 

spurs game was interesting to me, honestly bale aside i don't think there's much between us now on paper but when they got the ball they had a very clear and defined way of playing to utilize their pace and break on us with purpose and speed...as well as we played that game it was glaringly obvious we were nowhere near that and personally i don't think we ever will be with pardew

 

the obvious retort is that he's just got the new players and it'll take time to develop to play like spurs play but he's spent 2 years playing the opposite of that game and as others have said there are signs he seems to think using sissoko as a battering ram is a good idea...i just don't think he's a "football" manager, it's not in his nature

[AyeDubbleYoo]

On the Spurs comparison, it's fairly easy to have a clear attacking game plan when you have two absolutely lightening wide players. They still struggled to create chances in the final third.

[mrmojorisin75]

On the Spurs comparison, it's fairly easy to have a clear attacking game plan when you have two absolutely lightening wide players. They still struggled to create chances in the final third.

 

'cause they started the game without an orthodox striker didn't they?

 

anyway i just meant they had a plan that was clearly worked on in training, played to their strengths and everyone was well drilled in it and knew what they should have been doing....granted we had that last year but it's easier to have a defined plan when that plan is defensively grounded as ours was

[colinmk]

They way he manages the club suggests to me that unless the majority of our players are all on top form then we will struggle. I think he has a certain way he likes his teams to play and our squad isn't anything like that so he is constantly out of his comfort zone and that's why he often reverts to this style when the going gets tough.

 

I also worry that he struggles with europe(he said this himself before) because he doesn't have enough time to work on the individual matches. We need someone that can do that because we have a squad that should be in Europe every season.

 

I actually think as a man manager he is pretty good. The majority of players seems to like him and want to play for him and the only issue I have with him here is how he has harshly criticised the youngsters this season. I actually think he did that though because he was cracking a bit under the pressure at the time and probably regrets it now.

 

He did well last season and that could happen again if we start the season with Krul, defence, Cabaye, HBA, Sissoko, Cisse etc all hitting top form but if they aren't then as a team we just don't cut it and will struggle to be where we should. Personally I think there are many managers out there who could do a better job with these players.

 

[TRon]

I thought we were solid enough yesterday, but with that team it would be pretty disappointing if we weren't. When I saw that the two wide forwards were going to be Jonas and Obertan I thought we might struggle to get any quality end product and that's how it turned out. Really at home you would have expected us to put genuinely creative player like Marveaux in the starting line up, but once again, Pardew went over-cautious. It wasn't a disastrous result by any means but the best I can describe Pardew's input is underwhelming.

[mozy]

On the Spurs comparison, it's fairly easy to have a clear attacking game plan when you have two absolutely lightening wide players. They still struggled to create chances in the final third.

 

'cause they started the game without an orthodox striker didn't they?

 

anyway i just meant they had a plan that was clearly worked on in training, played to their strengths and everyone was well drilled in it and knew what they should have been doing....granted we had that last year but it's easier to have a defined plan when that plan is defensively grounded as ours was

 

Spurs plan is basically give it to Bale, and he was able to produce a couple of moments to beat us. The difference between us and Spurs that day was him and him only.

[Guest icemanblue]

On the Spurs comparison, it's fairly easy to have a clear attacking game plan when you have two absolutely lightening wide players. They still struggled to create chances in the final third.

 

'cause they started the game without an orthodox striker didn't they?

 

anyway i just meant they had a plan that was clearly worked on in training, played to their strengths and everyone was well drilled in it and knew what they should have been doing....granted we had that last year but it's easier to have a defined plan when that plan is defensively grounded as ours was

 

Spurs plan is basically give it to Bale, and he was able to produce a couple of moments to beat us. The difference between us and Spurs that day was him and him only.

 

Spurs wouldn't rely on their best player to produce a 'moment of magic' to win the game, though, surely? Only Pardew does that.

[mrmojorisin75]

good post colinmk, agree with all of it, another thing is that for the first time since the keegan fiasco i think we'd actually be able to draw some interest from very good managers myself

 

ashley seems to have more or less proven that the carroll sale was not the start of us selling anyone decent at the first sign of a bid, which many managers would find reassuring i reckon

[Lush Vlad]

The biggest worry for me is, I'm not sure what his preferred style is?  It changes on almost a weekly basis and not necessarily for the good.  There seems to be a mixture of sexy football, combined with some prehistoric, rigid dross.  Aimless long ball set pieces, slow passing when on the ball and a chronic lack of movement.  But recently, we've started to move the ball quite well, the new boys actually play pass and move and a lot of the hoofing has stopped.

 

Is this just down to the new/returning players being superior to the ones they replaced?  Or does Pardew trust their ability more, so he is giving them more freedom and the chance to play without the shackles on?  Perhaps a bit of both, but it seems like the former to me.

 

Someone else mentioned him getting the balance right between defence and attack.  I think they're spot on with that.  It seems to be one or the other and we're not particularly fluid.  It's very clunky and doesn't feel very smooth the way we go through phases of play.  Just all feels very unatural and we seem to struggle to get all the cogs working together.

 

In Pardew's defence.  He's put Gouffran wide left where he's not played too often and he's put Sissoko as far forward as he's ever played (I think?)  They've given us another dimension going forward.  He deserves credit for this and with HBA to come back in, the future looks a bit more promising.

 

Still, when it boils down to it, I am in agreement with most of those posting in the last couple of pages.  I don't think he'll ever get the best out of our players and I'm not a big fan of his.  But, he's clearly here for the long term, so he'll get my backing (to a point) whilst he's here.

[The College Dropout]

On the Spurs comparison, it's fairly easy to have a clear attacking game plan when you have two absolutely lightening wide players. They still struggled to create chances in the final third.

 

'cause they started the game without an orthodox striker didn't they?

 

anyway i just meant they had a plan that was clearly worked on in training, played to their strengths and everyone was well drilled in it and knew what they should have been doing....granted we had that last year but it's easier to have a defined plan when that plan is defensively grounded as ours was

 

Spurs plan is basically give it to Bale, and he was able to produce a couple of moments to beat us. The difference between us and Spurs that day was him and him only.

 

We sat deep to nullify their threat in the wide areas. And for no one to really do the business in the box from crosses they struggled. It's been that case for years, shut their flanks down and you've got a good chance. Last year they had VDV and Ade to counter that, this year Bale has turned into CR7-lite.

 

 

With us, high line or deep line. It doesn't matter we don't have a strategy.

[colinmk]

good post colinmk, agree with all of it, another thing is that for the first time since the keegan fiasco i think we'd actually be able to draw some interest from very good managers myself

 

ashley seems to have more or less proven that the carroll sale was not the start of us selling anyone decent at the first sign of a bid, which many managers would find reassuring i reckon

 

Yep we all know how quickly football changes and things are forgotten and right now I'd say we seem like a really good club to be managing.

[mozy]

On the Spurs comparison, it's fairly easy to have a clear attacking game plan when you have two absolutely lightening wide players. They still struggled to create chances in the final third.

 

'cause they started the game without an orthodox striker didn't they?

 

anyway i just meant they had a plan that was clearly worked on in training, played to their strengths and everyone was well drilled in it and knew what they should have been doing....granted we had that last year but it's easier to have a defined plan when that plan is defensively grounded as ours was

 

Spurs plan is basically give it to Bale, and he was able to produce a couple of moments to beat us. The difference between us and Spurs that day was him and him only.

 

We sat deep to nullify their threat in the wide areas. And for no one to really do the business in the box from crosses they struggled. It's been that case for years, shut their flanks down and you've got a good chance. Last year they had VDV and Ade to counter that, this year Bale has turned into CR7-lite.

 

With us, high line or deep line. It doesn't matter we don't have a strategy.

 

Thinking this about Bale myself, he actually is coming onto that level, scary.

 

Personally think you're being overly harsh against one of the better sides in the league, as others have said I think a lot of teams struggle against Spurs' tactics namely Manchester United a few weeks ago.