themanupstairs Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 What I'll never understand is how some people, in this thread and others, make direct comparisons between managers as if they were horses running the same race, completely disregarding the myriad of external factors that can make them successful, unsuccessful, or just plain old average at any given point in time. That goes for Garde AND Pardew of course, and their relative achievements throughout their careers. It's never ever that black and white ffs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paully Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 He is an utter c***. Lock thread Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 And the point is - a team doesn't do significantly better without something changing. Lyon aren't a small club. They might've had to make cutbacks but nothing that makes finishing 5th and winning a couple cups a major achievement. yet during the period we were linked with him anyone talking about garde from the french football side seems to think it was I've spoken to people who said he was "decent", "solid", "nothing special". I think you're making a but if a mistake by not considering context here, TCD. Lyon were in a bad situation and were having to compete in a time where big money was starting to come into Ligue 1. He'd also been making noises about leaving for a while, he'd been a part of the Lyon staff for over 10 years. I think their fans' reaction to him leaving said it all. A supporter base who've enjoyed tremendous success over the last 15 years and they make a banner for Garde (the bloke who only won a couple of trophies) leaving, that shows you the success of his project. He steadied the ship. Had them in decent positions. But nothing to suggest he's a top quality manager. In the 3 season prior Lyon finished 2,3,3. PSG and Monaco have risen, Montpellier and Bourdeaux have fallen and he did a good job of avoiding that fate for Lyon. But to me, it looks like a solid job. They were doing better before and doing better after. I can appreciate he navigated them across rough sea's but I also expect he had peaked with that team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Newcastle fans moaning about finishing 5th and winning cups. Lunacy. More or less that same team is 1st with a different manager. He wasn't manager of Montpellier or something and achieving those positions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 What relevance does that have to him being good enough for newcastle or being better than pardew? He has a track record of European finishes and winning cups in one of the bigger leagues in Europe. Not that our owner gives a shit about that like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Newcastle fans moaning about finishing 5th and winning cups. Lunacy. More or less that same team is 1st with a different manager. He wasn't manager of Montpellier or something and achieving those positions. Aren't PSG top? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Newcastle fans moaning about finishing 5th and winning cups. Lunacy. More or less that same team is 1st with a different manager. He wasn't manager of Montpellier or something and achieving those positions. Aren't PSG top? Lyon are second now. Point being they are challenging for the league which they didn't do under Garde. What relevance does that have to him being good enough for newcastle or being better than pardew? He has a track record of European finishes and winning cups in one of the bigger leagues in Europe. Not that our owner gives a s*** about that like. Lyon are the most successful French side of the 00's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Eight hundred and twenty nine pages of Alan. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Eight hundred and twenty nine pages of Alan. is it not 3,829? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Eight hundred and twenty nine pages of Alan. is it not 3,829? Oh lord, I forgot about the closed threads. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Newcastle fans moaning about finishing 5th and winning cups. Lunacy. More or less that same team is 1st with a different manager. He wasn't manager of Montpellier or something and achieving those positions. Aren't PSG top? Lyon are second now. Point being they are challenging for the league which they didn't do under Garde. What relevance does that have to him being good enough for newcastle or being better than pardew? He has a track record of European finishes and winning cups in one of the bigger leagues in Europe. Not that our owner gives a s*** about that like. Lyon are the most successful French side of the 00's. So he was good enough to manage them and did rather well. Good enough for me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Well, all I know is my two Lyon-supporting mates think he's a really good coach that'll go on to have a great career. Let's not forget, he went into his first managerial job at one of the most highly-pressurised clubs in France, was told he'd have to build around youth and his best players would most likely be sold every season for the foreseeable. Not only did he 'steady the ship' in terms of results, he bedded in some of the brightest young talents in the country, played entertaining football on the way - with a number of different systems, I might add - and won a significant trophy. Of course, his last season was more disappointing than his initial two, but there'd been murmurs around the local press that he'd apparently wanted to leave after the second season, feeling he'd been at Lyon long enough after so much time as part of the coaching staff. His heart may simply not have been in it as much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Most people i talk to about Garde say that the large bulk of the credit for this season goes to him and he's the main reason they are where there are now. It's merely a case of the players maturing at the right time and he left as they were about to break through. But he was largely responsible for that team's development. Anyway as been explained many times over he was a good candidate for the job due to how developed talent with very little injection of cash and consistently had best players sold, considering that he was perfect for what would have been required for a manager to be successful here. ( as well you can be anyway) The reason they did well before him was because they had quality players and spent loads with a high wage bill, he was chosen with the task of developing talent while understanding that the management would be getting rid of said quality players to pay off their stadium debts. It would a poor mans version of say Wenger left Arsenal and then they won the league because of the work he did before hand and giving Wenger no credit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 Nah lads, TCD said he wasn't very good. You're wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 Alain Pardue? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest optimistic nit Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 After skimming TCD's recent guff, I looked back in this thread to see what he had to say about Pardew back when he was doing his "best" with us. Skimming a good 20-30 pages or so from a few different days, I couldn't find a single post from him. I deride two things from that: 1) Halcyon days for the forum because he kept his fat fingers away from a thread and 2) he probably always was a Pardew supporter, and the worst kind who pipes down when he was breaking terrible records left, right and centre and now pops up to tell us how he "wasn't all that bad". The problem is this forum is incredibly hostile to ideas that break with the status quo opinions of a few key posters, and for a good while any post even lightly in favour of pardew on here gets met with a torrent of abuse, and usually completely miss the original point the poster was trying to make. All this talk of TCD being a 'Pardew supporter' when all he's been saying is that the job Pardew did wasn't terrible (it wasn't) and that his time here is a symptom of a much bigger issue that sacking him will do nothing to change (it won't) is ridiculous. I've experienced this as well when even trying to point this out puts you in the line for a torrent of abuse and you just think end up thinking whats the bloody point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 He kept us treading water and oversaw some terrible records putting us at the brink of being in the bottom three. He didn't do much good either. He is 'symptom' but only in the same way as dying is a symptom of getting your heed chopped off. He wasn't good news. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKSC Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 After skimming TCD's recent guff, I looked back in this thread to see what he had to say about Pardew back when he was doing his "best" with us. Skimming a good 20-30 pages or so from a few different days, I couldn't find a single post from him. I deride two things from that: 1) Halcyon days for the forum because he kept his fat fingers away from a thread and 2) he probably always was a Pardew supporter, and the worst kind who pipes down when he was breaking terrible records left, right and centre and now pops up to tell us how he "wasn't all that bad". The problem is this forum is incredibly hostile to ideas that break with the status quo opinions of a few key posters, and for a good while any post even lightly in favour of pardew on here gets met with a torrent of abuse, and usually completely miss the original point the poster was trying to make. All this talk of TCD being a 'Pardew supporter' when all he's been saying is that the job Pardew did wasn't terrible (it wasn't) and that his time here is a symptom of a much bigger issue that sacking him will do nothing to change (it won't) is ridiculous. I've experienced this as well when even trying to point this out puts you in the line for a torrent of abuse and you just think end up thinking whats the bloody point. in all honesty, when all is said and done, at the end of the day, you're wrong. He was shit. It was terrible. Him leaving did improve things. You are right though in this.There is a problem. Ashley is a cunt and Carver is useless. I'm glad you're able to see this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 I'd say relegation form for his final full year, blaming the fans' positivity (and negativity, the next week) for losing points, not to mention being consistently complicit in Ashley's attempts to strip the club of both its soul and assets constitutes a 'terrible' job. Any arsehole who thinks otherwise can go drink a can of petrol. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 I'd say relegation form for his final full year, blaming the fans' positivity (and negativity, the next week) for losing points, not to mention being consistently complicit in Ashley's attempts to strip the club of both its soul and assets constitutes a 'terrible' job. Any arsehole who thinks otherwise can go drink a can of petrol. I'm in Total agreement. We need a Welcome Break from this debate. Esso boring. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ndegwa Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 I'd say relegation form for his final full year, blaming the fans' positivity (and negativity, the next week) for losing points, not to mention being consistently complicit in Ashley's attempts to strip the club of both its soul and assets constitutes a 'terrible' job. Any arsehole who thinks otherwise can go drink a can of petrol. I'm in Total agreement. We need a Welcome Break from this debate. Esso boring. Agreed, continuing this crude debate is fuelish in my eyes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudil Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 Look at it from this angle: Do you think Pardew could have replicated Garde's success at Lyon? What success? Well two trophies for a start Don't bother with him. Easily the worst poster on here since that Japanese guy 'Inochi' left. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_R Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 I'd say relegation form for his final full year, blaming the fans' positivity (and negativity, the next week) for losing points, not to mention being consistently complicit in Ashley's attempts to strip the club of both its soul and assets constitutes a 'terrible' job. Any arsehole who thinks otherwise can go drink a can of petrol. I'm in Total agreement. We need a Welcome Break from this debate. Esso boring. Agreed, continuing this crude debate is fuelish in my eyes. Well well well, seems someone's ignited the usual punhouse extravaganza. Oil be off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gallowgate_pete Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 I'd say relegation form for his final full year, blaming the fans' positivity (and negativity, the next week) for losing points, not to mention being consistently complicit in Ashley's attempts to strip the club of both its soul and assets constitutes a 'terrible' job. Any arsehole who thinks otherwise can go drink a can of petrol. I'm in Total agreement. We need a Welcome Break from this debate. Esso boring. Agreed, continuing this crude debate is fuelish in my eyes. Well well well, seems someone's ignited the usual punhouse extravaganza. Oil be off. Ah come on. There's no reason to be peed off! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bard of Byker Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 I'd say relegation form for his final full year, blaming the fans' positivity (and negativity, the next week) for losing points, not to mention being consistently complicit in Ashley's attempts to strip the club of both its soul and assets constitutes a 'terrible' job. Any arsehole who thinks otherwise can go drink a can of petrol. I'm in Total agreement. We need a Welcome Break from this debate. Esso boring. Agreed, continuing this crude debate is fuelish in my eyes. I'm sure there's Moto come. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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