shintonsghost Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It can't be easy getting players in the current climate. Clubs are asking £50 mil for rank average players, Stones at Man City is a classic example. We need at least 4 or 5 players and even with a £100 mil it gets you not a lot better than what we already have. Rafa will not blow money for the sake of it, he will find what he wants at a price he's happy with or he won't buy and that is the right thing to do i'd have the average Stone in my team like Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shintonsghost Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 I wonder what Ashley makes of working with Rafa. He's used to being surrounded by submissive nobody's kissing his bottom in appreciation of the fact they got a job they're completely unqualified for, and that he can push around at will. Rafa obviously doesn't fit that profile and presents a treath to the way he likes to operate. Wouldn't surprise me at all if he privately thought is more hassle than he's worth, especially now it's job done and we're back on the gravy train. Guess we'll find out this summer if anything has changed or not, because I doubt Rafa will put up with going into the season with a squad destined for relegation. MA isn't working with him though is he? it's that fucking tool Charnley, the non football man tasked with getting them over the line, good god. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenBartonCentrePartin Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 If there's any truth in Ashley wanting to sell up completely, or sell a stake, it wouldn't surprise me if getting that sorted is prioritised over transfers, tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It can't be easy getting players in the current climate. Clubs are asking £50 mil for rank average players, Stones at Man City is a classic example. We need at least 4 or 5 players and even with a £100 mil it gets you not a lot better than what we already have. Rafa will not blow money for the sake of it, he will find what he wants at a price he's happy with or he won't buy and that is the right thing to do I doubt Rafa cares much about how much players cost, just that he can strengthen the squad within the budget he's been given (and was reportedly happy with). It does seem though that he's having to fight others in positions of power over player valuations and ability. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 I wonder what Ashley makes of working with Rafa. He's used to being surrounded by submissive nobody's kissing his bottom in appreciation of the fact they got a job they're completely unqualified for, and that he can push around at will. Rafa obviously doesn't fit that profile and presents a treath to the way he likes to operate. Wouldn't surprise me at all if he privately thought is more hassle than he's worth, especially now it's job done and we're back on the gravy train. Guess we'll find out this summer if anything has changed or not, because I doubt Rafa will put up with going into the season with a squad destined for relegation. MA isn't working with him though is he? it's that f***ing tool Charnley, the non football man tasked with getting them over the line, good god. Maybe not directly (much), but undoubtedly he's getting fed back what's happening through Charnley and that new lawyer with his unknown remit (and previously Carr). He went from pushing around Pardew and McClaren to being told what's what by Rafa (by proxy or not). Can Ashley handle a strong character challenging him oublicly as the club's most visible figure? Not even adecade ago, when he was himself still ambitious and enthousiastic about owning us he most definitely couldn't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shintonsghost Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It can't be easy getting players in the current climate. Clubs are asking £50 mil for rank average players, Stones at Man City is a classic example. We need at least 4 or 5 players and even with a £100 mil it gets you not a lot better than what we already have. Rafa will not blow money for the sake of it, he will find what he wants at a price he's happy with or he won't buy and that is the right thing to do I doubt Rafa caree much about how much players cost, just that he can strengthen the squad within the budget he's been given (and was reportedly happy with). It does seem though that he's having to fight others in positions of power over player valuations and ability. we don't know though do we? Rafa was proved wrong over Townsend, the board said no and got it right, plenty of time in truth and the price tag doesn't always mean success , no panic as yet from me , either way i'm looking forward being back in the big time Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughesy Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Something a bit weird about the 'lawyer' - not listed on the law society website (that I can see) so can't have a current licence to practise. Not that that makes a huge amount of difference but makes you wonder what his actual role is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hakka Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It can't be easy getting players in the current climate. Clubs are asking £50 mil for rank average players, Stones at Man City is a classic example. We need at least 4 or 5 players and even with a £100 mil it gets you not a lot better than what we already have. Rafa will not blow money for the sake of it, he will find what he wants at a price he's happy with or he won't buy and that is the right thing to do I doubt Rafa caree much about how much players cost, just that he can strengthen the squad within the budget he's been given (and was reportedly happy with). It does seem though that he's having to fight others in positions of power over player valuations and ability. we don't know though do we? Rafa was proved wrong over Townsend, the board said no and got it right, plenty of time in truth and the price tag doesn't always mean success , no panic as yet from me , either way i'm looking forward being back in the big time The board was right over Townsend? Jesus wept. Despite what panned out it was definitely the right move to bring in some quality to help in January. Just because the board gambled and got lucky doesn't make them know better than Rafa. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddy Chibas Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 I wonder what Ashley makes of working with Rafa. He's used to being surrounded by submissive nobody's kissing his bottom in appreciation of the fact they got a job they're completely unqualified for, and that he can push around at will. Rafa obviously doesn't fit that profile and presents a treath to the way he likes to operate. Wouldn't surprise me at all if he privately thought is more hassle than he's worth, especially now it's job done and we're back on the gravy train. Guess we'll find out this summer if anything has changed or not, because I doubt Rafa will put up with going into the season with a squad destined for relegation. MA isn't working with him though is he? it's that f***ing tool Charnley, the non football man tasked with getting them over the line, good god. Maybe not directly (much), but undoubtedly he's getting fed back what's happening through Charnley and that new lawyer with his unknown remit (and previously Carr). He went from pushing around Pardew and McClaren to being told what's what by Rafa (by proxy or not). Can Ashley handle a strong character challenging him oublicly as the club's most visible figure? Not even adecade ago, when he was himself still ambitious and enthousiastic about owning us he most definitely couldn't. Some foggy memories on this forum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It can't be easy getting players in the current climate. Clubs are asking £50 mil for rank average players, Stones at Man City is a classic example. We need at least 4 or 5 players and even with a £100 mil it gets you not a lot better than what we already have. Rafa will not blow money for the sake of it, he will find what he wants at a price he's happy with or he won't buy and that is the right thing to do I doubt Rafa caree much about how much players cost, just that he can strengthen the squad within the budget he's been given (and was reportedly happy with). It does seem though that he's having to fight others in positions of power over player valuations and ability. we don't know though do we? Rafa was proved wrong over Townsend, the board said no and got it right, plenty of time in truth and the price tag doesn't always mean success , no panic as yet from me , either way i'm looking forward being back in the big time It's not about being right or wrong about individual players though, it's about being given a responsibilty and a budget to do the best job possible and being given the freedom and trust to do the job without being second guessed or having to explain/defend your decisions and having them cancelled above your head. How do Charnley and co plan to evaluate Rafa's performance (in the wider remit of also being responsible for player recruitment) if they keep meddling in it? Will Rafa be allowed the players he thinks he needs, or has nothing changed at all in practice? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 its what Ashley does, puts blockers between himself and the people with ambition, but need to spend to achieve it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It annoys me that we never bid the asking price. We constantly seem to undervalue the players we are attempting to sign. There's a time and a place. First season back, when we have a squad full of championship players, is neither the time not the place to be haggling over fees. Get it done and let Rafa get on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menace Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 I don't get why he fucking backed McClaren but not Benitez, ffs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foluwashola Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It annoys me that we never bid the asking price. We constantly seem to undervalue the players we are attempting to sign. There's a time and a place. First season back, when we have a squad full of championship players, is neither the time not the place to be haggling over fees. Get it done and let Rafa get on. Tbh, we're kidding ourselves if we don't accept that these negotiation tactics and internal politics aren't prevalent at 95% of clubs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It annoys me that we never bid the asking price. We constantly seem to undervalue the players we are attempting to sign. There's a time and a place. First season back, when we have a squad full of championship players, is neither the time not the place to be haggling over fees. Get it done and let Rafa get on. Tbh, we're kidding ourselves if we don't accept that these negotiation tactics and internal politics aren't prevalent at 95% of clubs. Ignoring the large fee, Everton just paid 30m for Pickford, a fee most said was too much. They didnt quibble over the fee because they wanted the player. We never seem to stump up the money to get key targets. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 I wonder what Ashley makes of working with Rafa. He's used to being surrounded by submissive nobody's kissing his bottom in appreciation of the fact they got a job they're completely unqualified for, and that he can push around at will. Rafa obviously doesn't fit that profile and presents a treath to the way he likes to operate. Wouldn't surprise me at all if he privately thought is more hassle than he's worth, especially now it's job done and we're back on the gravy train. Guess we'll find out this summer if anything has changed or not, because I doubt Rafa will put up with going into the season with a squad destined for relegation. He got Rafa in precisely because hiring incompetents got us relegated twice. Even if it goes against the way he likes to work, he must have come to a decision that it needed to change because it wasn't working. Why would going back to the old model work any better now? I don't pretend to know how Ashley thinks but you would think he'd make his mind up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
midds Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Don't buy this whole notion that Charnley can't get the deals done. Last summer he/we managed to do about 45 deals in and out of the club, if players aren't being signed then it's not because he can't but because there's a clear reluctance to do so. I'm really hoping it is all to increase the pressure and get some wheels turning. The thing I'm seeing as a positive is the fact that whilst no one has come in yet, very few have left either, the squad must be huge and loads need to be moved on. We may need to shift a few first, not from a point of view of raising funds to spend but to simply create space. It's worrying given Ashley's previous though, anyone who says they're not bothered by what they've read in the last 24 hours needs their head checking. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 I can well imagine that Rafa is getting concerned with the lack of activity. It might just be that after January he's giving the hierarchy a gentle kick up the arse by leaking his worries through the press. It doesn't mean that deals aren't in place, just that he's not going to believe it until the ink's on the paper. Can't say I blame him tbh, it's quite possible he's given a list of targets and we've tried to go for more asset friendly alternatives. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Honestly I get Rafa being frustrated but the examples used are not exactly due to the club being cheap as usual tbh. Cabellero wants to go to Chelsea, can't really do much about that. Delph there hasn't been enough information out to say anything but there hasn't been any inclination we have baulked at any prices, same goes for Mangala really. With Abraham it sounded more like Agents and Chelsea and fucking around more than anything else and the lad from Eibar has a release clause which I think will be done personally. There's far much more to this than just the club being cheap as shit and refusing to pay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
astraguy Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It's worrying the club haven't dismissed this quickly clubs who have a manager the fans don't want to lose would normally dismiss this right away Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foluwashola Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It's worrying the club haven't dismissed this quickly clubs who have a manager the fans don't want to lose would normally dismiss this right away If they respond directly to every piece of shite the Daily Mail print they'll never have time for anything else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It's worrying the club haven't dismissed this quickly clubs who have a manager the fans don't want to lose would normally dismiss this right away If they respond directly to every piece of shite the Daily Mail print they'll never have time for anything else. This isn't just the Daily Mail reporting this, the thread title says it ffs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foluwashola Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 It's worrying the club haven't dismissed this quickly clubs who have a manager the fans don't want to lose would normally dismiss this right away If they respond directly to every piece of shite the Daily Mail print they'll never have time for anything else. This isn't just the Daily Mail reporting this, the thread title says it ffs. Whey if the thread title says it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xLiaaamx Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Charnley's been instructed to play hardball according to the chronicle. Not much is going to get done this summer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Charnley's been instructed to play hardball according to the chronicle. Not much is going to get done this summer. Everything had been going too well. Definitely needs more Ashley sabotage. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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