sbnufc Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Hope the search goes on for the pilot. No point, they only got Sala cause he happened to still be in the plane. The pilot could be anywhere in the seas by now. Needle in a haystack x10000000000 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordiedean Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Hope the search goes on for the pilot. No point, they only got Sala cause he happened to still be in the plane. The pilot could be anywhere in the seas by now. Needle in a haystack x10000000000 According to some genius on RTG they should maybe open sala up to find the pilot inside him a bit like some Russian nesting doll Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoveItIfWeBeatU Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-47172509 Emiliano Sala: Who owned the plane the Cardiff player died in? By Jenny Johnson & Kayley Thomas BBC Wales News Focus 9 February 2019 The obscure world of plane ownership is under the spotlight following the death of Cardiff City player Emiliano Sala. While the wreckage of the aircraft rests at the bottom of the English Channel - holding, investigators hope, at least some of the answers as to how this tragedy unfolded - parallels could be drawn with the impenetrable trail of ownership and registration enveloping this plane. This story has dominated the headlines for more than two weeks and has fuelled speculation in some circles about safety and regulatory issues in this area of aviation. Cardiff's record signing agreed to join the Bluebirds for £15m on 19 January - their great hope in a fraught season fighting to stay in the Premier League - but fate conspired that he would never kick a ball for the club. Two days later, after a quick trip to his previous club Nantes to say farewell to friends, the 28-year-old Argentine boarded the Piper Malibu N264DB. Football agent Willie McKay, whose son Mark was acting for Nantes in the transfer, arranged the flight, which was piloted by David Ibbotson, from Crowle, North Lincolnshire. It lost contact with air traffic control north of Guernsey after requesting permission to descend from 5,000ft (1,500m) to 2,300ft (700m). Wreckage of the plane was found on the seabed two weeks later by a private underwater search paid for by a fundraising appeal. One body was still on board and Dorset Police confirmed late on Thursday night it was Sala. The body of Mr Ibbotson, a 59-year-old father of three, has not been found. Who owned the plane? The N prefix on the plane means it was registered in the US, but it is thought it was based in Britain - often flying out of Retford Gamston Airport in Nottinghamshire. It is not unusual for US-registered aircraft to be based elsewhere. A source has told us that this might be done for legal or pragmatic reasons, the maintenance and regulatory regime in the US being perceived as less stringent than in Europe. This is entirely lawful and it is estimated there are hundreds of planes flying out of UK airports registered this way. Documents from the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) in the US reveal the aircraft was registered in the name of a "trustee" firm - Southern Aircraft Consultancy (SAC), based in Bungay, Suffolk. This serves as an administrative "screen" and obscures the true beneficial owner or owners of an aircraft - the people with ultimate control and use of it. On its website, SAC says: "We specialise in providing individual trust agreements to non-US citizens to enable them to legally register their aircraft on the American 'N' register." SAC said it could not divulge who the owners were due to data protection laws, but had passed this information to the Air Accidents Investigation Branch (AAIB). The registration document can be found on the FAA database, stating the fixed-wing, single-engine aircraft's year of manufacture was 1984. But an associated document disclosing more ownership detail, including any associated companies or individuals, appears to have been removed from the database. One person who is known to have a connection to the aircraft is David Henderson. Mr Henderson, 60, from York, is an experienced charter pilot who was filmed by the BBC with the plane at Retford Gamston Airport in 2015 for a feature about ferry flying - the perilous but lucrative activity of transporting small planes across continents to new owners. In the hours after the disappearance of N264DB, he was reported by French media as having been on board the plane - it is thought because his name was on Nantes airport documentation relating to the flight. Mr Henderson posted a Facebook message early on the morning of 22 January stating that rumours of his death were untrue. In an interview with a French newspaper, Willie McKay, whose family organised the flight, has been reported as saying that he asked Mr Henderson to fly Emiliano Sala. It is believed that Mr Henderson was unable to do the trip and Mr Ibbotson flew the plane instead. The BBC has tried several times to speak to Mr Henderson but he has not issued any comment. Who are pilots allowed to fly? There are restrictions on the use of US-registered aircraft anywhere outside of the country. BBC Wales understands that in order to fly a US-registered aircraft outside the US with paying passengers, the owner or operator must hold an Air Operators' Certificate and the pilot must have a commercial licence. Both UK and US law state private pilots cannot make a profit by carrying passengers. Many pilots who only hold a private licence are signed up with online flight-sharing platforms such as Wingly - which has been described as "the Uber of the skies" - connecting passengers with pilots. As flying is an expensive pastime, this allows pilots to notch up their flying hours while sharing the cost of fuel, landing fees and other expenses with passengers. In a blog post in May 2018, Tony Rapson, head of Civil Aviation Authority's general aviation unit, warned: "It is important that the risks and the nature of the flight are understood by both parties." Who is liable in this tragedy? The complex nature of pilot licensing and the opaque nature of the aircraft ownership make for many unanswered questions about where liability rests in the event of a disaster such as this. If any illegality is established around the flight carrying Sala from France to Wales, the aircraft's insurers may ultimately question their liability - this could potentially leave the plane's hull and third party liability insurance null and void. The company that insured the plane is understood to be specialist aviation insurers Hayward Aviation, who declined to comment. An Air Accidents Investigation Branch spokesman said, "We will be looking at operational aspects of the flight including licensing and flight plans." Its safety investigation "does not apportion blame or liability" and any separate inquiry into licensing matters would be instigated by the CAA's enforcement division. Who was the pilot? David Ibbotson was a keen amateur pilot who worked as a gas boiler engineer and sometime DJ. The CAA confirmed he held a private pilot's licence in the UK. He also held a US private pilot's licence, issued in 2014, which he passed a medical for in November. It is not known if he held a pilot's licence in any other country. Described by one friend as a man who "lived for flying," he flew parachutists and skydivers from Hibaldstow Airfield in North Lincolnshire. A former member of the British Parachute Association's council, he was well-known in skydiving circles in the north of England. It is thought that he was flying parachutists on a non-commercial, voluntary basis for expenses only. Posting on a skydivers' forum under his nickname of Dibbo in October 2012, he refers to having more than 3,000 hours flying experience, including 2,000 flying parachutists. He said he was "available at short notice, and very reliable, just back recently from six weeks flying in Norway". As well as being a man who had a passion for flying it is also known that Mr Ibbotson faced challenges. He had £23,400 worth of county court judgements against him - at least one of which is thought to be related to his work as a gas boiler engineer. The most recent, for £4,412, was imposed just 10 days before the fatal flight left Nantes. While it is known that Sala did not pay for the flight what is not known is if Mr Ibbotson would have undertaken such a journey without payment in line with the constraints of his licence. Mr Ibbotson's family have yet to speak publicly about their loss. The pub where he was a regular, The Red Lion in Crowle, has opened a book of condolence and family and friends have been laying flowers and tributes in the centre of the village. In a statement released on Friday, Sala's family said their thoughts went out "to David Ibbotson and his family, hoping that the authorities will do their best to find him". While the grieving process for the Sala family can begin, the agony and uncertainty for Mr Ibbotson's loved ones goes on. 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STM Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Reading between the lines, that's not a subtle suggestion of suicide by the pilot? If he had a lot of money owed, it's surely a possibility. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoveItIfWeBeatU Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 That's a big jump to make. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raconteur Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Reading between the lines, that's not a subtle suggestion of suicide by the pilot? If he had a lot of money owed, it's surely a possibility. They seem to be pushing a narrative, but it's not just suicide, it's murder-suicide. You'd think the maintenance records would have been examined by now. Didn't say the plane was frightening on the flight over? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
morla84 Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Cant figure out why he decided to take someone with him, did it on the return trip, asked for permission to decend, and then escaped the crashed plane, if he just wanted to top himself? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoveItIfWeBeatU Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Escaped? Does every air crash come with a conspiracy now? As for Sala being scared on the previous flight, if he's used to flying on a commercial airlines then goes in a small propeller plane it's a lot more bumpy and noisy. Maybe he was nervous about flying anyway? The pilot was supposedly a last minute replacement. If the pilot really wanted to kill himself over £25K of debt he could have done it on any of his thousands of hours of flying without a passenger. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
morla84 Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 He wasnt in the plane when it was found, intentionally or not he escaped the plane Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoveItIfWeBeatU Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 He wasnt in the plane when it was found, intentionally or not he escaped the plane Are you implying he parachuted out over the sea or his dead body 'escaped' the plane after it crashed into the sea? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
morla84 Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Get a grip 👍 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToonArmy1892 Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 He wasnt in the plane when it was found, intentionally or not he escaped the plane Are you implying he parachuted out over the sea or his dead body 'escaped' the plane after it crashed into the sea? What on earth is this post? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 http://www.espn.co.uk/football/southampton/story/3771164/southampton-and-police-to-probe-incident-of-fans-mocking-emiliano-sala Southampton, police to probe incident of fans mocking Emiliano Sala Southampton said it will investigate an incident where two fans made gestures toward Cardiff City supporters allegedly mocking Emiliano Sala. The incident occurred before Cardiff's 2-1 win over Southampton on Saturday in Premier League action. Video shows the fans allegedly making airplane movements with their arms. "Southampton Football Club can confirm that two fans were detained and had their details taken by police during our match against Cardiff City on Saturday," the St. Mary's side said in a statement. "The Club will continue to work with Hampshire Police to identify any individuals deemed to have made indecent gestures towards Cardiff supporters. "Such behaviour has no place in our game and will not be tolerated at St Mary's. The club will be taking an extremely firm stance against anyone involved and intends to ban those supporters identified." Earlier this week, a body found in the wreckage of a plane in the English Channel has been identified as that of Sala. The plane, which was carrying the Argentine footballer, 28, and pilot David Ibbotson, 59, went missing from radar near Guernsey on Jan. 21. Sala was en route from his former Ligue 1 club Nantes to Cardiff after the Welsh club had signed him for a club-record £15 million fee when the plane crashed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Apparently it appears someone else was also on board and although it’s feared the other person didn’t survive either, the other person’s family and friends have been told they need not be concerned as Emiliano Sala’s body has since been recovered, bringing the footballer’s own family and friends some form of closure which was the main priority. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToonArmy1892 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Apparently it appears someone else was also on board and although it’s feared the other person didn’t survive either, the other person’s family and friends have been told they need not be concerned as Emiliano Sala’s body has since been recovered, bringing the footballer’s own family and friends some form of closure which was the main priority. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCW1983 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Escaped? Does every air crash come with a conspiracy now? As for Sala being scared on the previous flight, if he's used to flying on a commercial airlines then goes in a small propeller plane it's a lot more bumpy and noisy. Maybe he was nervous about flying anyway? The pilot was supposedly a last minute replacement. If the pilot really wanted to kill himself over £25K of debt he could have done it on any of his thousands of hours of flying without a passenger. I think the bit about Sala being scared the plane would fall apart is really being taken to literally. I agree with you, if he’s used to commercial airlines than a little Piper is going to feel like a tin can to him, it’s the kind of thing most people would say going from a Jet Liner to a Small Aircraft, like getting out of a BMW and getting into a Lada, it’s not the same experience. My feeling son the whole thing is that it’s being far to overthought, it’s been a accident in my eyes. A aircraft travelling on the limit of its capabilities has crashed killing two people. I still suspect it’ll be ice related, hence the drop in height. Will it have a tip top maintenance record, probably not but would a pilot risk his own life in a plane unfit to fly...I doubt that too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbnufc Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 He wasnt in the plane when it was found, intentionally or not he escaped the plane If it went in the water nose down course he wouldn't be in the wreckage. The whole front of the plane would be ripped off and destroyed. Hence why we saw the pic f the rear somewhat intact, assuming that's where Sala was sitting it'd also explain him still being in there. The pilot didn't "escape" ffs, he will have been taken away with sea currents Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
morla84 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 The guy leading the search said that the plane was largely in tact, not ripped in half. It's pointless trying to guess what happened anyway, my point is that its unlikely he committed suicide and murdered Sala. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoveItIfWeBeatU Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 He wasnt in the plane when it was found, intentionally or not he escaped the plane Are you implying he parachuted out over the sea or his dead body 'escaped' the plane after it crashed into the sea? What on earth is this post? My post? I took issue with the use of the word "escaped". The dictionary definition of "escaped" would mean alive. The dead don't escape from anywhere. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbnufc Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 "largely" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-47189770 £100,000 raised for search for the pilot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
huss9 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Apparently it appears someone else was also on board and although it’s feared the other person didn’t survive either, the other person’s family and friends have been told they need not be concerned as Emiliano Sala’s body has since been recovered, bringing the footballer’s own family and friends some form of closure which was the main priority. just HTT's way of saying that it feels as if this was all about Sala. Now that we we've found his body we can all move on. It's only in recent days that the press have realised that the pilot has a family also and they deserve very effort to find his body too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fugazi Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 How likely is it that pilot's body will actually be found though? Rather than just washing up somewhere. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
huss9 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 its a harsh truth but try telling that to his family. its worth at least one last go, just for them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fugazi Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Aye they've raised the money so they've got every right to give it a try. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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