Joe Willock

[greydos]

In terms of potentially being a goal scoring midfielder, Joelinton started from a less promising position than Willock and lol at where he is. In 3 years time I’m hopeful Willock can be a big part of this squad and not go the Dele Alli route

[TRon]

2 hours ago, KaKa said:

 

He's never in position to play anyone in or get a shot off. He's just completely lost out there. Longstaff who was playing deeper managed to find that great position to play Isak in for a wonderful goal. However, if you look back at it, that position is exactly where Willock should be really. Instead he is way out on the left for some reason.

 

Have you considered that it might be because Howe is asking him to track back a lot more? It's been pretty noticeable that in the second half of last season we've been seeing Willock playing a lot deeper, sometimes defending in our own penalty area, he covers a hell of a lot of ground. In fact that is the problem, he's usually absolutely spent after 70 mins. We really needed to get him substituted by then, but Howe wanted him to stay on. Maybe because he didn't think we had an alternative who could cover that much ground.

[Menace]

This dude needs a breather but we don't have the depth for it currently. He looks exhausted and I don't blame him, mostly plays full 90 too.

[TRon]

57 minutes ago, TorchyTBB said:

There is a player in there somewhere, but he is a coward, he doesn't even try to win a 70/30 tackle in his favour.  If he stops ducking out of tackles he'd be 100% more effective.

 

 

I think this is the real reason why a lot of fans don't like him. They want to see players who are going in hard for the tackles regardless of what else he does. Personally I think the modern game is more about closing down and you have to balance it with what else a player brings to the table. I think Willock is pretty good with the ball and he got us into some good positions in the first half with clever footwork and passing.

 

That's not to say he's top class though, he clearly isn't, neither is Longstaff. But they're what we've got for now, and I thought both put in a great shift yesterday.

[Tiresias]

I thought he had one of his better games but he is not a hard grafting central midfield ball winner, in fact I am not entirely sure what position he fits in how Howe wants to play, I would honestly be tempted to try him out wide if only as an alternative to Murphy not that i;m suggesting he will be ideal for it

[The College Dropout]

I think his running power, pressing and ability in transition is why Howe likes him.

 

What the current midfield 3 are really good at - is making the midfield a really physical zone which they often have success from.

[KaKa]

19 minutes ago, TRon said:

 

Have you considered that it might be because Howe is asking him to track back a lot more? It's been pretty noticeable that in the second half of last season we've been seeing Willock playing a lot deeper, sometimes defending in our own penalty area, he covers a hell of a lot of ground. In fact that is the problem, he's usually absolutely spent after 70 mins. We really needed to get him substituted by then, but Howe wanted him to stay on. Maybe because he didn't think we had an alternative who could cover that much ground.

 

No manager is telling any midfielder to not be in position to ever get on the ball and try to influence the game.

 

Every other player in our midfield seems to manage it, including those that have played in that same position when he doesn't start.

 

Come on man. I know you like him, but that's silly.

[Shadow Puppets]

For me, he was the main disappointment last night. Just doesn't seem to react to situations well at all. Always needs that extra second. Don't fault him for the goal, but I thought his all round play was really poor.

[gbandit]

Not really getting the criticism based on last night's performance. Sure, he tired and was past it by 75 mins but he did some great running and build-up play before then

[TRon]

1 hour ago, KaKa said:

 

No manager is telling any midfielder to not be in position to ever get on the ball and try to influence the game.

 

Every other player in our midfield seems to manage it, including those that have played in that same position when he doesn't start.

 

Come on man. I know you like him, but that's silly.

 

Don't blame me, it's Eddie Howe who is picking him. I'm just giving reasons why he might be doing so. I just said I'd prefer a top class midfielder instead.

[tomlynnherrington]

Why are people wanting  him to be given a chance to play in a number of positions? What would he bring to those positions? Because he runs around at times seems to be the only praise directed at him.After 34 games I’ve seen very little evidence to suggest he should be in the team.I also question his desire when it comes to courage ( blocking shots which could leave a nasty sore leg ?) 

For Liverpool’s winning goal,Salah causes all the problems at the back post.Willock is marking him.Well he was until the corner was taken.I didn’t see a player giving it his best shot at defending his goal.Our weak link,and weak when you need to be strong mentally and physically.

 

 

Edited September 1, 2022 by tomlynnherrington

[Lush Vlad]

3 hours ago, Tiresias said:

I thought he had one of his better games but he is not a hard grafting central midfield ball winner, in fact I am not entirely sure what position he fits in how Howe wants to play, I would honestly be tempted to try him out wide if only as an alternative to Murphy not that i;m suggesting he will be ideal for it

 

He is good in a counter attacking side, where he doesn't have too much responsibility.  The same as he was under Bruce and how ASM was often used.    

 

I think he is great at getting us up the pitch from deep with the ball and making those late runs off the ball into the box.  It just seems like he now has a more defined role and he isn't particularly effective in doing it.  He presses well, like most of the team do.  But then that has seemed to take away from the attacking side of his game and when he has a bit less space to work in, he isn't that good on the ball with his passing or decision making.  

 

I actually really like him and what he brings, a lot of the time.  But he now looks almost a bit positonless in this current 4-3-3 and I'd argue might even be the weakest link of our strongest starting XI.  Which is why I have been so keen on getting another centre mid in, over a wide player.  Willock can be ineffective and Longstaff isn't really a great deal better.  Leaves us with the Brazillian boys and an injured Shelvey, who I don't rate that highly, either. 

[Lotus]

Agree with many in here. He’ll be useful in away games or when the opponents push up. 
Would’ve thought he’d offer more last night given that but I think he was wary of leaving holes in midfield behind me if he made some runs. 
Also, unfamiliarity with Isak.

[Ikon]

He is athletic but lacks in technical ability and passing which goes hand in hand many times. Good in transition at times. I don’t see him having a long term future with us. As a squad player at best I imagine. He’s ok for now to have around. I like him but just don’t think he has what it takes for where we are aiming and how we are trying to play. 

[tomlynnherrington]

2 hours ago, Ikon said:

He is athletic but lacks in technical ability and passing which goes hand in hand many times. Good in transition at times. I don’t see him having a long term future with us. As a squad player at best I imagine. He’s ok for now to have around. I like him but just don’t think he has what it takes for where we are aiming and how we are trying to play. 

Very good post

[Happinesstan]

On 01/09/2022 at 09:48, KaKa said:

 

He's never a central midfielder that is for absolute certain.

 

He loves making those forward runs and when in position to do so can put the ball in the net. Honestly, I wish at this point we'd try him in that wide right position.

 

I'd rather see Almiron at RCM and Willock RW at this point. Think both would benefit.

Aye. Good point. I think Willock could play the RW similarly to how I expect Isak to. Making us look something like this in attack: Trippier and Almiron being interchangeable.

 

     ASM   Wilson  Isak  Almiron

Targett  Joelinton Bruno   Trippier

-----------------------------------

              Botman   Schar

                      Pope            

 

Patient possession based build up down the right, with Almiron and Trippier, direct running at the defence on the right with Targett and Joelinton as insurance. 

That looks pretty 

[Happinesstan]

On 01/09/2022 at 10:31, TRon said:

 

Have you considered that it might be because Howe is asking him to track back a lot more? It's been pretty noticeable that in the second half of last season we've been seeing Willock playing a lot deeper, sometimes defending in our own penalty area, he covers a hell of a lot of ground. In fact that is the problem, he's usually absolutely spent after 70 mins. We really needed to get him substituted by then, but Howe wanted him to stay on. Maybe because he didn't think we had an alternative who could cover that much ground.

I think everything is being considered, tbf. Even if everything isn't mentioned within a post. What you say is obvious to anybody watching our games, at least 2 of our goals have been conceded with him in the position you mention. I ,might curse him at the time, but my complaint is actually that he is being asked to play a role that he is not quite able to do. It's not a criticism of the player, simply an observation on the functionality of our set up and team selection.

Having said that, it won't take much for people to start blaming him personally for not being as good as Bruno.

[Happinesstan]

On 01/09/2022 at 10:32, Menace said:

This dude needs a breather but we don't have the depth for it currently. He looks exhausted and I don't blame him, mostly plays full 90 too.

Definitely. He's started every game and played at least 70 mins in each of them. Adding up the minutes he has been rested from substitutions tells us he has missed only 71 minutes of our total game time.

 

Interesting fact. Liverpool is the first game in which we conceded late on, it is also the first time Willock has been asked to play 90 mins.

 

 

Edited September 2, 2022 by Happinesstan

[toontownman]

The role/position he is in just isnt working 

 

Seems like a lovely guy but I do wonder if the amount of instruction, responsibility and detail Howe likely gives him is too much for him. He thrived under Bruce likely because he could do whatever the fuck he wanted and was played mainly in advanced positions. 

 

He just doesn't seem to gel in that pocket next to almiron, tripps and schar. He is what we have though until Bruno is back at least. Maybe put him wide and almiron central. He is at his best a bit more advanced though. Really doesn't seem to suit playing from deep and can't break away too much when Schar is pinging balls over him. Wouldn't move Joey from where he is either but maybe that's an option.

 

We know there is a player there but it's not one that fits in our team very well right now.

[Happinesstan]

1 hour ago, toontownman said:

The role/position he is in just isnt working 

 

Seems like a lovely guy but I do wonder if the amount of instruction, responsibility and detail Howe likely gives him is too much for him. He thrived under Bruce likely because he could do whatever the fuck he wanted and was played mainly in advanced positions. 

 

He just doesn't seem to gel in that pocket next to almiron, tripps and schar. He is what we have though until Bruno is back at least. Maybe put him wide and almiron central. He is at his best a bit more advanced though. Really doesn't seem to suit playing from deep and can't break away too much when Schar is pinging balls over him. Wouldn't move Joey from where he is either but maybe that's an option.

 

We know there is a player there but it's not one that fits in our team very well right now.

It's not working for him, and he's getting a lot of stick for obvious deficiencies. But he's obviously playing a vital role in how we are playing. 

He benefitted from Bruce's 'let's play' philosophy by constantly getting into the box. It seems obvious Howe has given him particular instructions that affect his ability to do that.

My hope is that Howe has used these early games to present him a challenge. Whether he has risen to that challenge probably won't be answered for some time.

[gbandit]

Realistically, his skill set is best suited on making runs into the box and general runs in the final third. He has the attributes more fitting of a forward role. He doesn’t have the technical ability / physicality to play in the middle. I hope we can figure it out as he’s definitely got great aspects to his game but he’s stalled rather than pushed on and mentally he seems like he doesn’t have the fire on the pitch or belief at times 

[Happinesstan]

5 minutes ago, gbandit said:

Realistically, his skill set is best suited on making runs into the box and general runs in the final third. He has the attributes more fitting of a forward role. He doesn’t have the technical ability / physicality to play in the middle. I hope we can figure it out as he’s definitely got great aspects to his game but he’s stalled rather than pushed on and mentally he seems like he doesn’t have the fire on the pitch or belief at times 

Noticed a certain nervousness in some of his interviews, he seems to settle, but I think he's a lot younger than his age. Hopefully he can benefit from Isak's presence.

Really want him to succeed here.

[Myleftboot]

He plays off the striker that’s his position. Howe doesn’t play that way so we are trying to accommodate him in a different position which doesn’t work. Unless we change our system I think he’ll go back down south next season.

[Happinesstan]

8 minutes ago, Myleftboot said:

He plays off the striker that’s his position. Howe doesn’t play that way so we are trying to accommodate him in a different position which doesn’t work. Unless we change our system I think he’ll go back down south next season.

I was quite encouraged by his getting into the box today, actually. When I first switched on he was in there, on the right hand side, exactly were I want to see him.

I do agree though, he's not [yet] the player Howe wants in that position. Just weird to think he's started every game. I think a break from first team duties, to reflect on his recent experience, will do him good.

Basically, drop him, but be nice.

[toontownman]

Only just turned 23 too. 

 

We have been playing 

 

 Big Joe                Willock

             Longstaff 

 

Haven't we? When 

 

            Willock

Big Joe         Longstaff 

 

Probably works better for him but maybe not the team.