The College Dropout Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 8 minutes ago, madras said: We don't because we didn't have the players for it or are we legally bound to ? Eddie said in close season we had to become more possession based, that's not going to happen with our version of 433 designed to press and break quick. Tonali will end up playing in a middle 2 for us, I hope it's with Bruno. This is a good idea. There's just no evidence for it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 1 minute ago, Matt1892 said: It is the managers preferred formation and he has only moved away from it trial wingbacks. He has not attempted a double pivot even in preseason friendlies, so to argue he has bought a player to play there based on him saying we need to retain possession more is clutching at straws at best. His preferred formation at Bournemouth was always 442, 4411, maybe his preferred formation is what gets the best out of what he's got and he's not wedded to any formation and that will change as needs dictate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 2 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: This is a good idea. There's just no evidence for it. I'd say the Tonali signing was evidence. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 3 minutes ago, Matt1892 said: It is the managers preferred formation and he has only moved away from it trial wingbacks. He has not attempted a double pivot even in preseason friendlies, so to argue he has bought a player to play there based on him saying we need to retain possession more is clutching at straws at best. Tonali was here days really, he signed and went off with the national squad and we know how gradually he does things, see Bruno and Botman. Tonali wouldn't have started V Villa had Longstaff been fit, then it's get him fit enough, used to the pace, then changes in formations etc which may not ha e started until after the Champs league was out the way. Why else buy an international central midfielder who's best football has been in a 2 and would allow Bruno to push ona and be that bit more creative ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 (edited) 6 minutes ago, madras said: I'd say the Tonali signing was evidence. He signed Barnes a LW. So we are going to play 2 left-wingers to accommodate him and Gordon. Tonali isn't even a possession-style player like that. Tonali & Barnes on paper plug & play pretty well with Howe's high-intensity system. 1 midfielder isn't going to turn us into a possession side. Edited January 4 by The College Dropout Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt1892 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 2 minutes ago, madras said: His preferred formation at Bournemouth was always 442, 4411, maybe his preferred formation is what gets the best out of what he's got and he's not wedded to any formation and that will change as needs dictate. He has spent around £350 million on players, yet we are to believe that he doesn’t play his preferred formation due to not having the players to play it? He will change the formation, but it will be because this current set up has been figured out by the opposition rather than because we have signed Tonali. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Just now, The College Dropout said: He signed Barnes a LW. So we are going to play 2 left-wingers to accommodate him and Gordon. Tonali isn't even a possession-style player like that. Tonali & Barnes on paper plug & play pretty well with Howe's high-intensity system Gordon has played plenty on the right and offers cross cover and off a forward. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Just now, Matt1892 said: He has spent around £350 million on players, yet we are to believe that he doesn’t play his preferred formation due to not having the players to play it? He will change the formation, but it will be because this current set up has been figured out by the opposition rather than because we have signed Tonali. That was his preferred during his Bournemouth days, he has spent a lot of time with other elite managers since then. Also, it’s worthy of noting the system he used to play isn’t played by other top teams in football. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Matt1892 said: He has spent around £350 million on players, yet we are to believe that he doesn’t play his preferred formation due to not having the players to play it? He will change the formation, but it will be because this current set up has been figured out by the opposition rather than because we have signed Tonali. What's Peps formation or does it evolve ? Also I think he was thinking it had been started to be found out last season, we did tweak it. Edited January 4 by madras Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt1892 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 7 minutes ago, madras said: What's Peps formation or does it evolve ? Also I think he was thinking it had been started to be found out last season, we did tweak it. Fingers crossed we get to see the double pivot on Saturday then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 Is Howe’s press conference today? Was expecting it to be a couple of days before. Itching to listen to the man speak - he normally instills some confidence (and I’m not the one playing) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
relámpago blanco Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 2 hours ago, TheBrownBottle said: Is Howe’s press conference today? Was expecting it to be a couple of days before. Itching to listen to the man speak - he normally instills some confidence (and I’m not the one playing) Hasn't been working lately. Though I do feel we just need a win and we'll go on a run when players are returning. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menace Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 2 hours ago, TheBrownBottle said: Is Howe’s press conference today? Was expecting it to be a couple of days before. Itching to listen to the man speak - he normally instills some confidence (and I’m not the one playing) 9am Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 9 hours ago, Matt1892 said: Fingers crossed we get to see the double pivot on Saturday then. Not until we have the players to do it ie when Tonali is back. We did kind of try it at Leeds last season when Joelinton played a lot more central allowing Bruno to get forward a bit more. Abandoned after about half an hour cos Joe couldn't do it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 I have an almost irrational hatred of the double pivot, not that it isn't possibly useless but there was a period where every team was playing 4-2-3-1 with 2 players in midfield sat in front of a back 4 and there weren't many goals Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 3 minutes ago, Tiresias said: I have an almost irrational hatred of the double pivot, not that it isn't possibly useless but there was a period where every team was playing 4-2-3-1 with 2 players in midfield sat in front of a back 4 and there weren't many goals Agreed. Don't Villa essentially play with a double-pivot? They do it well. It's a lot more fluid than the old 4231 though. Often looks like a back 3. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 Kamara is a DM by trade so I guess his instincts will be to stay back. But I don’t know much about their system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikky Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 16 minutes ago, Tiresias said: I have an almost irrational hatred of the double pivot, not that it isn't possibly useless but there was a period where every team was playing 4-2-3-1 with 2 players in midfield sat in front of a back 4 and there weren't many goals Its a system we should adopt away from home tbh - and should work well with Tonali - we’ve been too soft recently Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloGeordio Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 (edited) Edited January 5 by PauloGeordio Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 25 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: Agreed. Don't Villa essentially play with a double-pivot? They do it well. It's a lot more fluid than the old 4231 though. Often looks like a back 3. It is and there's a laziness creeping in in football circles where any set up with 2 CM's is labelled a double pivot. Also re Villa's back 4 often looking like a 3 when in possession.......does it sound familiar? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 (edited) 22 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said: Kamara is a DM by trade so I guess his instincts will be to stay back. But I don’t know much about their system. Douglas Luiz plays alongside him deep. Luiz is more of an all-rounder, the progressive passer. In my mind it often ends up something like: Konsa Torres Digne Luiz Kamara Bailey/Cash McGinn Diaby Watkins Torres & Luiz progressing play from deep. Edited January 5 by The College Dropout Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrRaspberryJam Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 Did Howe given any soundbites in his presser to help calm our nerves? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 2 hours ago, AyeDubbleYoo said: Kamara is a DM by trade so I guess his instincts will be to stay back. But I don’t know much about their system. Another successful team with a specialist DM. If only. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrRaspberryJam Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 18 minutes ago, Yorkie said: Not sure how to take his comments about running on empty. Is he saying the players aren't running on empty, or that he's just not using that as an excuse? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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