Eddie Howe

[Deuce]

Seems unlikely, though not impossible, that we’ll end up in a European spot. Hope we make a proper go of the cup and aim to finish top 10.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

8 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said:

A starting Left back, RW and DM, a pacey CB as well. Obviously only my opinion but I thought they where the biggest areas for upgrade needed in the summer, and still are today.

Fair I guess, you could argue Barnes was the winger who adds goals and Tonali was the complement to Bruno and together they would complete the midfield. 

[WideopenMag]

2 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said:

But even there you are almost putting square pegs in round holes. For where we want to be, I think we should have really upgraded the areas I mentioned with top quality in that position. We didn’t and are suffering now as a result imo.

It isn't square pegs at all though? If everyone was fit Barnes would be our starting LW and Gordon RW...if Tonali and been starting alongside Bruno no one would be calling for a DM it's easy to say this things in hindsight, howe has been fucke by injuries. 

[Ikon]

Just now, SUPERTOON said:

But even there you are almost putting square pegs in round holes. For where we want to be, I think we should have really upgraded the areas I mentioned with top quality in that position. We didn’t and are suffering now as a result imo.

This. And I don’t see our wingers offering much against low block teams. Said before the season started that teams are gonna start playing differently against us, and most of all be more aware of us and how we play. Said that we need more technical ability and try to evolve more towards a balance between high intensity and technical/possession based team to get to the next level. All the injuries and so on definitely hasn’t helped obviously. I think Barnes will offer us good quality in some games but he isn’t a player I would have signed as I don’t see him good enough in general play or against team that sit deeper. Especially with Gordon here already. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

We were never going to buy a DM because we play 433 and Bruno is one of the best central midfielders around. 

[SUPERTOON]

Just now, WideopenMag said:

It isn't square pegs at all though? If everyone was fit Barnes would be our starting LW and Gordon RW...if Tonali and been starting alongside Bruno no one would be calling for a DM it's easy to say this things in hindsight, howe has been fucke by injuries. 

It is when you look at my initial post, I said RW and DM for me and none of the players play that position. 

[Sempiternal]

Just now, WideopenMag said:

It isn't square pegs at all though? If everyone was fit Barnes would be our starting LW and Gordon RW...if Tonali and been starting alongside Bruno no one would be calling for a DM it's easy to say this things in hindsight, howe has been fucke by injuries. 

The Bruno/Tonali midfield was a problem early in the season iirc. Both occupying each others spaces and the midfield being wide open. We needed a DM then 

[LiquidAK]

I still think we'll make top 7. We're up there already despite all our issues and we'll be infinitely stronger in the 2nd half of the season with fewer injuries and games. If we can get through a grim looking January still in the FA Cup and reset from there we'll be fine.

[Sima]

58 minutes ago, LionOfGosforth said:

 

He'll be the next one Man Utd or (more likely) Chelsea throw a fortune at to recruit before chewing him up, spitting him out and sacking him 9-12 months later. They love the latest toys. FWIW, he seems class and I hope he at least doesn't end up at either of those.

Xabi Alonso’s Liverpool links will stop that happening.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

2 minutes ago, Sempiternal said:

The Bruno/Tonali midfield was a problem early in the season iirc. Both occupying each others spaces and the midfield being wide open. We needed a DM then 

Way too little information to conclude anything though. They’re both amazing players, every reason to believe it would have worked brilliantly given a little time. 

[WideopenMag]

2 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said:

It is when you look at my initial post, I said RW and DM for me and none of the players play that position. 

Except they were signed to fix those positions. Like I said Barnes would have been our starting LW, 13 goals last season and a 40 million signing? You think that was for the bench? No wed have played both him and Gordon. Tonali is a DM/CM he was signed for 50 million to start alongside Bruno. 

[The College Dropout]

13 minutes ago, Sempiternal said:

He would be my pick if they did move on. 100 percent. Not advocating it, just in that instance. Prob get one shot at him when he leaves Leverkusen 

He's the standout manager who isn't at one of those mega clubs.

 

Possibly similar to Mourinho at Porto in that sense but he hasn't actually won anything but because of his stature as a player and his current achievements he's at the top of the list.

 

Even if we were doing better, he still stands out. Managing the European campaign well helps too.

[Sempiternal]

1 minute ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

Way too little information to conclude anything though. They’re both amazing players, every reason to believe it would have worked brilliantly given a little time. 

I’m not sure Tonali was amazing for us tbf. But neither are prone to play defensively and our midfield was wide open with both of them playing. 

[SUPERTOON]

Just now, WideopenMag said:

Except they were signed to fix those positions. Like I said Barnes would have been our starting LW, 13 goals last season and a 40 million signing? You think that was for the bench? No wed have played both him and Gordon. Tonali is a DM/CM he was signed for 50 million to start alongside Bruno. 

No I don’t think he was for  the bench, I’m not saying that, I said imo we needed a top class DM and top class RW and neither Tonali or Barnes are because that isn’t their position. 
 

It’s alright saying we would have moved Gordon but he isn’t a RW either. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Just now, Sempiternal said:

I’m not sure Tonali was amazing for us tbf. But neither are prone to play defensively and our midfield was wide open with both of them playing. 

No he wasn’t, that’s not my point. He’s proven to be a top player and he had just signed. 

[Ikon]

Just now, SUPERTOON said:

No I don’t think he was for  the bench, I’m not saying that, I said imo we needed a top class DM and top class RW and neither Tonali or Barnes are because that isn’t their position. 
 

It’s alright saying we would have moved Gordon but he isn’t a RW either. 

None of them offer any proper flair/creativity either. 

[The College Dropout]

1 minute ago, Sima said:

Xabi Alonso’s Liverpool links will stop that happening.

Nah it won't.

 

But there's going to be a Madrid opening in the summer. He had a good spell over there - won the league and La Decima. Carlo is leaving. It's 1+1 IMO. Don Flo will love that he's ex-Madridista and big name.

[WideopenMag]

Just now, SUPERTOON said:

No I don’t think he was for  the bench, I’m not saying that, I said imo we needed a top class DM and top class RW and neither Tonali or Barnes are because that isn’t their position. 
 

It’s alright saying we would have moved Gordon but he isn’t a RW either. 

He played games for Everton at RW Howe has consistently moved him to RW throughout this season, it's clear he thinks he can play there he kicks with both feet. Tonalis position is Dm/CM for Milan so yeah I don't yet your point.

[The College Dropout]

I still don't like Barnes & Gordon as our wide players. It limits Barnes as a goal scorer and neither are creative.

[Sempiternal]

1 minute ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

No he wasn’t, that’s not my point. He’s proven to be a top player and he had just signed. 

Yeah but also very good players have proven unable to play together plenty. I think they take up too many of the same positions. Our mid is very weird at times, just seemingly hybrid 8s everywhere 

[SUPERTOON]

Just now, WideopenMag said:

He played games for Everton at RW Howe has consistently moved him to RW throughout this season, it's clear he thinks he can play there he kicks with both feet. Tonalis position is Dm/CM for Milan so yeah I don't yet your point.

Yeah let’s move on, think I made a simple point to be honest, they may be able to play those positions but it isn’t their strongest position. Tonali isn’t a DM at all btw, that’s pretty clear. He’s basically a longstaff upgrade.

[The College Dropout]

1 minute ago, WideopenMag said:

He played games for Everton at RW Howe has consistently moved him to RW throughout this season, it's clear he thinks he can play there he kicks with both feet. Tonalis position is Dm/CM for Milan so yeah I don't yet your point.

Tonali wasn't a DM for Milan and from what I've seen - he's not a DM at all. Not that he couldn't play there - it's just not his game. He was definitely signed to replace Longstaff.

 

[WideopenMag]

Just now, SUPERTOON said:

Yeah let’s move on, think I made a simple point to be honest, they may be able to play those positions but it isn’t their strongest position. Tonali isn’t a DM at all btw, that’s pretty clear. He’s basically a longstaff upgrade.

Longstaff upgrade ?? complete utter nonsense. 

[HaydnNUFC]

Howe has more than enough credit in the bank to avoid serious talk about him losing his job. (even if there is any) What he did here not just last season but in 2021-22 when he kept us up should give him plenty of time to navigate this sticky patch. And it is a sticky patch; 6 defeats in 7, the only win in the last 7 being against 10 men, out of Europe altogether before Christmas and running on fumes.

 

The one thing that is troubling me however is there doesn’t seem to be a coherent tactical plan or pattern in our play defensively or offensively. I remember back in January 2022 when we just drew 1-1 at home to Watford and had 1 win in 21 games or something but I still was fully behind Howe even as the shadow of Benitez loomed. The reason for that is you could see clear improvements in individuals and clear tactical plans and patterns being implemented but the playing staff he had at his disposal then were simply just not good enough hence the constant individual howlers and lapses in concentration that cost us back then. Alas, we signed improvements in January and the team improved exponentially. I can’t see those patterns or improvements this time however. And I think this leads onto the next point.

 

To put it bluntly, imo the summer window was a failure. Really easy to say now with 20-20 hindsight but we did not sign the personnel required to improve the first XI; the way Howe tries to get us playing is intense, pressing football that baits the opposition into a game of chaos in which we can kill teams, even the top ones, on transitions. But that can’t be the way a team plays over 38 league games plus 6 European games on top of the already existing cup games due to the physical exertion it demands and the schedule that comes with it. Our pressing game papers/papered over the fact that many of our players do not possess great individual quality that is required for a top 6 side; players like Longstaff, Almiron, Burn. So when the team is tired, the level of quality seeps through and shows and it either gets you through gritty matches or costs you as seen today. The players we should have went for in the summer were players that possess similar levels of quality that Isak, Bruno and Botman have. Tonali potentially was/is one, but we have a large outlay on 2 young full backs that so far have only got game time because of injuries and despite performing better than the players they are replacing (certainly in Livramento’s case) they are dropped as soon as the injured players they replaced have returned. ~£40m on Barnes despite us needing a right sided wide man since imo even before the takeover. The sides around us improved their first choice XIs, we didn't.

 

I think the worse thing I can say from probably a selfish POV is I’m just not enjoying watching us this season. We’re incredibly easy to play through and hit on the break plus there’s no real pattern in our attacking play. I don’t think Howe has done himself favours these last few games but he absolutely deserves the time to see this sticky patch through. Time for him to earn his salt, and for the owners to give him and the team the help they need in the transfer market.

[Jackie Broon]

1 minute ago, SUPERTOON said:

No I don’t think he was for  the bench, I’m not saying that, I said imo we needed a top class DM and top class RW and neither Tonali or Barnes are because that isn’t their position. 
 

It’s alright saying we would have moved Gordon but he isn’t a RW either. 

 

I think the plan is to rotate our wide players, taking advantage of the 5 subs for them to run themselves into the ground for 45-60 minutes and then bring fresh legs on.