Coastie Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 hour ago, TheBrownBottle said: He got done well and truly by your lads last week mind Coastie! He was, but not much of it was his fault. Our lads tore M City apart out wide and that's where the damage was done. Have a look at Sammy Silvera - only 22 and already had one Euro experience that didn't work out (I refer you to my earlier comments on Australians going too early). He came back and rediscovered his confidence - super quick and very creative. Good's well regarded here but there's no comparison between AL and EPL. The very best AL sides might survive in the Championship... might. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 12 minutes ago, Coastie said: He was, but not much of it was his fault. Our lads tore M City apart out wide and that's where the damage was done. Have a look at Sammy Silvera - only 22 and already had one Euro experience that didn't work out (I refer you to my earlier comments on Australians going too early). He came back and rediscovered his confidence - super quick and very creative. Good's well regarded here but there's no comparison between AL and EPL. The very best AL sides might survive in the Championship... might. Silvera is fun to watch tbf - he tore Wanderers back line apart when I watched him play against them in Parramatta late last year. CCM were fun to watch generally last season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeddySAFC Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 hour ago, Sima said: Reading between the lines on the N’Dong/M’Vila history, M’Vila commanded huge wages which the club couldn’t afford and the N’Dong signing was instalments over about 8 years so was a more attractive financial package for cash flow. Just it turned out that N’Dong was absolute bobbins. That went well Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussiemag Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 hour ago, Coastie said: He was, but not much of it was his fault. Our lads tore M City apart out wide and that's where the damage was done. Have a look at Sammy Silvera - only 22 and already had one Euro experience that didn't work out (I refer you to my earlier comments on Australians going too early). He came back and rediscovered his confidence - super quick and very creative. Good's well regarded here but there's no comparison between AL and EPL. The very best AL sides might survive in the Championship... might. By all accounts, Curtis Good trained the house down when on trial at NUFC. Held his own against Cisse, Ba, Ben Arfa et al. He had a decent season out loan at Bradford and made the League Cup Final playing left back. He then injured his hip playing for Australia on debut and was never the same again. Dont think he played a Senior game for 4 years or so after that. Its hard to know how good he could have been. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viana Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 2 hours ago, TeddySAFC said: Excellent summary. He never seemed that he wanted to be in the job from the off to be honest, Even his first press conference seemed to be like he was doing us a favour, not that he was trying to get his managerial career back on track after failing at United then Sociedad. We actually played quite well in his first game, We had City away and nearly knicked a point but McNair scored a last minute own goal and we got beat. It was baffling that the very next game following defeat he basically admitted a difficult season and in a relegation battle (even if he thought it, don't mention it a week into the season) His signings were an absolute joke, We had Yann M'Vila begging for us to sign him after an immese season the year before on loan and he opted to ignore that and break our record transfer fee on Didier N'Dong - who this week, has now been relegated in 6 of his last 7 seasons. He signed his chums from Everton who were in it for one last pay day, the likes of Pienaar and Gibson could barely move. Gibson then decided to get pissed up and smash into a lampost which could have killed somebody not far from the city centre. Everything about his reign was horrific, He knew his heart wasn't in it but just bluffed his way from game to game and then finally jacked it in when relegation was confirmed about 6 games from the end of the season. His football was awful (to be fair I don't even think it's great at West Ham but he gets by because they have some decent players) and his attitude was stinking. 35-40M isn't a huge ammount in PL terms, but we've never really spent big so in contrast to others it was a fair whack. He managed to do what the likes of Ricky Sbragia, Steve Bruce, Paolo Di Canio, Martin O'Neill and co couldn't, and that was get us relegated despite being absolutely shite. I don't think losing Jeremain Lens helped either. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeddySAFC Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 9 hours ago, Viana said: I don't think losing Jeremain Lens helped either. Forgot about him, He wasn't great mind. Just had a look at some of the players Moyes bought that season.. Anichebe, Pienaar, Lescott, Oviedo, Gibson - What was he expecting with that man Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack j Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 Just now, TeddySAFC said: Forgot about him, He wasn't great mind. Just had a look at some of the players Moyes bought that season.. Anichebe, Pienaar, Lescott, Oviedo, Gibson - What was he expecting with that man Blue shirts and z cars Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sima Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 11 hours ago, TeddySAFC said: That went well Putting money in wasn't Ellis Short's issue, just that he hired absolute dunderheads in key positions. If he'd had Speakman, for example, things would have been significantly different. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeddySAFC Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 Just now, Sima said: Putting money in wasn't Ellis Short's issue, just that he hired absolute dunderheads in key positions. If he'd had Speakman, for example, things would have been significantly different. Agreed but he essentially he turned the tap off as soon as we went down and pocketed all player sales, Giving Grayson absolutely zero money to work with which is why we plundered again. Conversation for another day about Short, his heart was in the right place he just didn't have a clue about building a foundation at the club. It turned sour when we dropped into the Championship purely because he just gave up and watched the club implode. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
christ Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 1 minute ago, Sima said: Putting money in wasn't Ellis Short's issue, just that he hired absolute dunderheads in key positions. If he'd had Speakman, for example, things would have been significantly different. Was it Di Fanti who rocked up looking like a disgraced pornographer and started buying any old shite from the continent? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_R Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 2 hours ago, TeddySAFC said: Agreed but he essentially he turned the tap off as soon as we went down and pocketed all player sales, Giving Grayson absolutely zero money to work with which is why we plundered again. Conversation for another day about Short, his heart was in the right place he just didn't have a clue about building a foundation at the club. It turned sour when we dropped into the Championship purely because he just gave up and watched the club implode. Why was Short obligated to throw good money after bad though? What's wrong with him doing what he did and saying "that's my limit, enough is enough"? Why, after all he put in, did he (at least seemingly in the opinion of many of your fans) owe Sunderland even more than the hundreds of millions he poured into the club? Maybe he had some mad expectation that after years of funding the club, the fans might actually be willing to spend more than an average of about £10/game so that he wasn't hemorrhaging money like someone trying to bail out a boat with a sieve, and his shrug off the shoulders and cry of "fuck it" was perfectly rational, and blame can better be traced back to the supporters who, quite frankly, didn't support. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hovagod Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 40 minutes ago, Chris_R said: Why was Short obligated to throw good money after bad though? What's wrong with him doing what he did and saying "that's my limit, enough is enough"? Why, after all he put in, did he (at least seemingly in the opinion of many of your fans) owe Sunderland even more than the hundreds of millions he poured into the club? Maybe he had some mad expectation that after years of funding the club, the fans might actually be willing to spend more than an average of about £10/game so that he wasn't hemorrhaging money like someone trying to bail out a boat with a sieve, and his shrug off the shoulders and cry of "fuck it" was perfectly rational, and blame can better be traced back to the supporters who, quite frankly, didn't support. They also blindly lapped up those signings in 2011 which the rest of the world could see were suicidal. He denies this now, but I vividly remember a friend phoning me to brag about signing Connor Whickham. Their business model was as clueless as the support propping it up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dancing Brave Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 RTG is officially the best internet forum for football fans https://www.readytogo.net/smb/threads/is-this-the-best-football-club-forum-on-the-internet.1609183/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dancing Brave Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 sunland fans don't want Man City to win the champions league because they are state owned by a country with a bad human rights record...or do they ? https://www.readytogo.net/smb/threads/haway-then-man-city-or-inter-milan-and-why.1609190/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeddySAFC Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 2 hours ago, Chris_R said: Why was Short obligated to throw good money after bad though? What's wrong with him doing what he did and saying "that's my limit, enough is enough"? Why, after all he put in, did he (at least seemingly in the opinion of many of your fans) owe Sunderland even more than the hundreds of millions he poured into the club? Maybe he had some mad expectation that after years of funding the club, the fans might actually be willing to spend more than an average of about £10/game so that he wasn't hemorrhaging money like someone trying to bail out a boat with a sieve, and his shrug off the shoulders and cry of "fuck it" was perfectly rational, and blame can better be traced back to the supporters who, quite frankly, didn't support. He wasn't obligated too, hence why he didn't. From a business perspective though you would attempt to get the club back to the PL as it's a more sellable asset rather than just letting it rot and falling down the divisions before essentially having to give it away for nowt. Not sure how you can turn his mismanagement onto the fans, strange take. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeddySAFC Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 1 hour ago, Hovagod said: They also blindly lapped up those signings in 2011 which the rest of the world could see were suicidal. He denies this now, but I vividly remember a friend phoning me to brag about signing Connor Whickham. Their business model was as clueless as the support propping it up. 2011 was one of our better windows, which sums it up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleazy Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 1 hour ago, TeddySAFC said: He wasn't obligated too, hence why he didn't. From a business perspective though you would attempt to get the club back to the PL as it's a more sellable asset rather than just letting it rot and falling down the divisions before essentially having to give it away for nowt. Not sure how you can turn his mismanagement onto the fans, strange take. aye tbf like even Ashley knew that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viana Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 5 hours ago, TeddySAFC said: Forgot about him, He wasn't great mind. Just had a look at some of the players Moyes bought that season.. Anichebe, Pienaar, Lescott, Oviedo, Gibson - What was he expecting with that man Won't hear a bad word said about Oviedo. Laid the ground work for Jewison to leave Costa Rica. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 (edited) The simplistic story went that Quinn sold Short a bill of goods and Short would pump money in provided they got 40k+ gates. Think Quinn's eagerness to ferry them to the ground and shut down pubs showing the matches stemmed from this. Whether he himself knew how heavily papered and cheapened those early years gates at the Stadium of Light were when he played who knows. But they were exceptional rather than a rule to base things on in any case. Thats where the notion of the lack of support comes in. Basically the opposite of the Keegan/Hall era. The fans kept coming, kept paying nd the club kept growing so the club kept spending. Edited June 9, 2023 by Jonas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_R Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 2 hours ago, TeddySAFC said: He wasn't obligated too, hence why he didn't. From a business perspective though you would attempt to get the club back to the PL as it's a more sellable asset rather than just letting it rot and falling down the divisions before essentially having to give it away for nowt. Not sure how you can turn his mismanagement onto the fans, strange take. It's not a strange take. Firstly, of course Short as an adult is responsible for his own decisions, many of which were clearly bad. I'm not detracting from that. But he probably banked on the fans actually filling the stadium with full priced tickets which would have made his investment affordable. When they didn't, it wasn't. He probably then didn't see the point of bankrolling you further in the Championship because you'd need serious investment to get back up and get back up for what reason? To be unprofitable in the PL again? How much is a team worth that doesn't even make money in the PL? He realised he'd been sold a pup and cut his losses. 1 hour ago, sleazy said: aye tbf like even Ashley knew that Ashley knew that in the PL, we were highly profitable. Sunderland weren't, again largely because their own fans didn't want to pay proper money for tickets. If they were averaging what was it, £10/head instead of maybe £45/head (sure, kids tickets are less but corporate could be way higher), assuming a full stadium that's a deficit of £28m/season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 The Fender v Pink stuff, make it stop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleazy Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 3 minutes ago, The Prophet said: The Fender v Pink stuff, make it stop. really? whos bleating on about that?, weird thing to argue about Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sima Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 RTG is absolutely fewmin about Fender like. Thread up to 19 pages now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucasol Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 9 minutes ago, Sima said: RTG is absolutely fewmin about Fender like. Thread up to 19 pages now. What can you spend 19 pages talking about? Bloke plays gig at home town stadium. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordJake Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 Kinda wish he’d booked the sol and went full Bowie, “Good evening Newcastle” Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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