Dokko Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 3 minutes ago, The Prophet said: It's a forum, you can say what you like. The "you can't say anything negative" line is bad faith debate and a complete load of tosh. A higher league position makes signing transformative players a lot easier, but it doesn't rule them out completely (as suggested by the original post). We all want to finish as high up the league we can and reep the benefits it'll bring. You're allowed your opinion, it's fine, but don't confuse realism for negativity, then mask your take as bad faith by someone else. There's a word for that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzza Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 As Phillips hasn´t played for city hardly, we can only base our opinions on his play at Leeds and for England. At Leeds he was the best player in that Bielsa team and was much more than a defensive midfielder, he was much more box to box and reminded me (don´t laugh) of a roy keane type player when he was on form. For england he was asked to alternate with Rice and to be honest they were both as good as each other in a more "defensive" set up. He would be a great signing and would improve our midfield, would also be the perfect 6 in my eyes as he has good technical ability as well as brawn. Bruno could play right as an 8 and Big Joe or little joe left. At 28 he is in his prime! 3-4 years more at least. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 Not really sure what the point of anyone owning a football club now the authorities have rigged the game so much, they've got their Harlem globetrotters outcome for the top teams. The rest are just there to make them look good, and if any upstart dares to challenge the establishment, they'll shut them down as quickly as possible. With FFP rigging the game off the pitch and VAR clearly rigging it on, they now have what they always wanted, match fixing in plain sight, with no one with any power to challenge them. Unless FFP and VAR are challenged in court then we as a club will never stand a chance, those in even less a position than us even more so. The rest of the clubs should band together, start fighting back against them, instead of laughing at each other when we've been had (guilty here, laughed at Everton and the -10) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 9 minutes ago, Dokko said: You're allowed your opinion, it's fine, but don't confuse realism for negativity, then mask your take as bad faith by someone else. There's a word for that. No one called out realism for negativity, the post said we would struggle for transformative signings if we don’t get Europe and have a poor end to the season. However the counter argument for that is our two best transfer windows under these owners came when we where in the relegation zone, and then the following summer when not in Europe. Fair argument surely ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
1964 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 2 minutes ago, Dokko said: Not really sure what the point of anyone owning a football club now the authorities have rigged the game so much, they've got their Harlem globetrotters outcome for the top teams. The rest are just there to make them look good, and if any upstart dares to challenge the establishment, they'll shut them down as quickly as possible. With FFP rigging the game off the pitch and VAR clearly rigging it on, they now have what they always wanted, match fixing in plain sight, with no one with any power to challenge them. Unless FFP and VAR are challenged in court then we as a club will never stand a chance, those in even less a position than us even more so. The rest of the clubs should band together, start fighting back against them, instead of laughing at each other when we've been had (guilty here, laughed at Everton and the -10) Yeah, the notion that FFP is about fairness is a joke. It's about making sure the clubs at the top earning more money are the ones that can spend the most and maintain status quo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jigen Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 You have two big problems: injuries and a bad summer transfer window. You wasted a big sum of money and the team is not better than last year. I don't know because you stop to buy abroad (Bruno, Botman, Isak... All great players at fair prices) and start to buy in the inflated internal market. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 1 minute ago, jigen said: You have two big problems: injuries and a bad summer transfer window. You wasted a big sum of money and the team is not better than last year. I don't know because you stop to buy abroad (Bruno, Botman, Isak... All great players at fair prices) and start to buy in the inflated internal market. Tonali ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverThere Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 Phillips on loan, Minteh recalled. Anything else would be a bonus. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzza Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 Barnes and tonali; both bad luck and unforeseen that it would unfold like it has. As Lewis Hall is a loan to buy, he should be playing more so that we can see if it is worth it. My own opinion is that it is too much money for an untested youngster. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 If we did agree to 40 million obligation for Phillips, that would be 75 million of the summer budget gone already. That may well be in their thinking. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orphanage Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 Just now, SUPERTOON said: If we did agree to 40 million obligation for Phillips, that would be 75 million of the summer budget gone already. That may well be in their thinking. Get him , sell Longstaff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikon Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 Just now, SUPERTOON said: If we did agree to 40 million obligation for Phillips, that would be 75 million of the summer budget gone already. That may well be in their thinking. I don’t think he’s the route we should go. I’m not totally against it but prefer us to not sign him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEFAFWISP Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 2 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said: Tonali ? Should probably stick to Brexit ball after that transfer tbf. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jigen Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 Phillips is average and is another waste of money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Novocastrian Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 8 minutes ago, Dokko said: Not really sure what the point of anyone owning a football club now the authorities have rigged the game so much, they've got their Harlem globetrotters outcome for the top teams. The rest are just there to make them look good, and if any upstart dares to challenge the establishment, they'll shut them down as quickly as possible. With FFP rigging the game off the pitch and VAR clearly rigging it on, they now have what they always wanted, match fixing in plain sight, with no one with any power to challenge them. Unless FFP and VAR are challenged in court then we as a club will never stand a chance, those in even less a position than us even more so. The rest of the clubs should band together, start fighting back against them, instead of laughing at each other when we've been had (guilty here, laughed at Everton and the -10) PIF are the only owners who can conceivably challenge the status quo. They’ll spend up to FFP every season whilst gradually raising the ceiling with improved commercial contacts and increased revenue. It’s going to take a while to breach the gap though. Definitely frustrating. When Man City first qualified for the CL they became a top 4 fixture, they’ve been in every season since. That’s the type of performance the Liverpool’s et al couldn’t countenance with us. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt1892 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 2 minutes ago, Novocastrian said: PIF are the only owners who can conceivably challenge the status quo. They’ll spend up to FFP every season whilst gradually raising the ceiling with improved commercial contacts and increased revenue. It’s going to take a while to breach the gap though. Definitely frustrating. When Man City first qualified for the CL they became a top 4 fixture, they’ve been in every season since. That’s the type of performance the Liverpool’s et al couldn’t countenance with us. Opposition fans know this too which is why we are so despised by fans of the other sky six teams, apart from Man City. They know clubs are going to have a couple of good seasons here and there (Leicester, Villa, Brighton etc) but they believe that they will fall to what is seen as their natural position of between 7th and 13th in the league, where as they worry that we can permanently break the pack up and they don’t like it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 17 minutes ago, Dokko said: You're allowed your opinion, it's fine, but don't confuse realism for negativity, then mask your take as bad faith by someone else. There's a word for that. Huh? Another poster stated "If we finish mid table I’m not sure transformative moves are really on the table tbf. " I was debating that while I agree it is more difficult to negotiate from a lower league position, we have previously and can make transmative signings. You then came in with the "you can't say anything negative around here" schtick, which is no more true than the first time you posted it. I didn't once say the original poster was being negative or unrealistic, I was just debating the point. Yes, I get overly triggered when it's suggested Howe should be binned or I can see the knives being sharpened, but I'll still happily debate the point. No one's opinion is being cancelled or elevated above another's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shelveys Hair Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 27 minutes ago, TRon said: In that case we are basically writing this season off. Wouldn't be a massive shock tbh, FFP is what it is. Us with a fully fit squad, a few extra additions and no european competition next season would make for a pretty interesting year. Then I think next time around we'd be better equipped for europe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee_Johnny Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 22 minutes ago, buzza said: As Phillips hasn´t played for city hardly, we can only base our opinions on his play at Leeds and for England. At Leeds he was the best player in that Bielsa team and was much more than a defensive midfielder, he was much more box to box and reminded me (don´t laugh) of a roy keane type player when he was on form. For england he was asked to alternate with Rice and to be honest they were both as good as each other in a more "defensive" set up. He would be a great signing and would improve our midfield, would also be the perfect 6 in my eyes as he has good technical ability as well as brawn. Bruno could play right as an 8 and Big Joe or little joe left. At 28 he is in his prime! 3-4 years more at least. Recall him being a great long passer too. Would be fab to add this to the Schar and Tripps defence cutting cross field balls. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orphanage Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 2 minutes ago, Coffee_Johnny said: Recall him being a great long passer too. Would be fab to add this to the Schar and Tripps defence cutting cross field balls. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmesy Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 49 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said: I think these Saudi loans are complete fantasy. Would the league have gone to the trouble of having all teams vote on whether or not it was ok, if there was nothing in it?? Just playing devil’s advocate. Seems like a lot of trouble for something with no reasonable basis Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Away Toon Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 17 minutes ago, jigen said: Phillips is average and is another waste of money. Definitely not average and who knows whether or not the money would be well spent. Tonali is currently a waste of money. Virtually every successful team in the world plays with a defensive midfielder apart from this version of an unsuccessful NUFC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCormick Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 1 hour ago, Holmesy said: I think we're probably allowing the Philips rumour to act as a smokescreen while we work on other deals. Philips as a player makes sense to us but his profile and price tag don't, and I don't see the board sanctioning the £40m purchase of a player we might get 2-3 decent seasons out of. I just can't see us deviating from our transfer blueprint to that extent. I'd like to see him here and it's not my money so i don't really care about that, but it would feel very out of character. Do teams ever have smokescreens? Seems like a well-worn transfer window trope that I doubt ever happens. Sorry to be a dick as the rest of your post I do agree with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahoneys Tache Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 17 minutes ago, Away Toon said: Definitely not average and who knows whether or not the money would be well spent. Tonali is currently a waste of money. Virtually every successful team in the world plays with a defensive midfielder apart from this version of an unsuccessful NUFC. There’s a difference between average and unspectacular. Didier Deschamps and Dunga both spring to mind. Neither of them were Puskas or Eusebio but both brilliant at their job. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmesy Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 13 minutes ago, McCormick said: Do teams ever have smokescreens? Seems like a well-worn transfer window trope that I doubt ever happens. Sorry to be a dick as the rest of your post I do agree with. God knows! I suppose what i mean by smokescreen is not us releasing the rumour, but us not denying the rumour when it does surface. It doesn't do us any harm at all if other clubs, whose players we might be interested in, think we're considering other high profile options as well Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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