St James' Park

[RS]

Going to be grim as fuck in a half filled flat pack stadium in an industrial estate in camperdown. At least the plastics will

have a new stadium though. 

[JonBez comesock]

10 minutes ago, RS said:

Going to be grim as fuck in a half filled flat pack stadium in an industrial estate in camperdown. At least the plastics will

have a new stadium though. 

That’s the spirit 👌🏻

 

Maybe we get a brand new stadium very close by and its absolutely fantastic , atmosphere improves and we start to win things ? 

[ramirez]

10 hours ago, Wallsendmag said:

 

Tbf Boro sold out every single game for the first few years at the Riverside and they ended up expanding it.

yeah but thats probably due to not bumping up prices like you said, as well as initial relative success if I recall

[Elliottman]

32 minutes ago, RS said:

Going to be grim as fuck in a half filled flat pack stadium in an industrial estate in camperdown. At least the plastics will

have a new stadium though. 

Cry more. 

[Whitley mag]

Much prefer Camperdown to the racecourse as slightly closer for me selfishly.

 

If where heading down this way though just build it on the Links.

[JonBez comesock]

New Capacity (if we do move) has to be 

 

68,387

 

if you know , You know 

[RS]

9 minutes ago, Elliottman said:

Cry more. 

Great name for the new stadium!

[Wallsendmag]

Camperdown would be perfect. I work 5 mins walk away from Camperdown Industrial estate so could finish work at 12 on a Saturday, walk over to Burradon for a few pints then to the match.

[Kid Icarus]

No one who's making the 'more fans should get the chance to go to matches' while also making the 'we need this for PSR' not see how those two things might be at odds with each other?

 

ie fans will have 'access' but many of those who were shut out will now be priced out instead.

[r0cafella]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

No one who's making the 'more fans should get the chance to go to matches' while also making the 'we need this for PSR' not see how those two things might be at odds with each other?

 

ie fans will have 'access' but many of those who were shut out will now be priced out instead.

No, they aren't at odds at all. It seems your post is based upon the notion prices won't increase to that point at SJP Especially as demand is so high and tickets are so limited. If anything prices should rocket at SJP due to this fact. 

[Nucasol]

6 minutes ago, JonBez comesock said:

New Capacity (if we do move) has to be 

 

68,387

 

if you know , You know 

Going full Bob Murray myself - 75,119 and above plz

[TheBrownBottle]

8 hours ago, Heron said:

I am sure there things that can be done to the existing stadium to allow for thing such as concerts tk eb more accessible. I am already aware of some the issues following work on previous concerts.

I really don’t think that they can.  Expanding the Gallowgate is likely borderline impossible from a constructability perspective; and the East Stand’s footprint would not be changed with a rebuild.  If we stay at SJP we can look to enjoy midtable forever.  

[TheBrownBottle]

21 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

No one who's making the 'more fans should get the chance to go to matches' while also making the 'we need this for PSR' not see how those two things might be at odds with each other?

 

ie fans will have 'access' but many of those who were shut out will now be priced out instead.

They aren’t at odds - vastly expanded corporate takes care of PSR - a bigger stadium makes more cheap seats possible. 

[TheBrownBottle]

1 hour ago, RS said:

Going to be grim as fuck in a half filled flat pack stadium in an industrial estate in camperdown. At least the plastics will

have a new stadium though. 

I remember these comments back in ‘90s as well, when we went from 16k average to 33k average in a couple of years, with the new SJP driving that.  And the same again in 2000.

 

The ‘plastics’ / ‘glory seekers’ stuff has been around for decades, and it’s as big a load of bollocks now as it was then.  

[r0cafella]

32 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

I remember these comments back in ‘90s as well, when we went from 16k average to 33k average in a couple of years, with the new SJP driving that.  And the same again in 2000.

 

The ‘plastics’ / ‘glory seekers’ stuff has been around for decades, and it’s as big a load of bollocks now as it was then.  

Its a proper grim narrative, us and glory seeking are mutually exclusive at this stage

 

 

Edited November 22, 2024 by r0cafella

[Wallsendmag]

I just find the whole narrative that ticket prices will suddenly rocket very bizarre. There's been loads of new build stadiums built in the last 25 years or so and to my knowledge there's only 2 clubs (Arsenal and Spurs) who have hiked up prices. Not a single club outside of London has gone down that route.

 

The other argument is atmosphere. That's another strange one as the atmosphere at SJP isn't exactly great now and we don't even have a proper "home" end. That could change if we could start from scratch.

 

Fact is SJP is far too small and becoming more outdated by the season. Provided we can keep a pretty central location (Leazes Park/Castle Leazes) I can't think of any good reason not to press ahead with a brand new 70k+ state of the art stadium.

[TBG]

[Stifler]

27 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

I remember these comments back in ‘90s as well, when we went from 16k average to 33k average in a couple of years, with the new SJP driving that.  And the same again in 2000.

 

The ‘plastics’ / ‘glory seekers’ stuff has been around for decades, and it’s as big a load of bollocks now as it was then.  

Aye, I was looking at our average attendances recently, and I think there is only 2 seasons in our history where we are below the average attendance for the league we were playing in. I also think that was at the height of hooligan problem. All the other seasons we were above average. It’s not bad considering the ownerships we have had in the past, and aside from brief spells in the 50’s and 20’s, we’ve not been a successful team.

You can only go back so far until you start hitting cut numbers in attendances due to cash going straight into people’s pockets, fans sneaking in without paying, and people on the turnstiles just letting in their friends. I know this applies to all clubs as well, and it means the average would also go up, but it just goes to show that demand largely has always been there.

 

SJP increasing in capacity to 52k just changed things to another level. The fact is, Newcastle is, and always has been a football city.

[gjohnson]

A move is the only thing that makes sense.

If we stuck to things purely for history's sake we'd still be in caves rubbing sticks together to make fire.

 

Yes it would be a shame to lose the individuality, but to be fair...and I think this applies to most that haven't had the fortune of seeing a real trophy...St James has generally been a park of misery and disappointment. 

 

There been good times, can't argue with that but I doubt many Man City fans are now crying over moving from Maine Road

 

 

 

[Kid Icarus]

34 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

No, they aren't at odds at all. It seems your post is based upon the notion prices won't increase to that point at SJP Especially as demand is so high and tickets are so limited. If anything prices should rocket at SJP due to this fact. 

 

Before getting onto anything else, it's based on the notion that if your argument is both 'we need a new stadium in order to maximise PSR' (an argument with a lot of flaws in it anyway) and 'we need a new stadium to stop people being locked out' then - based on the evidence of how other clubs have done it - at some point maximising PSR via match tickets will be at odds with unlocking those doors.

 

Mainly though it's a notion just based on the evidence.

 

Ticket prices - including the cheapest tickets - have gone up in price with stadium moves at clubs that have moved. The percentage of cheap seats that are available has also decreased with the exception of West Ham.

 

Our prices have gone up across the board, not just with tickets - Matchday, VIP, merch - and the club has changed the system which seems to have been to the benefit of tourist fans willing to spend more via agents.

 

Re demand and prices sky rocketing,  it's not necessarily about prices rocketing it's about them going up enough that they price people out. Obviously ticket prices at SJP don't rise and fall based on a natural economic system, they're still controlled by the club and you can point to a number of reasons why they haven't massively gone up - price freezes, bad PR, that matchday is negligible in terms of PSR etc.

 

But that leads on to another point -  the club won't want to build a stadium that gives access to all anyway - a bit like having a reserve work force that keeps wages low, they'll want a reserve set of fans who are still locked out and want to get in, in order to keep ticket prices high. 

[r0cafella]

1 minute ago, Kid Icarus said:

 

Before getting onto anything else, it's based on the notion that if your argument is both 'we need a new stadium in order to maximise PSR' (an argument with a lot of flaws in it anyway) and 'we need a new stadium to stop people being locked out' then - based on the evidence of how other clubs have done it - at some point maximising PSR via match tickets will be at odds with unlocking those doors.

 

Mainly though it's a notion just based on the evidence.

 

Ticket prices - including the cheapest tickets - have gone up in price with stadium moves at clubs that have moved. The percentage of cheap seats that are available has also decreased with the exception of West Ham.

 

Our prices have gone up across the board, not just with tickets - Matchday, VIP, merch - and the club has changed the system which seems to have been to the benefit of tourist fans willing to spend more via agents.

 

Re demand and prices sky rocketing,  it's not necessarily about prices rocketing it's about them going up enough that they price people out. Obviously ticket prices at SJP don't rise and fall based on a natural economic system, they're still controlled by the club and you can point to a number of reasons why they haven't massively gone up - price freezes, bad PR, that matchday is negligible in terms of PSR etc.

 

But that leads on to another point -  the club won't want to build a stadium that gives access to all anyway - a bit like having a reserve work force that keeps wages low, they'll want a reserve set of fans who are still locked out and want to get in, in order to keep ticket prices high. 

As I've stated previously prices are going up regardless of weather we move or not. This is the trend both in football but in the wider entertainment industry. It's a given at this point. 

 

It's obvious at this point if we wish to compete we have to increase our revenue and a new stadium is the platform in which to do this. 

 

Maybe my brain power is used for the day but I'm not sure what other point your making here. 

[Kid Icarus]

2 hours ago, r0cafella said:

Its a proper grim narrative, us and glory seeking and mutually exclusive at this stage

 

I think it's fairly reasonable considering a decent chunk of the posts most vocally in favour of a stadium come from people who don't live in the UK, let alone Newcastle, and will get to visit it at best once or twice a season. There's probably a nicer way of saying it though, admittedly. 

 

 

Edited November 22, 2024 by Kid Icarus

[r0cafella]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

 

I think it's a fairly reasonable considering a decent chunk of the posts most vocally in favour of a stadium come from people who don't live in the UK, let alone Newcastle, and will get to visit it at best once or twice a season. There's probably a nicer way of saying it though, admittedly. 

So because people aren't from or living in the area they are second class fans who aren't worthy of opinion ? Or opinions which count for less?

[STM]

I wish one club would have the balls to be the first to completely slash ticket prices. With hundreds of millions in revenue, it would be such an easy win for any owner, especially ones with deep pockets.

 

It's ironic that another casualty of PSR is that it means clubs won't reduce ticket prices because it hurts their revenue and their ability to compete, even if it's just a slither of their overall revenue.

[Kid Icarus]

1 minute ago, r0cafella said:

So because people aren't from or living in the area they are second class fans who aren't worthy of opinion ? Or opinions which count for less?

 

If we're talking about regularly attending matches, then not in those words but in terms of weight of opinion, yes. Sorry if that ruffles feathers, but I don't think there's anything controversial about saying that fans who are already or plan to attend matches every other week (regardless of location) should have more of a say than those who don't and don't plan to beyond once a year. I don't want us to become a tourist club, sorry.