J7

actually you don't, you give one fact repeated ad nauseam - the rest is your opinion tarted up as fact through the smoke and mirror act of condescension between yourself & JJ7 there were facts and opinions, i'll enlighten you: FS was a big part [fnar] of the European qualifications (facts) but he also ran out of ideas (strong conjecture/opinion) and the club was nearly bankrupt/in a dire financial situation (fact) what's so hard about it for you? you quote the Euro qualifications and JJ7 says: "Yep, then he lost the plot, made too many mistakes and nearly bankrupted the club" he's not contradicting you, you can surely understand that? he's referring to 2 different points in time man then you reply and tell him to repost his rubbish in 5 years!!! you remind me of billy pilgrim dude, totally shot to f*** through all the time travelling you've done so you can't work out simple linear facts and events anymore Good points. Im not biting here, honestly as its just a general point, but there are very few people in business or politics or whatever who are always good. Most people usually start to fail and make mistakes in the end. Look at Hitler who performed miricles at the start, Thatcher, Brooks Mileson, Peter Ridsdale, Doug Ellis etc..... Even if Freddy had won us the league for three seasons between 1997 and 2000, you can't just stick with them when they continue to make mistake after mistake. absolutely agree, and it's a balance thing we'd tipped the scales under FS, and as a PLC in my opinion, but we got very unlucky with who bought us out - as has been said countless times the ashley period being an abject failure to date does not validate the later years of FS & the PLC at the end of the day, it depends how you look at it. Football is a risky business. A lot of people say - and not just on here - that if you aren't in europe, you are s***. Construed : what they mean is they have known nothing less than regularly playing in europe, so don't listen to people like me who try to tell them that such things aren't automatic and only the good clubs with good boards qualify regularly for europe. You hit the nail slightly on the head when you say we were "unlucky with who bought us out"........having seen the club when we were REALLY s**** [far more than the supposed "s****" of the recent past, until now since Ashley came in] I see it differently, I see the vast majority of the clubs in the top 2 leagues as being s****, and I say we "got lucky" when we had good directors. It might be quite a while until we "get lucky" again ....... and a lot of people will be sitting around in 10 years time and looking back at the Halls and Shepherd and realise it, but I obviously hope not bearing in mind my age. This is all I've said from day 1 by the way. At least some people - since ashley - have begun to understand. wrongish, it also depends on why you look at it in a certain way. for example why are you determined,against all reason, to try and make out that we weren't in the s*** at the end of fred's reign despite all the evidence saying we were ? why are you and others like you, against all reason, determined to try and make out that the Halls and Shepherd weren't the best owners we have had at the club for 50 years and it will very difficult to replace them with better ? And - accept that Mike ashley is taking the club downwards, among the also rans, like the vast majority of other football club owners instead of trying to get among the other top clubs which is where we should be and where we spent our time under the Halls and Shepherd. People do accept that Mike Ashley is taking the club downwards. However, why do you not accept that when the Halls and Shepherd sold the club to Ashley we were already started on the journey downwards. We may have had years and years competing with the top clubs but the bubble had already burst when Ashley bought us, and this was after others had looked at the books and walked away laughing at the financial mess we were in. because they ticked the 2 biggest boxes. They had the ambition to succeed, and they backed their appointed managers That is how we qualfied for europe more than any club bar 4 during their time running the club. I hope you enjoyed it, because we might have s*** directors for years, or decades, before we get good ones again. Same old hyperbole. So you must have missed the grumblings of fans who were not satisfied at the s*** that we were turning out week in week out. Were you at the Sheffield United game for instance? Of course I enjoyed the european games, that goes without saying. But that does not excuse Hall and Shepherd from starting us down the road that we are now on. Things had already turned sour before Mike Ashley came along. He has failed to turn that around and that should not be forgotten either, but you cannot say that Hall and Shepherd are blameless in this. football, like life, is all ups and downs. Fortunately, we had a board who delivered more ups than most clubs will ever see. Because they ticked the most important boxes, unlike 80-90% of clubs and their own predecessors and their first successor too, it will be very difficult to find better. Could take decades in fact. Shame they were so s*** it takes so long to find someone better isn't it ? Of course football is about ups and downs, but no decent chairman should let the downs lead a club towards nearly being bankrupt. Leeds had massive ups under Ridsdale, but look at them now because of what happened back then. Theres ambition, then theres stupidity. I agree that Shepherds ambition was great when we were qualifying for the Champions League under Robson. But Shepherd was stupid in the timing of his sacking of Robson, then his next 2 appointments. A chairmans main job is to pick a manager, and he failed not once, but TWICE in a row. Throwing money at a s**** manager, who is unlikely to get you a return on your investment (i.e. by qualifying for the Champions League) is pure stupidity. NE5, you look at things too simplistically and ignore what others are saying. You're either on the wind up, or you just love an arguement and don't actually believe what you're saying. It was pretty clear Shepherd wanted to cut down on the borrowing by the appointment of Allardyce, and this bankruptcy talk is all speculation - it didnt happen so how can you presume it was going to happen. Shepherd could clearly hold back on spending and be prudent ie: summer of Bowyer and Woodgate sale, yet the ironic thing is we didn't spend in that summer and Shepherd got criticized beyond belief for lack of ambition. When really he was being cautious as we weren't guaranteed Champions League football that year. Yet now in hindsight have forum members saying 'spent too much!', 'out of control!', 'ridsdale!'. It's all a bit ridiculous. Its not really ridiculous. Even if we accept that we weren't going bankrupt and Shepherd was tightening the purse strings, then I still consider it bad management giving Robson next to nothing to spend one summer, then overloading Souness with cash another summer. He appointed two terrible managers then gambled at the wrong time. Had he have appointed someone good and not Souness, his gamble may have paid off. It was terrible management to appoint Souness then Roeder though.

actually you don't, you give one fact repeated ad nauseam - the rest is your opinion tarted up as fact through the smoke and mirror act of condescension between yourself & JJ7 there were facts and opinions, i'll enlighten you: FS was a big part [fnar] of the European qualifications (facts) but he also ran out of ideas (strong conjecture/opinion) and the club was nearly bankrupt/in a dire financial situation (fact) what's so hard about it for you? you quote the Euro qualifications and JJ7 says: "Yep, then he lost the plot, made too many mistakes and nearly bankrupted the club" he's not contradicting you, you can surely understand that? he's referring to 2 different points in time man then you reply and tell him to repost his rubbish in 5 years!!! you remind me of billy pilgrim dude, totally shot to f*** through all the time travelling you've done so you can't work out simple linear facts and events anymore Good points. Im not biting here, honestly as its just a general point, but there are very few people in business or politics or whatever who are always good. Most people usually start to fail and make mistakes in the end. Look at Hitler who performed miricles at the start, Thatcher, Brooks Mileson, Peter Ridsdale, Doug Ellis etc..... Even if Freddy had won us the league for three seasons between 1997 and 2000, you can't just stick with them when they continue to make mistake after mistake. absolutely agree, and it's a balance thing we'd tipped the scales under FS, and as a PLC in my opinion, but we got very unlucky with who bought us out - as has been said countless times the ashley period being an abject failure to date does not validate the later years of FS & the PLC at the end of the day, it depends how you look at it. Football is a risky business. A lot of people say - and not just on here - that if you aren't in europe, you are s***. Construed : what they mean is they have known nothing less than regularly playing in europe, so don't listen to people like me who try to tell them that such things aren't automatic and only the good clubs with good boards qualify regularly for europe. You hit the nail slightly on the head when you say we were "unlucky with who bought us out"........having seen the club when we were REALLY s**** [far more than the supposed "s****" of the recent past, until now since Ashley came in] I see it differently, I see the vast majority of the clubs in the top 2 leagues as being s****, and I say we "got lucky" when we had good directors. It might be quite a while until we "get lucky" again ....... and a lot of people will be sitting around in 10 years time and looking back at the Halls and Shepherd and realise it, but I obviously hope not bearing in mind my age. This is all I've said from day 1 by the way. At least some people - since ashley - have begun to understand. wrongish, it also depends on why you look at it in a certain way. for example why are you determined,against all reason, to try and make out that we weren't in the s*** at the end of fred's reign despite all the evidence saying we were ? why are you and others like you, against all reason, determined to try and make out that the Halls and Shepherd weren't the best owners we have had at the club for 50 years and it will very difficult to replace them with better ? And - accept that Mike ashley is taking the club downwards, among the also rans, like the vast majority of other football club owners instead of trying to get among the other top clubs which is where we should be and where we spent our time under the Halls and Shepherd. People do accept that Mike Ashley is taking the club downwards. However, why do you not accept that when the Halls and Shepherd sold the club to Ashley we were already started on the journey downwards. We may have had years and years competing with the top clubs but the bubble had already burst when Ashley bought us, and this was after others had looked at the books and walked away laughing at the financial mess we were in. because they ticked the 2 biggest boxes. They had the ambition to succeed, and they backed their appointed managers That is how we qualfied for europe more than any club bar 4 during their time running the club. I hope you enjoyed it, because we might have s*** directors for years, or decades, before we get good ones again. Same old hyperbole. So you must have missed the grumblings of fans who were not satisfied at the s*** that we were turning out week in week out. Were you at the Sheffield United game for instance? Of course I enjoyed the european games, that goes without saying. But that does not excuse Hall and Shepherd from starting us down the road that we are now on. Things had already turned sour before Mike Ashley came along. He has failed to turn that around and that should not be forgotten either, but you cannot say that Hall and Shepherd are blameless in this. football, like life, is all ups and downs. Fortunately, we had a board who delivered more ups than most clubs will ever see. Because they ticked the most important boxes, unlike 80-90% of clubs and their own predecessors and their first successor too, it will be very difficult to find better. Could take decades in fact. Shame they were so s*** it takes so long to find someone better isn't it ? Of course football is about ups and downs, but no decent chairman should let the downs lead a club towards nearly being bankrupt. Leeds had massive ups under Ridsdale, but look at them now because of what happened back then. Theres ambition, then theres stupidity. I agree that Shepherds ambition was great when we were qualifying for the Champions League under Robson. But Shepherd was stupid in the timing of his sacking of Robson, then his next 2 appointments. A chairmans main job is to pick a manager, and he failed not once, but TWICE in a row. Throwing money at a s**** manager, who is unlikely to get you a return on your investment (i.e. by qualifying for the Champions League) is pure stupidity. NE5, you look at things too simplistically and ignore what others are saying. You're either on the wind up, or you just love an arguement and don't actually believe what you're saying. I believe what I'm saying alright. I always have, and whats more, all the things I have said in the past which I got flak for, are all vindicated because they turned out to be right. Just to clarify, do you think appointing Souness and giving him £50 million to spend was the right thing to do? Can you not see that appointing Souness was unambitious, where as giving him £50 million was very ambitious? These things don't match as Souness was never going to take us to the Champions League. The Champions League is where we would need to be if we were to see a return in the investment. Its bad management.

actually you don't, you give one fact repeated ad nauseam - the rest is your opinion tarted up as fact through the smoke and mirror act of condescension between yourself & JJ7 there were facts and opinions, i'll enlighten you: FS was a big part [fnar] of the European qualifications (facts) but he also ran out of ideas (strong conjecture/opinion) and the club was nearly bankrupt/in a dire financial situation (fact) what's so hard about it for you? you quote the Euro qualifications and JJ7 says: "Yep, then he lost the plot, made too many mistakes and nearly bankrupted the club" he's not contradicting you, you can surely understand that? he's referring to 2 different points in time man then you reply and tell him to repost his rubbish in 5 years!!! you remind me of billy pilgrim dude, totally shot to f*** through all the time travelling you've done so you can't work out simple linear facts and events anymore Good points. Im not biting here, honestly as its just a general point, but there are very few people in business or politics or whatever who are always good. Most people usually start to fail and make mistakes in the end. Look at Hitler who performed miricles at the start, Thatcher, Brooks Mileson, Peter Ridsdale, Doug Ellis etc..... Even if Freddy had won us the league for three seasons between 1997 and 2000, you can't just stick with them when they continue to make mistake after mistake. absolutely agree, and it's a balance thing we'd tipped the scales under FS, and as a PLC in my opinion, but we got very unlucky with who bought us out - as has been said countless times the ashley period being an abject failure to date does not validate the later years of FS & the PLC at the end of the day, it depends how you look at it. Football is a risky business. A lot of people say - and not just on here - that if you aren't in europe, you are s***. Construed : what they mean is they have known nothing less than regularly playing in europe, so don't listen to people like me who try to tell them that such things aren't automatic and only the good clubs with good boards qualify regularly for europe. You hit the nail slightly on the head when you say we were "unlucky with who bought us out"........having seen the club when we were REALLY s**** [far more than the supposed "s****" of the recent past, until now since Ashley came in] I see it differently, I see the vast majority of the clubs in the top 2 leagues as being s****, and I say we "got lucky" when we had good directors. It might be quite a while until we "get lucky" again ....... and a lot of people will be sitting around in 10 years time and looking back at the Halls and Shepherd and realise it, but I obviously hope not bearing in mind my age. This is all I've said from day 1 by the way. At least some people - since ashley - have begun to understand. wrongish, it also depends on why you look at it in a certain way. for example why are you determined,against all reason, to try and make out that we weren't in the s*** at the end of fred's reign despite all the evidence saying we were ? why are you and others like you, against all reason, determined to try and make out that the Halls and Shepherd weren't the best owners we have had at the club for 50 years and it will very difficult to replace them with better ? And - accept that Mike ashley is taking the club downwards, among the also rans, like the vast majority of other football club owners instead of trying to get among the other top clubs which is where we should be and where we spent our time under the Halls and Shepherd. People do accept that Mike Ashley is taking the club downwards. However, why do you not accept that when the Halls and Shepherd sold the club to Ashley we were already started on the journey downwards. We may have had years and years competing with the top clubs but the bubble had already burst when Ashley bought us, and this was after others had looked at the books and walked away laughing at the financial mess we were in. because they ticked the 2 biggest boxes. They had the ambition to succeed, and they backed their appointed managers That is how we qualfied for europe more than any club bar 4 during their time running the club. I hope you enjoyed it, because we might have s*** directors for years, or decades, before we get good ones again. Same old hyperbole. So you must have missed the grumblings of fans who were not satisfied at the s*** that we were turning out week in week out. Were you at the Sheffield United game for instance? Of course I enjoyed the european games, that goes without saying. But that does not excuse Hall and Shepherd from starting us down the road that we are now on. Things had already turned sour before Mike Ashley came along. He has failed to turn that around and that should not be forgotten either, but you cannot say that Hall and Shepherd are blameless in this. football, like life, is all ups and downs. Fortunately, we had a board who delivered more ups than most clubs will ever see. Because they ticked the most important boxes, unlike 80-90% of clubs and their own predecessors and their first successor too, it will be very difficult to find better. Could take decades in fact. Shame they were so s*** it takes so long to find someone better isn't it ? Of course football is about ups and downs, but no decent chairman should let the downs lead a club towards nearly being bankrupt. Leeds had massive ups under Ridsdale, but look at them now because of what happened back then. Theres ambition, then theres stupidity. I agree that Shepherds ambition was great when we were qualifying for the Champions League under Robson. But Shepherd was stupid in the timing of his sacking of Robson, then his next 2 appointments. A chairmans main job is to pick a manager, and he failed not once, but TWICE in a row. Throwing money at a shite manager, who is unlikely to get you a return on your investment (i.e. by qualifying for the Champions League) is pure stupidity. NE5, you look at things too simplistically and ignore what others are saying. You're either on the wind up, or you just love an arguement and don't actually believe what you're saying.

We need another 10 points in my opinion, however that depends on Hull who I think is the team we are most likely to catch. If the mackems beat them tomorrow they look hopeless. They still have Man Utd, and Liverpool and Stoke at home, with Mackems, Villa and Bolton away. I think they will get 3-5 points out of that at most. A win against Stoke and a point in one or two of their away games if they're lucky.

Where you born in Nigeria? How come you can't pinpoint your birth date? I can. Just trying to help people born between those dates to save them looking it up.

Anyone born like me, between 18/02/1983 - 23/12/1983, the answer would be Michael Chopra.

actually you don't, you give one fact repeated ad nauseam - the rest is your opinion tarted up as fact through the smoke and mirror act of condescension between yourself & JJ7 there were facts and opinions, i'll enlighten you: FS was a big part [fnar] of the European qualifications (facts) but he also ran out of ideas (strong conjecture/opinion) and the club was nearly bankrupt/in a dire financial situation (fact) what's so hard about it for you? you quote the Euro qualifications and JJ7 says: "Yep, then he lost the plot, made too many mistakes and nearly bankrupted the club" he's not contradicting you, you can surely understand that? he's referring to 2 different points in time man then you reply and tell him to repost his rubbish in 5 years!!! you remind me of billy pilgrim dude, totally shot to f*** through all the time travelling you've done so you can't work out simple linear facts and events anymore Good points. Im not biting here, honestly as its just a general point, but there are very few people in business or politics or whatever who are always good. Most people usually start to fail and make mistakes in the end. Look at Hitler who performed miricles at the start, Thatcher, Brooks Mileson, Peter Ridsdale, Doug Ellis etc..... Even if Freddy had won us the league for three seasons between 1997 and 2000, you can't just stick with them when they continue to make mistake after mistake.

Michael Chopra. I was at his debut and remember thinking that he was our first player younger than me.

yeah, not having a go, but some short-sighted views by that spokesman True. Didn't think it was the place to say that stuff.

Sorry. aye, repost that rubbish in 5 years time........hopefully we may have matched what they did, but would you bet on it ? Im not falling for your wind up a second time!

Sorry.

Shepherd was s***, and Ashley IS s***. That about sums it up. more european and Champs League qualifications than any club bar 4 says differently. We might go through 3 or 4 owners yet before that happens again. Still, I'm sure you know best Yep, then he lost the plot, made too many mistakes and nearly bankrupted the club.

Shepherd was shit, and Ashley IS shit. That about sums it up.

Pearce was very solid and still good enough. Can't remember who it was against but I remember him scoring a pen for us in a shootout and giving the keeper the wanker sign after it.

Alan Smith looks after himself, doesnt drink and seems to show an interest in whats going on around him. He's a good guy with a brilliant attitude. Its ashame he's shit, but I respect him and his attitude as much as anyone at our club.

You are going to cop it now for criticizing Shepherd. Oops!

Am I the only person who thinks this could be vital in our survival chances? He adds so much to our midfield when he plays and could be the drive in midfield we so badly need. A Newcastle team with Barton in is far stronger than one without him. I can still remember Sunderland away when both him and Jonas came on and totally changed our performance. It was too little too late in that game but the mackems were shitting themselves. Excluding the first 3 games, the best weve looked as a team all season was when Barton was playing against Villa. If he hits the ground running and can stay injury free for the final games, I believe his impact will be vitally important.

I would pinpoint Partizan as well. I also think Bobby started to lose the plot a bit during that season. Selling Solano was a massive mistake, and although we finished as high as 5th, in that season it was a low points total for that position. Liverpool were poor that season also and it seemed like we were both creeping over the line. I actually thought Bobby should have been moved upstairs at that point, around the same time Liverpool got rid of Houllier and appointed Benitez. We were still an attractive club for any manager at that time. Im sure Bobby would have moved upstairs and helped to find a successer and we would have had time to appoint someone good as we wouldn't have been short on applicants. The people in charge of Liverpool at the time however were more ambitious and clever that Shepherd. At that point, there was no reason to suggest that Liverpool would go on and become any better than us. We were about on par at the time. They made a good decision, and we didn't make one. When we eventually did sack Bobby in a disgraceful fashion it was terrible timing. We looked a joke because of it. The dressing room wasn't what it was, and Shepherd decided to bring in Souness, seemly for the sole reason of sorting out the dressing room. The only factor Shepherd could have taken into account looking at it. Whats sad is that since then there have been so many tipping moments where we could have gone either way. We could have corrected our mistakes and made the right decision to move forward so many times, but through Shepherd and now Ashley we continue to make bad decision after bad decision and we are where we are now. Every single managerial appointment since Robson has been a bad one. When weve had cash to spend, weve given it to the wrong person. I seriously believe if we had tossed a coin every time an important decision had to be made, we would be in a better position now than we are as a club.

I think the majority of fans have spotted and commented upon every single terrible appointment over the past 6 or 7 years. Its scary the number of terrible decision that have been made flying in the face of common sence.

I personally think 'We'll be coming' is an awful football song.

Who thinks we're doing it right?

Shearer and Dowie spoke well. Very impressed. Obviously less impressed with Llambais who doesnt even have the balls to answer questions from the floor. Says it all.

Not Dowies biggest fan, but I would have taken him above Kinnear as boss. Can't be a bad thing having an ex-Prem manager as number two.

I don't think we can attract anyone of his standard under Ashley. You would have to be an idiot to come here at the moment.

Looks like the brown nosing worked. Well done Peter!