Allardyce simply isn't brave enough and is too obsessed with his platform.

[Parky]

The PL is where you get found out.

 

Not only if your side aren't committed and organised (they weren't) but also for the newcomers Cacapa and Roze. This was the first match a side has really had a proper crack at our center backs albeit a poor side like Derby. It was like watching virgin sailors in a force 9. The CB's were dominated  and rattled time after time...They now know what the PL is all about, if other sides sense a weakness or lack of desire they will get amongst you especially the poorer sides.

 

For all his obsession with a defensive looking midfield and Alan Smith wasted on the right and the purchase of yet another Dm in Faye, the creative and attacking side of our game has withered, in all seriousness teams like Derby will get flattenend by our supposed close rivals ie Spurs, Villa and Everton.

 

SA has set about rebuilding from the back and it was needed yet he let Dyer and Solano go without a creative or winger replacement. Zoggy ranging upfield in desperation at the malaise of sideways passing instigated by Butt and Geremi and in the middle of it all Owen looking like a lost schoolboy.

 

The ball was again too often pumped to Milner without the midfield moving up and supporting the strikers....Martins pushed out wider and wider to get the ball or get space as he was surrounded by 3 def in the middle...None of our midfield pushed on, normally instinctive situations and responses of players strangely lacking...Once they felt the heat Derby were putting out there was strangely no reply, we had no guvnor, no one with authority in the middle, Barton won't bring that either...We seem to have an excess of tacklers who want to give it to another player and quickly...Butt even looked ball shy at some points.

 

We look hard to beat?

 

We'll soon look like we can't win a game.

 

There is something about SA's vision which on the playing side - on the pitch is a bit flat. And all his talk about the backroom staff and new methods will soon be forgotten if he doesn't grow some balls and not hide behind this safety first bullshit.

[BottledDog]

Get away, Allardyce has lambasted Benitez for not understanding the Premiership and you have the gall to have a go at BSA for the same thing. The nerve of it.

[Geordie Boot Boy]

For all his obsession with a defensive looking midfield and Alan Smith wasted on the right and the purchase of yet another Dm in Faye, the creative and attacking side of our game has withered, in all seriousness teams like Derby will get flattenend by our supposed close rivals ie Spurs, Villa and Everton.

 

I see it more as the right wasted on Alan Smith.

[Lenny]

Unfortunately we are going to have to go through these games whilst the players/manager get used to each other. Im not happy about how shite we played yesterday and its quite embarassing to lose to a team thats shipped 10 goals in 2 games but as was said right from the offset patience is needed and we cant be jumping on the players/managers backs as soon as something bad happens because it was inevitable.

 

That being said, Butt is shit...

[Dr. Nguyen Van Falk]

He needs to have the balls to change his foramation and tatics. No doubt in my mind we would of won yesterday if we played 4-4-2 with actual wingers.

[olliemort]

He has totally reshaped the squad,he has to be given more time than the first 6 games before hes judged,losing just one game

[Guest ChickenKiev]

I always said Eriksson was the way to go....Starting to really believe I was right now 

[Guest ChickenKiev]

He has totally reshaped the squad,he has to be given more time than the first 6 games before hes judged,losing just one game

 

That's what people kept saying about bramble for 2 years!

[thomas]

He has totally reshaped the squad,he has to be given more time than the first 6 games before hes judged,losing just one game

 

That's what people kept saying about bramble for 2 years!

You can find any number of examples to support giving or not giving a player or manager time. However, I don't think the final analysis on Bramble was complete in 6 games but a few people are prepared to call it a day on Big Sam? 

[Dr. Nguyen Van Falk]

He needs to have the balls to change his foramation and tatics. No doubt in my mind we would of won yesterday if we played 4-4-2 with actual wingers.

 

We f****** did play 442. Fine, Milner was on the left and Smith was on the right, but we still played 442. How else could allardyce have set up the midfield, bearing in mind Zog had to play left back in the absence  of Enrique.

 

Given

 

Faye

Cacapa

Roz

Taylor

 

Milner

Geremi

Butt

N'zogbia

 

Tbh.

[Dr. Nguyen Van Falk]

 

 

I think we learnt from Roeder that using 4 CBs across the back four doesn't work.

 

It would of done for Derby last night though don't you think? Hell it would of been better than the dross served up yesterday, no doubt about that.

[TRon]

Despite being a big advocate of Allardyce, I find his negative tactics against shit sides worrying. This reminds me of the Dalglish days with too many workhorses, and while one result can be described as a blip, our attacking play and football in general has been poor all season. We should have beat boro and we should have beat Derby, we have had a relatively easy start as well.

 

Errikson has also put together a new team but his players at least look like they are working in tandem.

[Keefaz]

I think he still thinks he's at Bolton. Anyone see his pre-match interviews yesterday on Setanta where he talking about 'beating Newcastle' and 'the win over Newcastle'?

[Bossman]

Last night was shocking, its been a long time since I've been so angry watching a game football.

 

But knee-jerking gets nobody anywhere.

 

Need to see what SA does from here, how he reacts to the performance and how the players react to him.

 

Wouldnt like to be in his 'war room' reviewing this one.  But need to see how the next 3/4 maybe even 5 games go and then make judgment from there.

[Baggio]

Tbf to Rozenhal and Cacapa they won't have to face many as physically dominating in the air as Howard, McBride being the worst. I still think they are Sam's first choice centre back pairing but in hindsight it would have been better to put Taylor or Faye up against him last night.

[Guest DarkSchneider]

He needs to have the balls to change his foramation and tatics. No doubt in my mind we would of won yesterday if we played 4-4-2 with actual wingers.

 

We f****** did play 442. Fine, Milner was on the left and Smith was on the right, but we still played 442. How else could allardyce have set up the midfield, bearing in mind Zog had to play left back in the absence  of Enrique.

 

Given

 

Faye

Cacapa

Roz

Taylor

 

Milner

Geremi

Butt

N'zogbia

 

Tbh.

I think we learnt from Roeder that using 4 CBs across the back four doesn't work.

 

Beye instead of Faye IMO... Is Troisi fit? He could play on the wing as well. Even Martins would do a lot more on the right wing than Smith. After all he played there against Wigan.

 

So if we play 4-4-2, I would go with with players available yesterday.

 

Beye          Taylor Roz/Cacapa  Zog

Milner        Geremi Smith          Martins

                Ameobi Owen 

 

Now that Ameobi has not shown much, I would play Smith there and put Butt in his place.

 

 

[toptoon]

Tbf to Rozenhal and Cacapa they won't have to face many as physically dominating in the air as Howard, McBride being the worst. I still think they are Sam's first choice centre back pairing but in hindsight it would have been better to put Taylor or Faye up against him last night.

 

100% agree with that part. Roze was good on the deck but i counted at least 6 times Howard could have scored from headers he won, roze was marking him. Next up West Ham, Ashton could have a field day, so i'd stick Taylor on him.

[James]

In the end of the day we are still a learning club.

 

The only players that have played together for considerable time are Given, Harper, Taylor, Butt, Milner, Martins and Shola, and of the players, Allardyce only really knows Faye inside out.

 

It is one game. Under Roeder, we wouldn't have learned from the experience. Only time will tell if our new team can learn and improve.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

The PL is where you get found out.

 

Not only if your side aren't committed and organised (they weren't) but also for the newcomers Cacapa and Roze. This was the first match a side has really had a proper crack at our center backs albeit a poor side like Derby. It was like watching virgin sailors in a force 9. The CB's were dominated  and rattled time after time...They now know what the PL is all about, if other sides sense a weakness or lack of desire they will get amongst you especially the poorer sides.

 

For all his obsession with a defensive looking midfield and Alan Smith wasted on the right and the purchase of yet another Dm in Faye, the creative and attacking side of our game has withered, in all seriousness teams like Derby will get flattenend by our supposed close rivals ie Spurs, Villa and Everton.

 

SA has set about rebuilding from the back and it was needed yet he let Dyer and Solano go without a creative or winger replacement. Zoggy ranging upfield in desperation at the malaise of sideways passing instigated by Butt and Geremi and in the middle of it all Owen looking like a lost schoolboy.

 

The ball was again too often pumped to Milner without the midfield moving up and supporting the strikers....Martins pushed out wider and wider to get the ball or get space as he was surrounded by 3 def in the middle...None of our midfield pushed on, normally instinctive situations and responses of players strangely lacking...Once they felt the heat Derby were putting out there was strangely no reply, we had no guvnor, no one with authority in the middle, Barton won't bring that either...We seem to have an excess of tacklers who want to give it to another player and quickly...Butt even looked ball shy at some points.

 

We look hard to beat?

 

We'll soon look like we can't win a game.

 

There is something about SA's vision which on the playing side - on the pitch is a bit flat. And all his talk about the backroom staff and new methods will soon be forgotten if he doesn't grow some balls and not hide behind this safety first bullshit.

 

You must have had most of that prepared since the start of August  I bet you're finally glad to get the chance to post it

[Cronky]

I'd agree that Allardyce was a bit too conservative last night. He seems to be very protective of his new players, but Beye should have played last night rather than stick a centre back out wide.

 

I also think there's a case for playing Rozenhal is midfield, because he's quicker and more creative than either Geremi or Butt. Allardyce probably wanted to stick with the side that had served him well so far, and you can understand that.

 

He'll have learned some lessons from last night, and it's way too early to judge him.

[Dave]

He'll have learned some lessons from last night, and it's way too early to judge him.

 

[Lloydie]

I agree it's too early to judge Allardyce.

 

From the sound of it there are people thinking that he's gone home after the match thinking 'Hmm. We created almost nothing, didn't defend that well. Best do exactly the same next week'.

 

Teams evolve, styles of play evolve. Allardyce's Bolton were brutally effective at times, and you've got to believe he's going to be working toward that. He won't tolerate our sudden inability to take a good corner, and our new addiction to long throws is at least an improvement on our inability to take any last season. It may well be that the midfield 3 isn't working the way he wants it to, either because he's lacking the personnel or because players are still getting to grips with the formation.

 

Personally I think it looks like the team is making progress. I'm not sure we're progressing to a style of play I'll be particularly happy with, but its what we signed up for when we picked Allardyce. It's still a decent start to the season, there's quality to come back into the midfield, and when we get Enrique fit we can unleash N'Zogbia higher up the pitch.

 

Cheer up lads.

[johnnypd]

I'd agree that Allardyce was a bit too conservative last night. He seems to be very protective of his new players, but Beye should have played last night rather than stick a centre back out wide.

 

I also think there's a case for playing Rozenhal is midfield, because he's quicker and more creative than either Geremi or Butt. Allardyce probably wanted to stick with the side that had served him well so far, and you can understand that.

 

He'll have learned some lessons from last night, and it's way too early to judge him.

 

good spot about Rozehnal. most the PSG fans on the forum i read thought he was better in midfield than in defence, and also considered him too timid in the challenge, something we've seen already this season.

[Guest Danny B]

Average manager at an average club.

[Guest optimistic nit]

He has totally reshaped the squad,he has to be given more time than the first 6 games before hes judged,losing just one game

 

That's what people kept saying about bramble for 2 years!

 

 

with idiots like this i'm not suprised we've been shit for so long.