Nail your colours to the mast: Sack or No Sack?

[Spider Jerusalem]

I dont actually buy into give the new manager more time to show what he can do because I always think that is just an excuse.Look at people like Mourinho for example.He achieve wonderful things in his first season with Chelsea but of course you would like to think that if we stick him for the long turn,then he may turn out like Ferguson.I also dont buy into the fact that he always say we have a group of many new players and they need time to adjust.Look at Manchester City,I think they had more new players than us and most of them hasnt even played in the Premier League before nor does they speak english when they came.but look at where they are now.Nevertheless,as much as I am feeling angry and disappointed right now,Im going to stick with Sam,but he has got to do much much better quickly or I might have a change of heart.

mourinho could outspend anyone to achieve his aims...sven has done well so far after spending wads.

 

most nufc fans aren't expecting that but we know we should be performing a lot better with the squad we have. it hasn't even been the results it's been the performances.

 

http://images.jupiterimages.com/common/detail/97/51/22595197.jpg

[David Icke - Son of God]

I dont actually buy into give the new manager more time to show what he can do because I always think that is just an excuse.Look at people like Mourinho for example.He achieve wonderful things in his first season with Chelsea but of course you would like to think that if we stick him for the long turn,then he may turn out like Ferguson.I also dont buy into the fact that he always say we have a group of many new players and they need time to adjust.Look at Manchester City,I think they had more new players than us and most of them hasnt even played in the Premier League before nor does they speak english when they came.but look at where they are now.Nevertheless,as much as I am feeling angry and disappointed right now,Im going to stick with Sam,but he has got to do much much better quickly or I might have a change of heart.

 

Congratulations. You've managed to make yourself look like a tit by picking out the exceptions that prove the rule.

[Guest Ridzuan]

I dont actually buy into give the new manager more time to show what he can do because I always think that is just an excuse.Look at people like Mourinho for example.He achieve wonderful things in his first season with Chelsea but of course you would like to think that if we stick him for the long turn,then he may turn out like Ferguson.I also dont buy into the fact that he always say we have a group of many new players and they need time to adjust.Look at Manchester City,I think they had more new players than us and most of them hasnt even played in the Premier League before nor does they speak english when they came.but look at where they are now.Nevertheless,as much as I am feeling angry and disappointed right now,Im going to stick with Sam,but he has got to do much much better quickly or I might have a change of heart.

mourinho could outspend anyone to achieve his aims...sven has done well so far after spending wads.

 

most nufc fans aren't expecting that but we know we should be performing a lot better with the squad we have. it hasn't even been the results it's been the performances.

 

Yes you have a point there.But when he was at Porto,he wasnt doing a bad job either and he didnt have a lot of money to spend  and yes of course the performances are currently the worst we have ever seen for any season,but I think Big Sam's tactics is also baffling to me.My point is Big Sam wasnt my first choice when Roeder was sacked.I wanted Sven because I believe he would do a better job,and he has already proven that at Manchester City.But right now,Big Sam is our manager and if we dont support him,then its going to be very difficult.

[Jamie]

100% SACK !

 

I could sit here all day and pick my reasons.

And i'm not just going on todays performance.

[madras]

I dont actually buy into give the new manager more time to show what he can do because I always think that is just an excuse.Look at people like Mourinho for example.He achieve wonderful things in his first season with Chelsea but of course you would like to think that if we stick him for the long turn,then he may turn out like Ferguson.I also dont buy into the fact that he always say we have a group of many new players and they need time to adjust.Look at Manchester City,I think they had more new players than us and most of them hasnt even played in the Premier League before nor does they speak english when they came.but look at where they are now.Nevertheless,as much as I am feeling angry and disappointed right now,Im going to stick with Sam,but he has got to do much much better quickly or I might have a change of heart.

mourinho could outspend anyone to achieve his aims...sven has done well so far after spending wads.

 

most nufc fans aren't expecting that but we know we should be performing a lot better with the squad we have. it hasn't even been the results it's been the performances.

 

Yes you have a point there.But when he was at Porto,he wasnt doing a bad job either and he didnt have a lot of money to spend  and yes of course the performances are currently the worst we have ever seen for any season,but I think Big Sam's tactics is also baffling to me.My point is Big Sam wasnt my first choice when Roeder was sacked.I wanted Sven because I believe he would do a better job,and he has already proven that at Manchester City.But right now,Big Sam is our manager and if we dont support him,then its going to be very difficult.

at porto he was at the best club in portugal with the pick of brazilians who couldn't get visas for the rest of europe so he pick up a few good players. horrible football to beat celtic in the uefa cup final,within a ferr kick rebound of going out v man utd and dived all over to win the champs lge. put him in charge of liverpool and £30mill to spend and i doubt he'd get close to man utd and arsenal.

 

sven has proven nothing yet

[Guest Ridzuan]

I dont actually buy into give the new manager more time to show what he can do because I always think that is just an excuse.Look at people like Mourinho for example.He achieve wonderful things in his first season with Chelsea but of course you would like to think that if we stick him for the long turn,then he may turn out like Ferguson.I also dont buy into the fact that he always say we have a group of many new players and they need time to adjust.Look at Manchester City,I think they had more new players than us and most of them hasnt even played in the Premier League before nor does they speak english when they came.but look at where they are now.Nevertheless,as much as I am feeling angry and disappointed right now,Im going to stick with Sam,but he has got to do much much better quickly or I might have a change of heart.

mourinho could outspend anyone to achieve his aims...sven has done well so far after spending wads.

 

most nufc fans aren't expecting that but we know we should be performing a lot better with the squad we have. it hasn't even been the results it's been the performances.

 

Yes you have a point there.But when he was at Porto,he wasnt doing a bad job either and he didnt have a lot of money to spend  and yes of course the performances are currently the worst we have ever seen for any season,but I think Big Sam's tactics is also baffling to me.My point is Big Sam wasnt my first choice when Roeder was sacked.I wanted Sven because I believe he would do a better job,and he has already proven that at Manchester City.But right now,Big Sam is our manager and if we dont support him,then its going to be very difficult.

at porto he was at the best club in portugal with the pick of brazilians who couldn't get visas for the rest of europe so he pick up a few good players. horrible football to beat celtic in the uefa cup final,within a ferr kick rebound of going out v man utd and dived all over to win the champs lge. put him in charge of liverpool and £30mill to spend and i doubt he'd get close to man utd and arsenal.

 

sven has proven nothing yet

 

Maybe you are right,but at least he was winning then.And yes,maybe Sven has proven nothing yet,but it is sure feels better to be up there with the top four teams than to be below here.

[Guest Dev]

Keep until the end of the season then sack.

 

I really don't think he'll get us relegated the squad is too good for that, regardless of the manager. Give him the season, if he is still tactically worse than Roeder sack him in May.

[Wullie]

We have to keep him until the end of the season, difficult as that seems to comprehend right now.

 

I reserve the right to scrap this opinion before New Year.

[Parky]

I dont actually buy into give the new manager more time to show what he can do because I always think that is just an excuse.Look at people like Mourinho for example.He achieve wonderful things in his first season with Chelsea but of course you would like to think that if we stick him for the long turn,then he may turn out like Ferguson.I also dont buy into the fact that he always say we have a group of many new players and they need time to adjust.Look at Manchester City,I think they had more new players than us and most of them hasnt even played in the Premier League before nor does they speak english when they came.but look at where they are now.Nevertheless,as much as I am feeling angry and disappointed right now,Im going to stick with Sam,but he has got to do much much better quickly or I might have a change of heart.

mourinho could outspend anyone to achieve his aims...sven has done well so far after spending wads.

 

most nufc fans aren't expecting that but we know we should be performing a lot better with the squad we have. it hasn't even been the results it's been the performances.

 

Yes you have a point there.But when he was at Porto,he wasnt doing a bad job either and he didnt have a lot of money to spend  and yes of course the performances are currently the worst we have ever seen for any season,but I think Big Sam's tactics is also baffling to me.My point is Big Sam wasnt my first choice when Roeder was sacked.I wanted Sven because I believe he would do a better job,and he has already proven that at Manchester City.But right now,Big Sam is our manager and if we dont support him,then its going to be very difficult.

at porto he was at the best club in portugal with the pick of brazilians who couldn't get visas for the rest of europe so he pick up a few good players. horrible football to beat celtic in the uefa cup final,within a ferr kick rebound of going out v man utd and dived all over to win the champs lge. put him in charge of liverpool and £30mill to spend and i doubt he'd get close to man utd and arsenal.

 

sven has proven nothing yet

 

Ridiculous last statement. One of the best club cv's there is.

[Mick]

Reasons to keep him:

 

- He's got a good record.

 

He hasn't got a very good record here, we have rarely looked good even when winning.

 

- As Mort said, success comes through stability, sacking managers all the time isn't going to get us anywhere.

 

Managers have to earn the right to stability, sacking managers all of the time isn't going to get us anywhere until we appoint the right manager.  Then he'll earn himself time and be given the stability.  It's no good keeping a manager for the sake of stability if he's not up to the job and at this time it looks like Allardyce isn't up to it.

 

- We're what; 13 games into the season and we're already trying to lynch him. He hasn't had time to do anything yet.

 

We're 14 games into the season, don't forget Arsenal reserves in the League Cup.  Allardyce has had more than enough time to have been able to stick with a settled side but he doesn't know how to use his players to get the best out of them and the players clearly don't know what's expected of them, the players look lost and that's down to him.

 

- The players respect him, he can attract good players (Anelka etc). Also, the players he's had in the past all love him.

 

How do you know the players respect him?  We were told the same about Souness and Roeder, should we have kept them?

 

- He spent very little in the transfer window and we have had our best start in 11 year (I know this is deceptive, but there it is).

 

Allardyce has brought in 9 players who he wanted and were willing to come yet he doesn't know how to use the players that he wanted.  As for the best start in 11 years, so what?  We played poor teams and the way you start doesn't matter in the slightest it's where you finish that matters.  Sir Bobby has at least 3 out of 5 poor starts and finished well, once high enough to qualify for the CL.

 

- He's got his head screwed on when it comes to back room staff.

 

What matters is what happens on the pitch, if he's that good with his back room staff and has got 9 of his own players, why is he doing so badly?

 

- The players he bought during the last transfer window were 'cover' types of players, he get rid of the rubbish and got some hard workers in in there place, Dyer for Smith etc.

 

What makes you think the players he brought in were cover type of players?  We virtually needed a whole new defence so I don't see how you could class those players as being brought in as cover, two of our most expensive signings were midfielders although one also plays up front but has played mainly in midfield, I don't think we were in a position to spend £12 million on two players if they're only here as cover.  Who was Barton and Smith brought into cover?  In fact who were the 9 players brought into cover?  Did we pay £6 million for Enrique so that he could come in to cover Babayaro?  Did we pay £2 million for Beye to come in to cover Carr?  Most of the players who were brought in were done so to go into the team, few came as cover.

 

- He uses tactics (even though they don't work at the moment) - unlike our past two managers.

 

Wow, so he uses tactics?  If the tactiscs that he uses are wrong and so far they have been then that's a negative and no reason to keep him.  If Allardyce is using tactics then I could see an argument that Souness and Roeder also used them even if the outcome was the same.

 

- He appears to be ignoring 90% of our fans - which to me is a good thing.

 

It might be good to you but it's no good for the team if those 90% of fans are right and he's wrong.

 

There are probably more, but it's late and I'm tired.

 

I hope that if you have more then they're better than the ones you highlighted.

Reasons to sack him:

 

- He keeps playing players out of position (if this is a good enough reason?).

- We're losing games (even though we're only 13 games in, I can see how some people will drop their arse over this).

 

I can't think of anything else at the moment, it's late and I'm tired.

 

Stop letting your emotions take control of you when you post. Read what you type out loud, and before you press "post", try and see the opposite side of your statement.

 

How do you know what controls me when I post?

 

And last but not least, stop reading crappy newspapers, they make so much money from crappy stories such as "Sam has lost the dressing room" - it's all bloody stupid.

 

For your information, I hardly ever read any newspapers but I'll make the decision as to what I do read.

 

nn m8/people

[Mick]

We have to keep him until the end of the season, difficult as that seems to comprehend right now.

 

I reserve the right to scrap this opinion before New Year.

 

[Colos Short and Curlies]

One minor point Mick (and it backs you up more..) SBR finished high enough to qualify for the Champions league twice, remember when it all went wrong agaisnt Belgrade?

[Lazy]

I can't really be bothered to read through those massive replies, all I'm saying is - give the fella a break, he's got a contract and we should honor it.

[Guest]

I don't think he should be given until the end of the season just for the sake of it though. If this past month's form continues, including tactics, team selections, questionable substitutions, until Jan-Feb, I really don't see what should set him apart from Souness in terms of criticism.

[Guest alex]

I don't think he should be given until the end of the season just for the sake of it though. If this past month's form continues, including tactics, team selections, questionable substitutions, until Jan-Feb, I really don't see what should set him apart from Souness in terms of criticism.

Souness turned a team that finished 5th into a side that came 14th. Allardyce is actually doing better (I think) than the same stage last season despite having to bring in loads of personnel. I'm not happy and the criticism is justified but there's a difference between his situation and that of Souness.

[Guest]

At the same time though, I think at the start of the season people were wanting and expecting us to at least challenge the likes of Pompey, Villa, Everton, West Ham, Blackburn, Man City. As it stands, he's not only bottom of that mini-league, but nowhere near it.

[Mick]

I don't think he should be given until the end of the season just for the sake of it though. If this past month's form continues, including tactics, team selections, questionable substitutions, until Jan-Feb, I really don't see what should set him apart from Souness in terms of criticism.

 

If keeping him until the summer brought a better manager in then I'd go with it, I'd rather do that if it avoided making the wrong decision now as long as we're in no danger of relegation.

[Guest alex]

At the same time though, I think at the start of the season people were wanting and expecting us to at least challenge the likes of Pompey, Villa, Everton, West Ham, Blackburn, Man City. As it stands, he's not only bottom of that mini-league, but nowhere near it.

I agree although perhaps that was being too optimistic. Not defending his puzzling decisions so far btw, it was more me saying why I think Souness was worse. Very early days regardless.

[Guest]

Man City are proving that a manager with genuine capability, ambition and tactical nous can work wonders even when he hasn't had a great deal of time.

[madras]

Man City are proving that a manager with genuine capability, ambition and tactical nous can work wonders even when he hasn't had a great deal of time.

then again he spent a wad of cash in the summer. also, and i admit to not having seen citeh more than just on tele but according to the press a few of their points have come from games where they haven't really performed. for citeh it may best be judged at the end of the season.

[wor jackie]

Sack him personally. The point about needing 5 years is absolutely garbage. Man City spent a shitload of money on players straight away and are now something like 4 points off top whilst we fanny about in mid-table again. His tactics which have been higlighted enough are baffling beyond belief. 5 in midfield at home? Drop one of our most consistent performers and bring him on for another attacking player? Take a left-back off and replace him with a right-footed full-back with 5mins to go? WTF man??!! Furthermore, when you look at the start we have had we have had a very easy start in terms of teams to play. Now we get into the nitty gritty and hell I'm nervous about it. Fair enough, perhaps til new year, but if it's still not getting better, why let it worsen? His tactcs are far too negative and playing Alan Smith out wide right (had on he was actually moved there after half an hour because we'd decided to start without anyone on the right!) and Geremi right-back is just stupid! Play yer players in position! Also, cannot wait to get Michael Owen back in a shirt when we can ping long balls up at him agaist 20ft defender before laying into the lad and accusing him of not caring. Christ I want the team to do well but I just cannot see how it will under this man. He's corrupt with bungs and the way he refuses to talk to the BBC is just annoying. Sorry to rant I'm pissed off and my points are all probably shite but just wanted to get it off me chest. Prove me wrong big Sam.....PLEASE!!!!!!!

[Keefaz]

We have to keep him until the end of the season, difficult as that seems to comprehend right now.

 

I reserve the right to scrap this opinion before New Year.

 

That ain't how this thread works! You can't denail your colours from the mast!

[merlin]

I don't think he should be given until the end of the season just for the sake of it though. If this past month's form continues, including tactics, team selections, questionable substitutions, until Jan-Feb, I really don't see what should set him apart from Souness in terms of criticism.

 

If keeping him until the summer brought a better manager in then I'd go with it, I'd rather do that if it avoided making the wrong decision now as long as we're in no danger of relegation.

 

Agreed Mick - the only trouble is that on current form, we will have serious problems keeping clear of the relegation pack ; lose the next 3 games and we could be well & truly in it...

 

I think that, realistically, Allardyce needs at least a point from the next 2 games - anything less will see the vultures gathering and to be honest, I wouldn't be at all surprised if there hasn't already been a great deal of agonizing between Ashley & Mort about what to do next....

 

It would be unrealistic not to imagine that they may already have started on a contingency plan...

[Crumpy Gunt]

Out of every Newcastle supporter.

 

Taking Charlie off and putting Milner on was an insult to every single supporter who could see that Milner was needed to bring width to the opposite flank.

 

Was this Allardyce giving a two finger salute to his own sides support?

 

I think so and the sooner he goes now the better. I actually said to my mate I hope the scousers get 6 or 7 to complete the job and put massive pressure on Ashley to react.

[Parky]

Sautrday 24th November = The day I lost complete faith in Big Sam.

 

We lost yesterday's game purely because of his inability to make changes or play people in their correct positions.

 

I hate to say it, but I think he's already lost 60-70% of St. James Park, and once a manager does that, he's a dead man walking.

 

I would go as far to say that yesterdays performance was worse than anything we saw from Souness or Roeder, and unfortunately I no longer trust him to change a game if needed.

 

His decisions are just crazy.

 

Is it the intense pressure he's under you think?