Senderos Vs Taylor

[Keefaz]

The Ameobi of centre-halves, tbh.

[Guest Sniffer]

An egotistical football player? Now there's a rarity.

 

Can you name me one that isn't?

[ElDiablo]

The poll is a fucking joke so far.

[Keefaz]

An egotistical football player? Now there's a rarity.

 

Can you name me one that isn't?

 

Andy O'Brien. Used to drive a shitty Saab, I seem to remember. And probaly no worse than Taylor.

[ElDiablo]

They're both crap but Taylor looks more likely to make an individual mistake.

[Cajun]

An egotistical football player? Now there's a rarity.

 

Can you name me one that isn't?

 

James Milner.

 

 

Obviously said that partly in jest but he has never come across arrogant or like someone who thinks he is anything special.

[midds]

An egotistical football player? Now there's a rarity.

 

Can you name me one that isn't?

 

James Milner.

 

 

Obviously said that partly in jest but he has never come across arrogant or like someone who thinks he is anything special.

 

That's because he isn't. 

[Cajun]

 

Doesn't stop Taylor

[Mowen]

An egotistical football player? Now there's a rarity.

 

Can you name me one that isn't?

 

How many of our other egotistical players come out in the paper complaining about how much they're paid and getting daddy to back them up? You can see why it might grate....

[NE5]

Not a big fan of Senderos but he's better than Taylor. Next.

 

he's not

 

 

[La Parka]

Not a big fan of Senderos but he's better than Taylor. Next.

 

he's not

 

 

 

He really is.

[TRon]

Since Taylor is better than Senderos, we should be able to sell him Arsenal for a decent fee. If Senderos is worth £2m then Taylor has to be worth at least £2.1m. I vote we insist Arsenal buy him as his value is clearly higher in this well reasoned scenario.

[sicsfingeredmong]

There's only one way to find out! 

 

I'm asking this as a lot of people seem to have a problem with Taylor, some are founded, others are just plain twattish; and i remember it was put to me once Taylor wouldn't get the chance of playing in a winning team if he came through one of the big fours academy. (i know Senderos didn't)

 

Well imo (which in no uncertain doubt will be verbally abused for) Taylor would be playing for Arsenal right now, the games Senderos plays (25-30 already this season), and i'd think he'd be doing a much better job at it too.

 

On the other side, if i had Senderos at NUFC, there is no way he'd start over Taylor, even if Taylor was a bought player.

 

Just a thought, is Taylor really as bad as him?

 

 

PS: They are basically the same age, and Senderos has played around the same amount of league games (in a winning top 4 team) nevermind his CL games and NT caps.

 

 

Perhaps you should create a separate "Save Stevie Taylor" website, with a petition and all................. try and collect 10000 signatures, try to convert the those who are unconvinced with his ability, conduct your very own version of the Salem Witchcraft Trials for those who remain unrepentant etc etc. This i mean in jest btw.

 

For various reasons, and i've posted them before in a couple of threads and i think my opinion re-Taylor has some degree of depth...... at least i think i'm not some type of shallow thinking t***, i thought Taylor's NUFC career was at the crossroads at the beginning of the current campaign.

 

Comparing one player - ie. Taylor - to another - ie. Senderos - who isn't fit to the lace the boots of Wenger's preferred centre-halves of current & recent times, players like Toure/Campbell & Gallas, is a pretty weak attempt at justafying or defending Taylor's supposed worth to this club afterall Arsenal's team performance should be the overall goal.

 

Taylor & Senderos both showed early promise, however they haven't progressed. That's how the cookie crumbles, intangibles or no intangibles, that's the nature of football. Some make it, some don't. For every Cherno Samba or Steve Taylor - ie. previously celebrated youngsters whose development & careers have stalled at varying degrees - there'll be another who'll suddenly appear out of the woodwork and grab the opportunity afforded to him, Edgar might just fall into the latter group as our current example.

 

To the contrary by asking the question 'is he really as bad as Senderos' - and i think this more relevant in the team's fall from grace with & without the other factors involved ie. Souness' mismanagement of the 1st team, Roeder & Allardyce also being out of their depth - you're talking about a player who has been branded as the brightest prospect our academy has produced in many years, and the opinion regarding these two players seems to be split, you're illustrating how inept our coaching staff has been in recent times in terms of being able transform potential into 'consistent premiership-standard performers. And over the last 2 seasons Taylor doesn't qualify for the latter category imo. This has been of a greater concern to me.

[NE5]

think its slightly odd the way people jump onto bandwagons, most of them are probably unconvinced of their own point of view so hide behind the majority.

 

A few years ago the vast majority of people said Ameobi was the new Shearer, needed games to improve, the new "flying centre forward". Some even said it justified the sale of Bellamy because we had plenty of other good forwards [words to that effect].

 

The truth is that he was always crap - for the standards we wanted - and never had a cat in hells chance of filling either Shearer's or Bellamy's boots.

 

Taylor is now attracting the same but with the opposite view.

 

The last post by sicsfingeredmong is closer to the truth. The fact is he was a prospect with a lot of potential, and appears to have stalled during a season which has been difficult for everybody, as well as the last one too, and the one before. Why single out Taylor ?

 

If his attitude and desire remain, he can still achieve his potential, the same player is still there at 21/22 years old. Playing alongside better players will be the making of him if this is the case.

 

 

[Guest alex]

think its slightly odd the way people jump onto bandwagons, most of them are probably unconvinced of their own point of view so hide behind the majority.

 

A few years ago the vast majority of people said Ameobi was the new Shearer, needed games to improve, the new "flying centre forward". Some even said it justified the sale of Bellamy because we had plenty of other good forwards [words to that effect].

 

The truth is that he was always crap - for the standards we wanted - and never had a cat in hells chance of filling either Shearer's or Bellamy's boots.

 

Taylor is now attracting the same but with the opposite view.

 

The last post by sicsfingeredmong is closer to the truth. The fact is he was a prospect with a lot of potential, and appears to have stalled during a season which has been difficult for everybody, as well as the last one too, and the one before. Why single out Taylor ?

 

If his attitude and desire remain, he can still achieve his potential, the same player is still there at 21/22 years old. Playing alongside better players will be the making of him if this is the case.

 

 

You keep saying that often enough but I still don't think anyone believes you. Shola's probably the only on who said it.

[colinmk]

Taylor has the potential to be a good defender. Whenever I have watched Senderos he has either made a mistake or looked ropy as fuck and I am surprised he still gets a game for Arse. Taylor is better than him no doubt.

[fredbob]

think its slightly odd the way people jump onto bandwagons, most of them are probably unconvinced of their own point of view so hide behind the majority.

 

A few years ago the vast majority of people said Ameobi was the new Shearer, needed games to improve, the new "flying centre forward". Some even said it justified the sale of Bellamy because we had plenty of other good forwards [words to that effect].

 

The truth is that he was always crap - for the standards we wanted - and never had a cat in hells chance of filling either Shearer's or Bellamy's boots.

 

Taylor is now attracting the same but with the opposite view.

 

The last post by sicsfingeredmong is closer to the truth. The fact is he was a prospect with a lot of potential, and appears to have stalled during a season which has been difficult for everybody, as well as the last one too, and the one before. Why single out Taylor ?

 

If his attitude and desire remain, he can still achieve his potential, the same player is still there at 21/22 years old. Playing alongside better players will be the making of him if this is the case.

 

 

 

But i dont see the raw attributes to see him flourish, thats my issue. A few years ago, he hd age and inexperience on his side, and even though he's still young he hast really developed anything prticulary good about his defending.

 

When i look at him as a defender, i dont see great anticipation, i dont see great strength, i dont see great positional sense he has a decent bit of pace but by no means is he lighniting.

 

These are all attibutes that are vital as a defender, i still have hope that he could come good, id like to see him play the Terry role, because idont think he;s iuntelligent to play the Ferdinand role.

 

He's made a lot of mistakes in his career, just like Roz have and Cacapa has and Bramble and Boum did, but none of themgot the preferential treatment that Taylors gets.

 

Like i say, i hope he'll come good, but i dont think he will, if we conceded less as a team, it will be more down our team playing more attacking then idown to our centre halves over performing. Just like it was when we last break the top 4.

 

For me, Taylor is no better tha A O'Brien.

[lovejoy]

think its slightly odd the way people jump onto bandwagons, most of them are probably unconvinced of their own point of view so hide behind the majority.

 

A few years ago the vast majority of people said Ameobi was the new Shearer, needed games to improve, the new "flying centre forward". Some even said it justified the sale of Bellamy because we had plenty of other good forwards [words to that effect].

 

The truth is that he was always crap - for the standards we wanted - and never had a cat in hells chance of filling either Shearer's or Bellamy's boots.

 

Taylor is now attracting the same but with the opposite view.

 

The last post by sicsfingeredmong is closer to the truth. The fact is he was a prospect with a lot of potential, and appears to have stalled during a season which has been difficult for everybody, as well as the last one too, and the one before. Why single out Taylor ?

 

If his attitude and desire remain, he can still achieve his potential, the same player is still there at 21/22 years old. Playing alongside better players will be the making of him if this is the case.

 

 

 

thats a pretty well balanced view if you ask me.

 

well said

[Dave]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport/

Micah Richards column

"I've just been told I'm short-sighted"

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/default.stm

Micah Richards column

"My eyesight isn't good and I've just been told I'm nearsighted"

 

No reason btw.

[wacko]

Are there really any 21 or 22 year old central defenders that are any good?  Or that you would have playing regularly in the Premiership?  At a minimum, they should have been kept in the reserves or out on loan for 3 or 4 years time.  Both are now in the difficult position of thinking they are "it" well before their prime, and probably won't accept a step back down. 

 

I can understand how it happened at Newcastle because of 1) injuries and 2) a complete lack of any sort of forward thinking or planning under previous management.  But how exactly did a 22 year old defender become a regular at Arsenal?  What was Wenger thinking?

 

 

Danny Agger's just turned 23 and he did fine for us last season at 21/22. I agree that it's unusual, though.

 

I don't rate Senderos at all. He makes a LOT of mistakes and doesn't have any pace at all to recover from them. He got left for dead by Sami Hyypia for God's sake who has the pace of a stoned zombie.

[NE5]

think its slightly odd the way people jump onto bandwagons, most of them are probably unconvinced of their own point of view so hide behind the majority.

 

A few years ago the vast majority of people said Ameobi was the new Shearer, needed games to improve, the new "flying centre forward". Some even said it justified the sale of Bellamy because we had plenty of other good forwards [words to that effect].

 

The truth is that he was always crap - for the standards we wanted - and never had a cat in hells chance of filling either Shearer's or Bellamy's boots.

 

Taylor is now attracting the same but with the opposite view.

 

The last post by sicsfingeredmong is closer to the truth. The fact is he was a prospect with a lot of potential, and appears to have stalled during a season which has been difficult for everybody, as well as the last one too, and the one before. Why single out Taylor ?

 

If his attitude and desire remain, he can still achieve his potential, the same player is still there at 21/22 years old. Playing alongside better players will be the making of him if this is the case.

 

 

You keep saying that often enough but I still don't think anyone believes you. Shola's probably the only on who said it.

 

oh I don't think so Alex. I remember it clearly, and I suspect that you do too.

 

 

[NE5]

think its slightly odd the way people jump onto bandwagons, most of them are probably unconvinced of their own point of view so hide behind the majority.

 

A few years ago the vast majority of people said Ameobi was the new Shearer, needed games to improve, the new "flying centre forward". Some even said it justified the sale of Bellamy because we had plenty of other good forwards [words to that effect].

 

The truth is that he was always crap - for the standards we wanted - and never had a cat in hells chance of filling either Shearer's or Bellamy's boots.

 

Taylor is now attracting the same but with the opposite view.

 

The last post by sicsfingeredmong is closer to the truth. The fact is he was a prospect with a lot of potential, and appears to have stalled during a season which has been difficult for everybody, as well as the last one too, and the one before. Why single out Taylor ?

 

If his attitude and desire remain, he can still achieve his potential, the same player is still there at 21/22 years old. Playing alongside better players will be the making of him if this is the case.

 

 

 

But i dont see the raw attributes to see him flourish, thats my issue. A few years ago, he hd age and inexperience on his side, and even though he's still young he hast really developed anything prticulary good about his defending.

 

When i look at him as a defender, i dont see great anticipation, i dont see great strength, i dont see great positional sense he has a decent bit of pace but by no means is he lighniting.

 

These are all attibutes that are vital as a defender, i still have hope that he could come good, id like to see him play the Terry role, because idont think he;s iuntelligent to play the Ferdinand role.

 

He's made a lot of mistakes in his career, just like Roz have and Cacapa has and Bramble and Boum did, but none of themgot the preferential treatment that Taylors gets.

 

Like i say, i hope he'll come good, but i dont think he will, if we conceded less as a team, it will be more down our team playing more attacking then idown to our centre halves over performing. Just like it was when we last break the top 4.

 

For me, Taylor is no better tha A O'Brien.

 

It depends what you mean by "raw attributes". Do you mean a footballing defender ? I don't look for that specifically, I look for someone with strength and the determination to hold a defence together and will stand up when the chips are down. If he's a "footballer" - like Roy McFarland - then so much the better, but players of quality like that are very rare. He's not a Roy McFarland or even a Rio Ferdinand, he;s more of a Vidic type, a Carragher type, a Colin Hendry type. Thats what he is. He needs to play alongside better players now though, either with us or someone else if something goes wrong.

 

To say he is no better than Andy O'Brien is a joke mate, sorry, but it is.

 

 

[Baggio]

think its slightly odd the way people jump onto bandwagons, most of them are probably unconvinced of their own point of view so hide behind the majority.

 

A few years ago the vast majority of people said Ameobi was the new Shearer, needed games to improve, the new "flying centre forward". Some even said it justified the sale of Bellamy because we had plenty of other good forwards [words to that effect].

 

The truth is that he was always crap - for the standards we wanted - and never had a cat in hells chance of filling either Shearer's or Bellamy's boots.

 

Taylor is now attracting the same but with the opposite view.

 

The last post by sicsfingeredmong is closer to the truth. The fact is he was a prospect with a lot of potential, and appears to have stalled during a season which has been difficult for everybody, as well as the last one too, and the one before. Why single out Taylor ?

 

If his attitude and desire remain, he can still achieve his potential, the same player is still there at 21/22 years old. Playing alongside better players will be the making of him if this is the case.

 

 

 

But i dont see the raw attributes to see him flourish, thats my issue. A few years ago, he hd age and inexperience on his side, and even though he's still young he hast really developed anything prticulary good about his defending.

 

When i look at him as a defender, i dont see great anticipation, i dont see great strength, i dont see great positional sense he has a decent bit of pace but by no means is he lighniting.

 

These are all attibutes that are vital as a defender, i still have hope that he could come good, id like to see him play the Terry role, because idont think he;s iuntelligent to play the Ferdinand role.

 

He's made a lot of mistakes in his career, just like Roz have and Cacapa has and Bramble and Boum did, but none of themgot the preferential treatment that Taylors gets.

 

Like i say, i hope he'll come good, but i dont think he will, if we conceded less as a team, it will be more down our team playing more attacking then idown to our centre halves over performing. Just like it was when we last break the top 4.

 

For me, Taylor is no better tha A O'Brien.

 

It depends what you mean by "raw attributes". Do you mean a footballing defender ? I don't look for that specifically, I look for someone with strength and the determination to hold a defence together and will stand up when the chips are down. If he's a "footballer" - like Roy McFarland - then so much the better, but players of quality like that are very rare. He's not a Roy McFarland or even a Rio Ferdinand, he;s more of a Vidic type, a Carragher type, a Colin Hendry type. Thats what he is. He needs to play alongside better players now though, either with us or someone else if something goes wrong.

 

To say he is no better than Andy O'Brien is a joke mate, sorry, but it is.

 

 

 

A Vidic type? mackems.gif

 

 

[NE5]

think its slightly odd the way people jump onto bandwagons, most of them are probably unconvinced of their own point of view so hide behind the majority.

 

A few years ago the vast majority of people said Ameobi was the new Shearer, needed games to improve, the new "flying centre forward". Some even said it justified the sale of Bellamy because we had plenty of other good forwards [words to that effect].

 

The truth is that he was always crap - for the standards we wanted - and never had a cat in hells chance of filling either Shearer's or Bellamy's boots.

 

Taylor is now attracting the same but with the opposite view.

 

The last post by sicsfingeredmong is closer to the truth. The fact is he was a prospect with a lot of potential, and appears to have stalled during a season which has been difficult for everybody, as well as the last one too, and the one before. Why single out Taylor ?

 

If his attitude and desire remain, he can still achieve his potential, the same player is still there at 21/22 years old. Playing alongside better players will be the making of him if this is the case.

 

 

 

But i dont see the raw attributes to see him flourish, thats my issue. A few years ago, he hd age and inexperience on his side, and even though he's still young he hast really developed anything prticulary good about his defending.

 

When i look at him as a defender, i dont see great anticipation, i dont see great strength, i dont see great positional sense he has a decent bit of pace but by no means is he lighniting.

 

These are all attibutes that are vital as a defender, i still have hope that he could come good, id like to see him play the Terry role, because idont think he;s iuntelligent to play the Ferdinand role.

 

He's made a lot of mistakes in his career, just like Roz have and Cacapa has and Bramble and Boum did, but none of themgot the preferential treatment that Taylors gets.

 

Like i say, i hope he'll come good, but i dont think he will, if we conceded less as a team, it will be more down our team playing more attacking then idown to our centre halves over performing. Just like it was when we last break the top 4.

 

For me, Taylor is no better tha A O'Brien.

 

It depends what you mean by "raw attributes". Do you mean a footballing defender ? I don't look for that specifically, I look for someone with strength and the determination to hold a defence together and will stand up when the chips are down. If he's a "footballer" - like Roy McFarland - then so much the better, but players of quality like that are very rare. He's not a Roy McFarland or even a Rio Ferdinand, he;s more of a Vidic type, a Carragher type, a Colin Hendry type. Thats what he is. He needs to play alongside better players now though, either with us or someone else if something goes wrong.

 

To say he is no better than Andy O'Brien is a joke mate, sorry, but it is.

 

 

 

A Vidic type? mackems.gif

 

 

 

And you never saw Roy McFarland play did you Matthew ? Or you would understand the point a bit more, as people like you clearly think Taylor should be a Franz Beckenbaur or a Bobby Moore mackems.gif

 

When you've seen your 200th NUFC game in about 15 years time when you are 42 you just might understand something

 

 

[Tooj]

Nobody thinks he should be a Kaiser or Bobby Moore though Steve mate, not that I'm aware of.