Hillsborough

[Guest Phil K]

how was it overcrowded if the correct amount of people were there?

There was a documentary which will offer some clarification to you which was aired on ITV1 earlier this week and should still be available to view.

Having visited Hillsbrough several times prior to 89' I can totally understand how and why the fans went down the central tunnel that day.

Thing about ALL "documentaries" is that they have an agenda.

They are done solely to put all the blame on one side.

Rarely (if ever) do they say both sides are to blame to varying extents.

The one I saw was as bad as any I'd seen. It could have been done by the Liverpool Supporters Club !

You see these things, you make your own mind up.

Odd how these crushes happened all the time, but never to this level, though.

Odd also that Liverpool blamed everyone but themselves for the Heyshell disgrace too.

[2sheds]

how was it overcrowded if the correct amount of people were there?

There was a documentary which will offer some clarification to you which was aired on ITV1 earlier this week and should still be available to view.

Having visited Hillsbrough several times prior to 89' I can totally understand how and why the fans went down the central tunnel that day.

Thing about ALL "documentaries" is that they have an agenda.

They are done solely to put all the blame on one side.

Rarely (if ever) do they say both sides are to blame to varying extents.

The one I saw was as bad as any I'd seen. It could have been done by the Liverpool Supporters Club !

You see these things, you make your own mind up.

Odd how these crushes happened all the time, but never to this level, though.

Odd also that Liverpool blamed everyone but themselves for the Heyshell disgrace too.

The Prime Ministers statement and apology should help people 'make their mind up' on this one

[colinmk]

how was it overcrowded if the correct amount of people were there?

There was a documentary which will offer some clarification to you which was aired on ITV1 earlier this week and should still be available to view.

Having visited Hillsbrough several times prior to 89' I can totally understand how and why the fans went down the central tunnel that day.

Thing about ALL "documentaries" is that they have an agenda.

They are done solely to put all the blame on one side.

Rarely (if ever) do they say both sides are to blame to varying extents.

The one I saw was as bad as any I'd seen. It could have been done by the Liverpool Supporters Club !

You see these things, you make your own mind up.

Odd how these crushes happened all the time, but never to this level, though.

Odd also that Liverpool blamed everyone but themselves for the Heyshell disgrace too.

 

Utter bollocks.

[frankpingel]

how was it overcrowded if the correct amount of people were there?

There was a documentary which will offer some clarification to you which was aired on ITV1 earlier this week and should still be available to view.

Having visited Hillsbrough several times prior to 89' I can totally understand how and why the fans went down the central tunnel that day.

Thing about ALL "documentaries" is that they have an agenda.

They are done solely to put all the blame on one side.

Rarely (if ever) do they say both sides are to blame to varying extents.

The one I saw was as bad as any I'd seen. It could have been done by the Liverpool Supporters Club !

You see these things, you make your own mind up.

Odd how these crushes happened all the time, but never to this level, though.

Odd also that Liverpool blamed everyone but themselves for the Heyshell disgrace too.

I meant to imply that it showed, through actual cctv/tv footage, why so many ended in the middle pen. But I agree with the documentary sentiment.

[Guest firetotheworks]

Totally disagree about all documentaries having an agenda as well. Certainly some do, but to say that they all do is a bit OTT.

[Dave]

Anyone posted that South Yorkshire police originally got the date of the event wrong in their statement today?

 

Also, that Kelvin Mackenzie(sp?) put out his 'apology' at 3.06pm, when a moments' silence was occurring. What a cunt.

[Dokko]

Anyone posted that South Yorkshire police originally got the date of the event wrong in their statement today?

 

Also, that Kelvin Mackenzie(sp?) put out his 'apology' at 3.06pm, when a moments' silence was occurring. What a cunt.

 

Takes some balls or total ignorance to do that. Either way, wow.

 

 

[NG32]

Anyone posted that South Yorkshire police originally got the date of the event wrong in their statement today?

 

Also, that Kelvin Mackenzie(sp?) put out his 'apology' at 3.06pm, when a moments' silence was occurring. What a c***.

 

Kelvin Mackenzie is a bellend of the highest order.

[Dokko]

So the government are quite happy to allow the police to take full responsibility for this? Wonder if the documents would have contained more had labour been in power right now.

[Mick]

Anyone posted that South Yorkshire police originally got the date of the event wrong in their statement today?

 

Also, that Kelvin Mackenzie(sp?) put out his 'apology' at 3.06pm, when a moments' silence was occurring. What a c***.

 

Kelvin Mackenzie is a bellend of the highest order.

 

I hate that bloke with a passion.

[NG32]

Anyone posted that South Yorkshire police originally got the date of the event wrong in their statement today?

 

Also, that Kelvin Mackenzie(sp?) put out his 'apology' at 3.06pm, when a moments' silence was occurring. What a c***.

 

Kelvin Mackenzie is a bellend of the highest order.

 

I hate that bloke with a passion.

 

Yup, him and Piers Morgan!!!

[2sheds]

So the government are quite happy to allow the police to take full responsibility for this? Wonder if the documents would have contained more had labour been in power right now.

They would have said fuck all, just like they did when they were in power.

[Wallace]

For an insight into how football fans were viewed at that time, here is a "When Saturday Comes" article a couple of months post Hillsborough.

 

http://www.wsc.co.uk/wsc-daily/1152-september-2012/8991-post-hillsborough-disaster-editorial

[jdckelly]

for me this isn't a Liverpool thing or even a football thing, its a human tragedy that the police who are supposed to protect and serve the public were so willfully letting it happen and later looking for any dirt on the victims to cover their own asses. A disgrace and heads should roll over it

[Darth Crooks]

nuneaton hates the pigs

 

If you have ever been to nuneaton you would know why

[magorific]

how was it overcrowded if the correct amount of people were there?

There was a documentary which will offer some clarification to you which was aired on ITV1 earlier this week and should still be available to view.

Having visited Hillsbrough several times prior to 89' I can totally understand how and why the fans went down the central tunnel that day.

Thing about ALL "documentaries" is that they have an agenda.

They are done solely to put all the blame on one side.

Rarely (if ever) do they say both sides are to blame to varying extents.

The one I saw was as bad as any I'd seen. It could have been done by the Liverpool Supporters Club !

You see these things, you make your own mind up.

Odd how these crushes happened all the time, but never to this level, though.

Odd also that Liverpool blamed everyone but themselves for the Heyshell disgrace too.

 

If you knew - or admitted to yourself - anything about following NUFC away in the 80s, you'd acknowledge there would have been an overwhelming likelihood of the same happening to us had we been in that semi-final that year at that end of Hillsborough. It wasn't far off happening in our league game there a couple of years before. Something not too dissimilar WOULD have happened to us at Spurs in the cup in '87 had our lot not taken matters into their own hands and forced their way into an empty pen.

Liverpool fans were as culpable for what unfolded as fans of any other club with a comparable away following (us, Man U,arguably the Mackems etc) would have been. Culpable in being there - nothing more.

In the face of the facts revealed (or confirmed) today, talk of a mass drunken mob and forged tickets sounds ever more absurd.

[henke]

So if i turn up in Brugge, have a wee drink (but stay sober), then attempt to illegally gain entry to the game by forcing my way in - i'm blame free?

[Darth Crooks]

So if i turn up in Brugge, have a wee drink (but stay sober), then attempt to illegally gain entry to the game by forcing my way in - i'm blame free?

 

Aye. It's shocking what the police did n all that and teerible for the families but noone on either side can be absolved of blame. Which listening to the likes of TalkSport this savvy you would think.

[henke]

So if i turn up in Brugge, have a wee drink (but stay sober), then attempt to illegally gain entry to the game by forcing my way in - i'm blame free?

 

noone on either side can be absolved of blame.

 

Apparently they can. No fan was at fault.

 

Don't get me wrong, i'm not defending the police at all. What they did was despicable i just think it's mental to say they were the only ones to blame.

[Jesse Pinkman]

Kelvin Mackenzie is a Scumbag of the lowest order!!

[Darth Crooks]

So if i turn up in Brugge, have a wee drink (but stay sober), then attempt to illegally gain entry to the game by forcing my way in - i'm blame free?

 

noone on either side can be absolved of blame.

 

Apparently they can. No fan was at fault.

 

Don't get me wrong, i'm not defending the police at all. What they did was despicable i just think it's mental to say they were the only ones to blame.

 

I agree mate tbh

[Wullie]

So if i turn up in Brugge, have a wee drink (but stay sober), then attempt to illegally gain entry to the game by forcing my way in - i'm blame free?

 

noone on either side can be absolved of blame.

 

Apparently they can. No fan was at fault.

 

Don't get me wrong, i'm not defending the police at all. What they did was despicable i just think it's mental to say they were the only ones to blame.

 

Why is it mental?

[johnnypd]

So if i turn up in Brugge, have a wee drink (but stay sober), then attempt to illegally gain entry to the game by forcing my way in - i'm blame free?

 

noone on either side can be absolved of blame.

 

Apparently they can. No fan was at fault.

 

Don't get me wrong, i'm not defending the police at all. What they did was despicable i just think it's mental to say they were the only ones to blame.

 

well that's what I thought as well but it turns out the whole thing about there being ticketless fans forcing their way in is actually a myth.

 

there's a point to be said that the whole atmosphere of hooliganism and the culture amongst a sizeable minority of fans back then certainly contributed to the disaster. but to apportion specific blame to this set of LFC fans for doing something wrong doesn't seem to stand up to scrutiny.

[Mick]

The worst thing for me isn't what happened, it was an accident and they do happen.  Somebody made a decision to open the exit gate and allow thousands into the ground in a short space of time but they did that because people were getting crushed and they tried to prevent that.  For me the cover up is a disgrace because that's been done wilfully and it's been done to try and blame innocent people for what happened.

 

I've just watched a documentary about Hillsborough and it was chilling watching it as I've almost been crushed a few times.  The worst was at St James' when I was queuing up for FA Cup tickets in 1974.  We queued up all night on Barrack Road and were getting crushed up against the gates at the corner of the Leazes/West Stand and I was off my feet and was carried from the gates to the turnstiles because we had to go through turnstiles to get tickets as if we were paying into a match.  We went through the turnstiles and straight out of the exit gates.

 

I also remember going to Sheff Wed and they didn’t open the end which was in the left corner of Leppings Lane and the crush in the middle was awful and at times we couldn’t move unless the whole crowd moved because we couldn’t touch the ground.  Even when we came out after the match we had problems because the exits were kept shut and people were pushing to get out and the police had to get on top of the turnstiles and they were dragging injured fans onto the turnstiles because they had been crushed and had passed out.

 

Coming out of Anfield was also a problem because we came out at the top of the stand and through a small exit which was at a canny height and the railings around the steps were at waist heing and they kept the exits locked so we couldn't get down the stairs and everybody behind was pushing to get out and we couldn't move.  I was amazed that nobody went over the top or that the wooden railings had never snapped.

 

I mentioned a couple of days ago about the Notts Forrest Cup game.  We had no option but to get onto the pitch but we were lucky that we weren’t fenced in or I’m sure somebody would have died during that game because people at the back kept surging forwards.  Whoever thought up the idea of fencing people in at football grounds should be shot with s*** and they are ultimately to blame for people dying at Hillsborough, not the police who opened gates.

 

 

[Wullie]

The drunk ticketless fans angle was cooked up at a Police Federation meeting days after the disaster in an attempt to get the police story straight.