AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Santon ends up being the winger and the full back when he's partnering Jonas. Santon has been a poor defensive fullback a lot this season. If anything Jonas does his job for him. Don't remember the last solid defensive performance from Santon without Jonas. I think he was saying that Santon has to attack constantly because Jonas offers so little going forward. It's a delicate balance with Santon and Jonas... Jonas does offer some protection but would Santon be able to defend more if a more attacking player was in front of him? I don't really know the answer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATB Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Jonas is so overrate by many NUFC supporters. To try and get a more balanced picture about things I always try to ask myself "if he played for another club what would I think then?" in this case I would say that he is not good enough. Anyway, this whole "he´s a good cover defensively" thing that seems to be the topic now in the discussion is something I can agree with a bit. I agree with it that it´s what he´s best at. But at the same time I think that he hasn´t been that effective at that of late. Take the last game. The wings was so open and Jonas were no where to be seen. In this case though I think we could always say it´s Pardews fault. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Every game he looks physically wrecked by about 65 minutes, he could definitely do with a week or two out of the team for that reason amongst others. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 For all his "defensive work rate", he is so bloody clumsy when tackling that he's always liable to give away a free kick, which IMO negates the point in having him on the pitch, despite his work rate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Can't cross, pass, shoot or run. Mick's right, how bad could he be? He can cross, he can pass, he can shoot and he can run. He's going through a bad patch and he'll come through it. I don't think any of our players have played in as many different positions as Jonas has for us and I'm not surprised that his game has suffered for it. He puts loads of effort into games, even when things aren't going well for him. His crossing is not great, but it's improved 100% since the early days. I've said this a few times in this thread already, we've got to the stage where we've outgrown Jonas now. He should be replaced by a player who can provide quality service, but the players who can do that such as Marveaux don't put in anything like as much graft, or help out when we haven't got the ball. That's why Jonas is still going to be a vital member of the squad for at least this season. There will be times when we need those qualities. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Santon ends up being the winger and the full back when he's partnering Jonas. Santon has been a poor defensive fullback a lot this season. If anything Jonas does his job for him. Don't remember the last solid defensive performance from Santon without Jonas. I think he was saying that Santon has to attack constantly because Jonas offers so little going forward. It's a delicate balance with Santon and Jonas... Jonas does offer some protection but would Santon be able to defend more if a more attacking player was in front of him? I don't really know the answer. Well he was piss poor defensively without Jonas so the answer is probably no. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Can't cross, pass, shoot or run. Mick's right, how bad could he be? He can cross, he can pass, he can shoot and he can run. He's going through a bad patch and he'll come through it. I don't think any of our players have played in as many different positions as Jonas has for us and I'm not surprised that his game has suffered for it. He puts loads of effort into games, even when things aren't going well for him. :lol: :lol: Probably the funniest thing i've read on the internet this decade. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 The fact we had Jonas in there - incapable of holding the ball or retaining possession in any way - was one of the direct reasons for why he was useful once or twice in absolutely desperate situations in our own box. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 The fact we had Jonas in there - incapable of holding the ball or retaining possession in any way - was one of the direct reasons for why he was useful once or twice in absolutely desperate situations in our own box. Is the truth. He benefits from his own ineptitude, much like Alan Smith did at times. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Can't cross, pass, shoot or run. Mick's right, how bad could he be? He can cross, he can pass, he can shoot and he can run. He's going through a bad patch and he'll come through it. I don't think any of our players have played in as many different positions as Jonas has for us and I'm not surprised that his game has suffered for it. He puts loads of effort into games, even when things aren't going well for him. His crossing is not great, but it's improved 100% since the early days. I've said this a few times in this thread already, we've got to the stage where we've outgrown Jonas now. He should be replaced by a player who can provide quality service, but the players who can do that such as Marveaux don't put in anything like as much graft, or help out when we haven't got the ball. That's why Jonas is still going to be a vital member of the squad for at least this season. There will be times when we need those qualities. Jonas wouldn't be in my first 11, at the minute he isn't keeping anybody better out of the team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikon Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Anita is better, rather play him in the position that Jonas played against Villa. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eliassenfredrik Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Anita is better, rather play him in the position that Jonas played against Villa. Of course he is. It's all about having players in the team able to keep possession, especially under pressure, which is inevitable against teams like Chelsea. I can live with Taylor playing although I want MYM in the team asap (I'm guessing he wanted to start games when he signed). I thought Taylor was decent vs Villa. However the same can't be said about Jonas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulivye Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 don't know how reliable squawka is but their calculations say Jonas had a stinker: http://www.squawka.com/players/jonas-gutierrez Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 don't know how reliable squawka is but their calculations say Jonas had a stinker: http://www.squawka.com/players/jonas-gutierrez Don't need stats to tell you that tbf, i like him and would like to see him used in a Park Ji Sung role off the bench to see out games. There's just too many options that are better than him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Every game he looks physically wrecked by about 65 minutes, he could definitely do with a week or two out of the team for that reason amongst others. Definitely. He still has a role to play at the club for sure. For me he is only to be played in the midfield 'water-carrier' role or if we need a heavily defensive winger. Needs a rest though that is for sure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Didn't he have a week or 2 out between xmas and new year with his injury though? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Doesn't even look 80% fit to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikon Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 People talk about him and that he needs a rest? For how long? A year or what? He's had decent rest time imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 People talk about him and that he needs a rest? For how long? A year or what? He's had decent rest time imo. Every excuse under the sun has been made about him. I know he's a fantastic guy but it amazes me how much he gets away with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 People talk about him and that he needs a rest? For how long? A year or what? He's had decent rest time imo. Every excuse under the sun has been made about him. I know he's a fantastic guy but it amazes me how much he gets away with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudil Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Anita is better, rather play him in the position that Jonas played against Villa. Anita plays more centrally, Jonas is more like protection for the left back. No doubt that Anita's a better player but is it even the same position? Hard to tell with Pardew's formations tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest palnese Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Anita would do a better job than Jonas out wide, that's for sure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikon Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Anita is better, rather play him in the position that Jonas played against Villa. Anita plays more centrally, Jonas is more like protection for the left back. No doubt that Anita's a better player but is it even the same position? Hard to tell with Pardew's formations tbh. Yes, Anita is normally a central player. But he's capable of playing wide as he's got decent pace (has played decently at RB) He's not a natural goal scorer by any means, and neither is Jonas, and i have more faith in his final ball compared to Jonas. At least he's good when it comes to possession, doesn't slow the play down or lose the ball as often as Jonas. No brainer for me between these two, no matter what position. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Anita would do a better job than Jonas out wide, that's for sure. Wide right, maybe, not so sure about on the left. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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