Interpolic Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Maybe so, but that's football. Even the very best teams/managers don't win all the time. We don't have a very good manager, we have an average (at best) manager who I think is getting the best results from the team but not the best performances and I base that on our season so far, not on today. Even now though I think we're close to not getting the points expected because our poor performances are now affecting our points haul in a way that performances were being over shadowed before the New Year. I would go as far as saying we've done nothing of note since the first week in January and even then the performances were far too erratic. So what do you propose we do, re-appoint Kinnear or Shearer? Do you honestly think any manager worth his salt would come and work here for buttons and under the financial restrictions? Regardless of Pardew's shortcomings, we are well and truly punching above our weight this season, and he should be given a lot of credit imho. I'm not sure if we are, my mate asked me the other day how many players I'd take from the Arsenal squad for our first team and the answer was not many. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistle17 Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 In our last 5 league games (QPR, Fulham, Blackburn, Villa, Spurs) before today I cannot recall a single convincing performance. Our form has declined sharply since that Man Utd win. Despite it being a win that Blackburn game was absolutely horrendous- possibly one of the worst showings I've ever witnessed from us, whilst the Spurs game was just a whimper of a 'performance'. Results are starting to become worryingly inconsistent and Pardew must arrest this problem starting with next week. His team selections and tactical (or lack of) interventions during games are nothing short of mediocre, imo. Thankfully we've had such a good season up until now so we don't have to be looking over our shoulders, but days like today are infuriating and totally unacceptable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 In our last 5 league games (QPR, Fulham, Blackburn, Villa, Spurs) before today I cannot recall a single convincing performance. Our form has declined sharply since that Man Utd win. Despite it being a win that Blackburn game was absolutely horrendous- possibly one of the worst showings I've ever witnessed from us, whilst the Spurs game was just a whimper of a 'performance'. Results are starting to become worryingly inconsistent and Pardew must arrest this problem starting with next week. His team selections and tactical (or lack of) interventions during games are nothing short of mediocre, imo. Thankfully we've had such a good season up until now so we don't have to be looking over our shoulders, but days like today are infuriating and totally unacceptable. todays team selection, while not what i'd have picked was enough to beat wolves. the tactics of containment and hit on the break were crap. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughesy Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 I've noticed those that are more critical of Pardew offer good analysis of his faults, the team's etc. and basically debate these things whereas those that defend him have little to say other than we are 6th, we were in the Championship 2 years aho or we have a limited squad. People need to clear their heads of such thoughts and look at our performances, his tactics, the way we play football, our team selections and even his subs. Focus on those things and tell me where he is going right and doing well? What do you expect after a couple of defeats? There are more negatives than positives so those on one side of the argument are inevitably going to have more strings to their arguments. If we'd come in off the back of a 4-0 win today, those defending Pardew would have more than "Well we're sixth" "Poor squad" etc. We could look at the CC normal time and FA Cup game against Blackburn, 2-2 against Spurs etc. as signs of our grit and determination as a team (we're performing with a never-say-die attitude at times), the 3-0 against Man U to show that narrow, direct tactics can result in a good performance/result, the 3-1 against Stoke to show how our rigid, organised, counter attacking football can really damage a team, Blackburn and Villa wins in recent weeks to show that we can grind out a result even whilst under pressure. The thought that we've chanced our way to 6th and the majority of our play this season has been poor is ludicrous. You can't get to challenging in the top 6 on luck alone, and in spite of the manager. It just doesn't happen. We've been very poor in recent weeks, and the football isn't great, but that doesn't negate the whole season. Excellent post - I would add that it is much easier it is to be critical of something and point out negatives than it is to point out positives. There are a whole host of things that we do well and that are positive about Pardew's management - many of which you have pointed out. Who genuinely would have thought that a team including Perch, Simpson, williamson, Shola, Best etc could be 6th? There certainly weren't many on here willing to stick their neck on the line at the beginning of the season. There is no way that our squad is currently a top 6 squad and if we manage to get into the top 6 come May a huge amount of credit has to go to Pardew. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 alan, are we going to commit anyone forward from midfield ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 "I'm not overly disappointed, it was a marked improvement on Spurs". I was at Spurs, it was fucking humiliating and like everyone else I've been dying for us to put it right for 2 weeks, today wasn't exactly what I had in mind. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 So what do you propose we do, re-appoint Kinnear or Shearer? Do you honestly think any manager worth his salt would come and work here for buttons and under the financial restrictions? Regardless of Pardew's shortcomings, we are well and truly punching above our weight this season, and he should be given a lot of credit imho. The bit in bold, yes, that's exactly what I'd do. All managers are going to be working under the sort of conditions Pardew is working under and we have a lot more going for us than most clubs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.S.R. Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Piss boiling listening to Pardew say he wasn't disappointed, like he's a powerless spectator on events. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 I'm starting to wonder whether I'm being totally ungrateful and that he's got us to this point, or whether we'd be doing even better with the team that we have, with a manager that plays to their strengths. I never thought that Pardew was a manager that concentrated more on being scared than scaring, but I'm starting to now. Don't get me wrong, I think replacing him is completely out of the question. I want progress, but I also want stability. Ideally I want both and eventually one will fall by the wayside if I don't see us playing to our full potential. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 It's mystifying that Ryan Taylor's never been able to hold down a first team place in the whole time he's been with us, yet we're in the position at the minute where he's first choice when we arguably have better options in his position(s) than we ever have. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 "I'm not overly disappointed, it was a marked improvement on Spurs". I was at Spurs, it was f***ing humiliating and like everyone else I've been dying for us to put it right for 2 weeks, today wasn't exactly what I had in mind. Technically it was an improvement though Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishmael Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Losing 1-5 would be an improvement. Not enough Alan, not enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 "I'm not overly disappointed, it was a marked improvement on Spurs". I was at Spurs, it was f***ing humiliating and like everyone else I've been dying for us to put it right for 2 weeks, today wasn't exactly what I had in mind. Technically it was an improvement though not so sure it was, i think spurs could've put five past us today with that performance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlito Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 I'm starting to wonder whether I'm being totally ungrateful and that he's got us to this point, or whether we'd be doing even better with the team that we have, with a manager that plays to their strengths. I never thought that Pardew was a manager that concentrated more on being scared than scaring, but I'm starting to now. Don't get me wrong, I think replacing him is completely out of the question. I want progress, but I also want stability. Ideally I want both and eventually one will fall by the wayside if I don't see us playing to our full potential. Exactly this. I actually think at times, we may have gotten to the same point we're at now with Hughton, who on most days gave us better football. With the players we have available we should be trying to play better football, and using our best players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishmael Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 You can be both very grateful for the job Pardew has done thus far and very annoyed that he isn't improving... It's easy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistle17 Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 In our last 5 league games (QPR, Fulham, Blackburn, Villa, Spurs) before today I cannot recall a single convincing performance. Our form has declined sharply since that Man Utd win. Despite it being a win that Blackburn game was absolutely horrendous- possibly one of the worst showings I've ever witnessed from us, whilst the Spurs game was just a whimper of a 'performance'. Results are starting to become worryingly inconsistent and Pardew must arrest this problem starting with next week. His team selections and tactical (or lack of) interventions during games are nothing short of mediocre, imo. Thankfully we've had such a good season up until now so we don't have to be looking over our shoulders, but days like today are infuriating and totally unacceptable. todays team selection, while not what i'd have picked was enough to beat wolves. the tactics of containment and hit on the break were crap. I totally agree, but why when the game was pegged back to 2-2 were we playing with only one striker up front for 10-15mins? Ridiculous. And why is it that from the start of the 2nd half we played a very deep line when Wolves had little pace to get in behind us? We should have come out with a well focused mentality and look to finish the game off! Whether all of that is down to Pardew or not is debatable, but he should be playing a major role in that. And why Ben Arfa was only given 15 minutes is just something I cant even fathom... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Lose to Sunderland and it's the beginning of the end for him. No point doing all this good work off the pitch if on matchday we cannot perform. Surely Ashley won't tolerate it, he hasn't before, this is his team and like us will see there is so much more inn the tank Pardew isn't finding. Craic on and be happy with a 2-2 draw against wolves at home Alan, you won't be here this time next year. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishmael Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Wouldn't go that far Toon's Taylor... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 It's mystifying that Ryan Taylor's never been able to hold down a first team place in the whole time he's been with us, yet we're in the position at the minute where he's first choice when we arguably have better options in his position(s) than we ever have. We have better players for a different type of football. Like I said in the HBA thread, in Pardew's world Ryan Taylor is probably a better fit for the football he understands. Hard, competitive and direct with no nonsense. As we saw today though, even the shittest teams can compete with us on those terms as it's what they are based on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 You can be both very grateful for the job Pardew has done thus far and very annoyed that he isn't improving... It's easy. Incorrect! You must be either Pardew's biggest fan (WE'RE SIXTH) or want him sacked immediately. Pick a side. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Wouldn't go that far Toon's Taylor... Put a fork in him, he's done for me like. End of the season would be perfect. We know when a player isn't good enough or when a player has topped out his potential and Pardew for me is in that boat. He's done his job, he won't take us further and is holding us back. We've got 8-9 players who are top class, best we've had in ages and he had 7-8 of them available today and he made us look like a conference team on a bad run of form. I've found myself be surprisingly supportive of him, but have recently been quietly disappointed with his inability on match days but today really is the match that's got me pissed off to the point of I've lost faith, and he's lost my support. I know I'll get it's too soon, I also know everyone will be saying the same thing in time, it's inevitable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexf Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 You can be both very grateful for the job Pardew has done thus far and very annoyed that he isn't improving... It's easy. Incorrect! You must be either Pardew's biggest fan (WE'RE SIXTH) or want him sacked immediately. Pick a side. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 I wouldn't be surprised if Ashley and Llambias see our current position as being our level and do something at the end of the season if we finish too much lower than where we are now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexf Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 But then again he did sign a 5 and 1/2 year contract and falls in line with every decision they make, never kicking up a fuss. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughesy Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 You can be both very grateful for the job Pardew has done thus far and very annoyed that he isn't improving... It's easy. Incorrect! You must be either Pardew's biggest fan (WE'RE SIXTH) or want him sacked immediately. Pick a side. What is ridiculous is that it feels like it has degenerated into exactly that type of argument as each 'side' gets more and more entrenched in its views. I am 'pro-Pardew' but can see he isn't perfect and has his flaws. Without getting into a playground style argument, i think that the 'pro Pardew' element on this forum are the same - they recognise that he makes mistakes, but can take a more objective look at what he has achieved and the circumstances in which he has achieved it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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