Guest bimpy474 Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 I think he is playing how he wanted to all along, he tinkerded with it at Fulham, the first half was brilliant but that second half scared him i think. We signed Cisse, Pards persisted with 4-4-2 and when we had the poor run, 5-0 the Spuds, losing to Arsenal, he also realised when you want to tighten up a game and go 4-5-1, he had to drop either Ba or Cisse. I reckon he thought right seeing as Ben Arfa has got the message about workrate i'm going to give the 4-3-3 another go, best of both worlds fluent 4-3-3 going forward and 4-5-1 when defending. Thank feck he did, love it me like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 There is no 'old' Pardew, isn't it possible he has more flexibility and ability to learn/adapt than you gave him credit for? That is one thing that annoys me, it almost seems like a criticism or at least a patronising pat of the back that our performances have gotten better (despite us doing well all season) 'Well at least he has finally seen the light..'. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 HTT has got it massively wrong with Pards! His justifications whilst intelligent, lack a complete understanding of APs man management and player development I think you are reading way too much into this man management and player development thing. If I were to understand AP's man management and player development plans I'd conclude that for the best part of a season he has denied us Ben Arfa based on some bull shit work ethic issue or easing in issue when the player himself has shown whenever selected he works has hard as anyone and that there has never been a need to ease such a player in. For all we know, this leaving out of Ben Arfa could have cost us the points that would have seen us securing a CL spot many many matches ago. Likewise perhaps Pardew was right and his man management and develment of Ben Arfa was all deliberate to get us pushing for that CL spot... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 There is no 'old' Pardew, isn't it possible he has more flexibility and ability to learn/adapt than you gave him credit for? That is one thing that annoys me, it almost seems like a criticism or at least a patronising pat of the back that our performances have gotten better (despite us doing well all season) 'Well at least he has finally seen the light..'. Throughout these debates you more than most seem to have been incapable of seperating performances from results and as such you make youself look silly at times with some of your comments. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 HTT has got it massively wrong with Pards! His justifications whilst intelligent, lack a complete understanding of APs man management and player development I think you are reading way too much into this man management and player development thing. If I were to understand AP's man management and player development plans I'd conclude that for the best part of a season he has denied us Ben Arfa based on some bull shit work ethic issue or easing in issue when the player himself has shown whenever selected he works has hard as anyone and that there has never been a need to ease such a player in. For all we know, this leaving out of Ben Arfa could have cost us the points that would have seen us securing a CL spot many many matches ago. Likewise perhaps Pardew was right and his man management and develment of Ben Arfa was all deliberate to get us pushing for that CL spot... Pull that head out of your arse, that sentence is spot on and if you are still doubting it go see a hooker and get a gobble, you need one. On the other hand you maybe right all along Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 There is no 'old' Pardew, isn't it possible he has more flexibility and ability to learn/adapt than you gave him credit for? That is one thing that annoys me, it almost seems like a criticism or at least a patronising pat of the back that our performances have gotten better (despite us doing well all season) 'Well at least he has finally seen the light..'. Without doubt, he's been superb. Ground it out when he's had to and when everyone has been completely fit and he's had the full "First 11" he's gone for it. Regardless what some people say/think it's mad to say that Barfa could have started the full season, think Pards patience and discipline is paying dividends now. Genuinely mad season, was baffled/furious when we appointed him, but by luck or design we seem to have found our perfect manager. He has the swagger and ego you need to manage this club, but also the discipline and defensive mindedness to really make our 4 - 3 - 3 work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 HTT has got it massively wrong with Pards! His justifications whilst intelligent, lack a complete understanding of APs man management and player development I think you are reading way too much into this man management and player development thing. If I were to understand AP's man management and player development plans I'd conclude that for the best part of a season he has denied us Ben Arfa based on some bull s*** work ethic issue or easing in issue when the player himself has shown whenever selected he works has hard as anyone and that there has never been a need to ease such a player in. For all we know, this leaving out of Ben Arfa could have cost us the points that would have seen us securing a CL spot many many matches ago. Likewise perhaps Pardew was right and his man management and develment of Ben Arfa was all deliberate to get us pushing for that CL spot... Pull that head out of your arse, that sentence is spot on and if you are still doubting it go see a hooker and get a gobble, you need one. On the other hand you maybe right all along That as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
morpeth mag Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Happy to have a lucky manager if thats how he stumbled on the present formation. Personally think he got here by design but think its fair to say we could have reached the present formation and players sooner. I think we had such a good start in terms of results that it was too easy to stick with the early season formula. We tried the 433 pre Xmas but the signing of Cisse, the realisation that HBA has to play and the move of Jonas to a central holding player has only really happened these last six games. Additionally Cabaye looks at home in a midfield three though I think he could player deeper or in the role he played against Stoke. Santon has also looked stronger recently. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawK Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Had Pardew continued to put out teams set up to perform like Wolves at home he'd be under extreme pressure, but he changed it and we've performed much better. You can only talking about what you see, Pardew was getting it wrong and showed no sign of changing things then boom, he did. Its great news and its give us a great end to the season, but to say HTT was wrong is nonsense, plenty of people on here were very worried where we were heading, whether they said owt or not is a different matter. I personally thought he was blowing it and was fuming. One concern i have left is that he reverts back to old at the start of the season, trying to protect points etc...if that doesnt happen and we see what were seeing now its only going to get better with better players coming in. This right here, gentlemen. I did not see it coming at all, I can't think of any logical reason that suggested it would come, nor was one suggested by any poster on this board. Negative tactics were accompanied by cries of "you idiot, how can you pass it from the back with simpson, willo and Krul in the team/ Cabaye is in terrible form" ect. Pardew's change of mentality also exactly coincides with Ben Arfa forcing himself into the team. Now try to remember objectively, Ben Arfa was not eased into the team or anything like that, he was thrown on as a wildcard, an "oh-s***!" button. And he preformed so well in those cameos that he simple could not be dropped from the team (fan pressure being a factor too). I'm not taking anything away from Pardew he's done unbelievably well. And I almost regret typing this already as this can of worms is in the past. But people gloating ' i woz right bout somethin' , 'will you admit you was wrong' is really irritating. But you're wrong. There were people that took in past form and what Pardew had said through his time here, his general interviews, his use of players, his explanations when we played badly and his admittances when things didn't go to plan and came to a different conclusion. Buy into what we felt he was aiming for, and the way he ideally would have us play. Sometime that faith looked shaky at best, but I thought that there was very little to suggest he was a negative manager, or married to the concept of 'hoofball' that some here kept banging on about. There will be many many more games where we f*** up, set up wrongly, or end up lumping it forward. I just hope the current form makes the likes of HTT hesitate from jumping off the deep end again when we hit a bad patch. I fear it wont. /Christ, it wasn't that many weeks ago he was still calling for Pardew to be replaced sooner rather than later. /But then, it wasn't many moons ago, he was fighting Allardyces corner, or siding with Souness over Bellamy and Robert iirc... Revisionist to the extreme, did you watch ANY of the games where he was accused of this? There was open conflict on the pitch as Demba Ba was arguing with Coloccini for Krul to stop punting it up the pitch every time he got it in at least 1 game that I saw. Krul, and Colo, to their credit, kept on doing what they were told to do by their manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sicko2ndbest Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 HTT has got it massively wrong with Pards! His justifications whilst intelligent, lack a complete understanding of APs man management and player development I think you are reading way too much into this man management and player development thing. If I were to understand AP's man management and player development plans I'd conclude that for the best part of a season he has denied us Ben Arfa based on some bull s*** work ethic issue or easing in issue when the player himself has shown whenever selected he works has hard as anyone and that there has never been a need to ease such a player in. For all we know, this leaving out of Ben Arfa could have cost us the points that would have seen us securing a CL spot many many matches ago. Likewise perhaps Pardew was right and his man management and develment of Ben Arfa was all deliberate to get us pushing for that CL spot... Pull that head out of your arse, that sentence is spot on and if you are still doubting it go see a hooker and get a gobble, you need one. On the other hand you maybe right all along I think he's win win tbh If we get CL the guys a fucking genius If we finish 6th the guys a hell of a manager Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudil Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 But you're wrong. There were people that took in past form and what Pardew had said through his time here, his general interviews, his use of players, his explanations when we played badly and his admittances when things didn't go to plan and came to a different conclusion. Buy into what we felt he was aiming for, and the way he ideally would have us play. Sometime that faith looked shaky at best, but I thought that there was very little to suggest he was a negative manager, or married to the concept of 'hoofball' that some here kept banging on about. There will be many many more games where we f*** up, set up wrongly, or end up lumping it forward. I just hope the current form makes the likes of HTT hesitate from jumping off the deep end again when we hit a bad patch. I fear it wont. /Christ, it wasn't that many weeks ago he was still calling for Pardew to be replaced sooner rather than later. /But then, it wasn't many moons ago, he was fighting Allardyces corner, or siding with Souness over Bellamy and Robert iirc... I'm wrong about what exactly? You certinly won't see me jumping on Pardews back if things go a bit sour, I always said if he gave me signs I would be all over them. You have to remember, the crux of the problem was that we were playing a style of football that did not suit our players. This is what I criticized Pardew for. His past record suggests a lot of hoof-ball and many pundits and the like allluded to the fact that he always said he plays attractive football, while doing close to the opposite[this obviously set some alarm bells ringing]. I did not see his change in mentality coming, and I don't think these was anything tangible to suggest it would. I fully admit I was wrong in relation to the fact that I did not think Pardew could change his mentality/approach. People were making excuses like blaming individual players, not suggesting it(the negative approach) was part of some plan. Anyway I don't care anymore, I think Pards may have seen the light There were people that took in past form and what Pardew had said through his time here, his general interviews, his use of players, his explanations when we played badly and his admittances when things didn't go to plan and came to a different conclusion. This is just a load of nothing btw Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 There is no 'old' Pardew, isn't it possible he has more flexibility and ability to learn/adapt than you gave him credit for? That is one thing that annoys me, it almost seems like a criticism or at least a patronising pat of the back that our performances have gotten better (despite us doing well all season) 'Well at least he has finally seen the light..'. Throughout these debates you more than most seem to have been incapable of seperating performances from results and as such you make youself look silly at times with some of your comments. At least its only some of my comments. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughesy Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Had Pardew continued to put out teams set up to perform like Wolves at home he'd be under extreme pressure, but he changed it and we've performed much better. You can only talking about what you see, Pardew was getting it wrong and showed no sign of changing things then boom, he did. Its great news and its give us a great end to the season, but to say HTT was wrong is nonsense, plenty of people on here were very worried where we were heading, whether they said owt or not is a different matter. I personally thought he was blowing it and was fuming. One concern i have left is that he reverts back to old at the start of the season, trying to protect points etc...if that doesnt happen and we see what were seeing now its only going to get better with better players coming in. This right here, gentlemen. I did not see it coming at all, I can't think of any logical reason that suggested it would come, nor was one suggested by any poster on this board. Negative tactics were accompanied by cries of "you idiot, how can you pass it from the back with simpson, willo and Krul in the team/ Cabaye is in terrible form" ect. Pardew's change of mentality also exactly coincides with Ben Arfa forcing himself into the team. Now try to remember objectively, Ben Arfa was not eased into the team or anything like that, he was thrown on as a wildcard, an "oh-s***!" button. And he preformed so well in those cameos that he simple could not be dropped from the team (fan pressure being a factor too). I'm not taking anything away from Pardew he's done unbelievably well. And I almost regret typing this already as this can of worms is in the past. But people gloating ' i woz right bout somethin' , 'will you admit you was wrong' is really irritating. But you're wrong. There were people that took in past form and what Pardew had said through his time here, his general interviews, his use of players, his explanations when we played badly and his admittances when things didn't go to plan and came to a different conclusion. Buy into what we felt he was aiming for, and the way he ideally would have us play. Sometime that faith looked shaky at best, but I thought that there was very little to suggest he was a negative manager, or married to the concept of 'hoofball' that some here kept banging on about. There will be many many more games where we f*** up, set up wrongly, or end up lumping it forward. I just hope the current form makes the likes of HTT hesitate from jumping off the deep end again when we hit a bad patch. I fear it wont. /Christ, it wasn't that many weeks ago he was still calling for Pardew to be replaced sooner rather than later. /But then, it wasn't many moons ago, he was fighting Allardyces corner, or siding with Souness over Bellamy and Robert iirc... Revisionist to the extreme, did you watch ANY of the games where he was accused of this? There was open conflict on the pitch as Demba Ba was arguing with Coloccini for Krul to stop punting it up the pitch every time he got it in at least 1 game that I saw. Krul, and Colo, to their credit, kept on doing what they were told to do by their manager. When did these arguments happen??? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannybagoftudor Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 I reckon his first priority was getting us safe - once we had 40+ points he relaxed and it is evident in the last 6 games - he has given players their heads and wow. Good luck to him - I think he is a keeper. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 I reckon his first priority was getting us safe - once we had 40+ points he relaxed and it is evident in the last 6 games - he has given players their heads and wow. Good luck to him - I think he is a keeper. Not tall enough to be a keeper. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan_Taylor Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Manager of the season Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormy Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Manager of the season Nah. Redknapp. Kept the pace with those Top Four bullies bar the late slip up, but the determination was admirable. Or Wenger for answering those pesky critics wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Rodgers for not getting relegated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 MON for me like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormy Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Rodgers for not getting relegated. Lambert for not getting relegated nearly as well. MON for me like. PL title winner of the half-season tbf, has to get a look-in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Rodgers for not getting relegated. Lambert for not getting relegated nearly as well. MON for me like. PL title winner of the half-season tbf, has to get a look-in. Scruffbag of the half a season, he has a chance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
looneytoon Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Kenny for winning the Vimto Cup with only a paucity of funds. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Kenny for winning the Vimto Cup with only a paucity of funds. Kenny deserves it just for that shirt deal Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayson Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 There is no 'old' Pardew, isn't it possible he has more flexibility and ability to learn/adapt than you gave him credit for? That is one thing that annoys me, it almost seems like a criticism or at least a patronising pat of the back that our performances have gotten better (despite us doing well all season) 'Well at least he has finally seen the light..'. This is whats laughable about it. Its no new thing, this isnt the first time Gutierrez has been played centrally this season. Best was tried in Ba's current position. We played defensively largely to cover our weakest point (defence) after Saylor was injured as Ba was doing the business upfront and the combination of that was producing results. As soon as he left for ACON Pards changed it we went more attacking against Fulham specifically because we didnt have someone to rely on to score individually so had to change overall mentality. The signs of Pardew being flexible to approaches was always there. Realistically many just didnt see it & now are making excuses for that tbh. There were two POV in regards to Pards a couple months ago & one of them has largely been proven right at this point. Simple as for me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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