Yohan Cabaye

[mrmojorisin75]

Ashley could turn up in the middle of the night with JFK and spit roast your Mrs and you'd come on here to say it could've been worse, Llambias could've been there too.

 

:lol:

[arnonel]

@MsiDouglas: @Neilfarrington Was told they'd take about £17m in summer - so £2m Jan premium? Welcome to NUFC negotiations under Kinnear

 

 

Couldnt he buy out his contract at some point in the summer?

[KDT]

@MsiDouglas: @Neilfarrington Was told they'd take about £17m in summer - so £2m Jan premium? Welcome to NUFC negotiations under Kinnear

 

 

Couldnt he buy out his contract at some point in the summer?

 

There's a load of players who could do that every summer. You very rarely hear about a player doing it though.

[mattypnufc]

Not going to believe anything the local press say to be honest...they know about as much as me and you.

[Nobody]

@MsiDouglas: @Neilfarrington Was told they'd take about £17m in summer - so £2m Jan premium? Welcome to NUFC negotiations under Kinnear

 

 

Couldnt he buy out his contract at some point in the summer?

No.

[Hanshithispantz]

Jonas is the only player I can ever remember doing it other than Webster himself?

[BottledDog]

@MsiDouglas: @Neilfarrington Was told they'd take about £17m in summer - so £2m Jan premium? Welcome to NUFC negotiations under Kinnear

 

 

Couldnt he buy out his contract at some point in the summer?

 

There's a load of players who could do that every summer. You very rarely hear about a player doing it though.

 

Expensive business. Reckon they've tried, but couldn't get the slider on the Wonga site to go further than £2m.

[The College Dropout]

Not a single top player has bought out his contract. And even players that have, the clubs that sign them tend to be forced to fork over some decent money

[Guest Roger Kint]

Jonas is the only player I can ever remember doing it other than Webster himself?

 

Some Brazilian Metuesulem or whatever his name was. Went to court too and was a big fee as well.

[The College Dropout]

Jonas is the only player I can ever remember doing it other than Webster himself?

We still to pay up too.

[arnonel]

Coolio. Just asking. Didnt know myself and its been brought up before.

 

Even though its difficult, if you take his age, the fact that he would have 1 year on his contract, and an outside chance of buying out his contract.....

All probably factors to reduce his value.

[LRD]

Jonas is the only player I can ever remember doing it other than Webster himself?

 

Some Brazilian Metuesulem or whatever his name was. Went to court too and was a big fee as well.

 

Matuzalem.

 

Not directed at you but wish people would go do some simple googling and realise the bullshite the media were spouting. If it was that easy, Arsenal would have paid less than half the 42m it took to sign Ozil.

[LRD]

Coolio. Just asking. Didnt know myself and its been brought up before.

 

Even though its difficult, if you take his age, the fact that he would have 1 year on his contract, and an outside chance of buying out his contract.....

All probably factors to reduce his value.

 

Cabaye's contract runs til 2016.

[Ste]

It isn't as though Cabaye would have a £5m spare to pay us to buy out his deal.

[Minhosa]

RTG-esque in the way that people seem to think that if you say it enough, eventually it becomes true.

 

Sadly that's the case with a lot of viewpoints.

 

 

 

Maybe we should all come and join you in La La Land with Tinky Winky and Po, eh Ian?

 

Ashley could turn up in the middle of the night with JFK and spit roast your Mrs and you'd come on here to say it could've been worse, Llambias could've been there too.

 

f***ing hell, we get that people have differing views but to take them to the extreme every time just makes you look like you're on a wind up/craving attention.

 

 

It's bordering on mental this like lads... what have I said to make you think I believe everything's great? Or that I love either Ashley or JFK?

 

It's actually like my posts exist in a parallel universe where everybody has a frontal lobotomy before being allowed to read.  Everything that's not an outpouring of hate is put down as 'being in la-la land'. Genuinely worrying that this is how people form opinions.

 

Whatever the scenario, whatever the general temperament and whatever the downside you consistently seek to spin it into a positive Ian.

 

That's great but you're constant desire to turn s*** news, s*** decisions and s*** management into acceptance of our overall position in the big wide world of football is f***ing nauseating.

 

I'm a NUFC fan who wants my team to compete on every single level, who wont accept not trying in cups, who wont accept anything other than maximum effort to achieve the highest place finish possible with the squad available to us and who absolutely detests being told that we can't compete or we can't match other clubs who are 'bigger'.

 

f*** that, what's the point? This is a simple game of best 11 Vs best 11 and with the right set up and application, we can give any team in the world a game.

 

Do you think we were the biggest club in the world when KK arrived the first time? We were on the cusp of extinction and within a few short years we were an absolute powerhouse, all driven along by total commitment and effort from those running the club. I hang on to that feel good factor not because we nearly won a title but because everyone believed that we could achieve great things.

 

Don't make the mistake of thinking football has changed which locks NUFC out. It doesn't. We've changed. We've allowed ourselves to float along to virtual non-existence.

 

I don't ever recall people crying because AC Milan might want one of our stars. I remember laughing at s*** like that because we believed in the bigger picture, in the general direction of the club.

 

I don't see why we can't achieve this now if the current owner applied himself and gave the football club and it's fans something to shout about.

 

You continue to accept the current situation if you wish, but I'll continue to demand better if it's all the same to you.

 

 

The frustrating thing is that we are not even looking for stupid money to be thrown around the place. A lot of us criticised Freddy Shepherd for that. We are looking for decent investment, I wouldn't say Swansea or Soton were throwing money around in the summer but they invested in their squad, ok Swansea have struggled but thats not the point I am making, both teams have spent a decent amount of money to try and push on, it seems that Mike Ashley is happy with status quo as long as the status quo is in the top 10. Modest investment each transfer window could see us competing higher in the table. The league has been so open this season that if we kept Cabaye and added a few more players that we could even have an outside chance of a battle for 4th place.

 

We are in a decent financial position, I like that we are more cautious with our funds these days, however, there is cautious and then there is a complete lack of ambition unfortunately we fall into the latter.

 

Yeah - bang on. I'm certainly not looking for mega money to be spunked for the sake of it but even if there was a game plan, a broad vision of how he intends to run the club with a view to progressing at least we could buy in to it.

 

The problem is, you can't buy in to standing still, hence the lack of communication, commitment or passion from the owner.

 

Mike Ashley is running a business and not a football club. I'm not that interested in supporting a business, I want my football club to compete and at least try to win things. If that's not the point of competitive sport then we might as well all pack up and fuck off.

[Guest Roger Kint]

Jonas is the only player I can ever remember doing it other than Webster himself?

 

Some Brazilian Metuesulem or whatever his name was. Went to court too and was a big fee as well.

 

Matuzalem.

 

Not directed at you but wish people would go do some simple googling and realise the bullshite the media were spouting. If it was that easy, Arsenal would have paid less than half the 42m it took to sign Ozil.

 

Definately my pet hate, such a lazy and incorrect thing to say yet most media are pushing it every day.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Buying out a contract is a moot point really, yes it's difficult but it also rarely gets tested because players usually get their way when they want a move.

[LRD]

CAS curbs perceived 'player power' – the Matuzalem ruling

 

Shepherd & Wedderburn LLP

Kenny Scott

Global

July 3 2009

 

The Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS) last month delivered an important decision on the issue of termination of football players' contracts without just cause. The ruling in the Matuzalem case, is the latest landmark decision regarding buying out contracts and transfers, following in the footsteps of the Bosman and Webster cases.

 

Facts

 

Brazilian Matuzalem signed for Ukrainian side Shakhtar Donetsk in 2004, on a five-year contract running from 1 July 2004 – 1 July 2009. On 2 July 2007, Matuzalem notified Shakhtar in writing that he was unilaterally terminating their contractual relationship with immediate effect. Two days later, Matuzalem signed a three-year contract with Real Zaragoza of Spain, to run until 2010.

 

Shakhtar, who had written to Matuzalem before he signed for Zaragoza indicating that they deemed his contract with Shakhtar was still in force and ordered him to report for pre-season training, initiated proceedings with the FIFA Dispute Resolution Chamber (DRC). Shakhtar sought payment from Matuzalem and Zaragoza jointly and severally of EUR 25m (this being the amount specified as a minimum release fee in Matuzalem's contract). The FIFA DRC awarded Shakhtar EUR 6.8m in November 2007. Both Shakhtar and Matuzalem and Zaragoza appealed to the CAS in March 2008. Matuzalem has since joined Lazio in Italy on loan, with an option to make the transfer permanent.

 

Previous Position – the 'Webster Rule'

 

Before this ruling, the decision in the case involving Scotland international Andy Webster was believed to have shifted the balance of power in football transfers firmly in favour of the player.

 

Essentially Webster was allowed to transfer from Heart of Midlothian to Wigan Athletic by terminating his contract with Hearts and paying a nominal fee, which was simply the residual value of his contract with Hearts i.e. a sum equivalent to his remaining salary. This 'buy-out' could take place without the threat of sporting sanctions after the expiry of the "Protected Period" as is defined in the FIFA Regulations on the Status of Transfers and Players (FIFA Regs). For players who signed the contract in question before reaching the age of 28, this is 3 seasons or 3 years (whichever comes first), and for players who signed the contract after reaching the age of 28 this is 2 seasons or 2 years (whichever comes first).

 

Article 17 of the FIFA Regulations

 

Article 17, entitled 'Consequences of terminating a contract without just cause', had to be amended to reflect the Webster decision.

 

Where the breach takes place within the Protected Period referred to above, then sporting sanctions set down in Article 17 shall be imposed on the guilty party (this can be either a player or a club). Further, sanctions shall be imposed in the case of breach by a player where notice is not given within 15 days of the club's last official match of the season.

 

Where a player subsequently signs for another club after he terminates his existing contract, it is presumed (unless established otherwise) that this club has induced the player to commit the breach. Where a player is required to pay compensation for the breach, the player and his new club shall be jointly and severally liable for payment.

 

The Matuzalem Ruling

 

The CAS raised the amount of compensation ordered by the FIFA DCR to approximately EUR 11.85m plus interest. It was undisputed before the CAS that Matuzalem terminated his contract with Shakhtar unilaterally, prematurely and without just cause. The CAS stressed that:

 

Article 17 does not provide a legal basis for a party to freely terminate an existing contract at any time, prematurely, without just cause; and

even if the termination occurs outwith the Protected Period, this remains a serious violation of the obligation to respect the existing contract.

Compensation was therefore payable in accordance with Article 17 of the FIFA Regs. Matuzalem and Zaragoza argued that it should be EUR 2,363,760 (or in the alternative EUR 3.2m), whereas Shakhtar sought EUR 25m due to the release fee referred to above. They claimed this was a contractually agreed amount by Matuzalem should he leave Shakhtar before the expiry of his contract.

 

The CAS ruled that:

 

the clause Shakhtar sought to rely on could not be said to be addressing a situation of unilateral, premature breach and therefore the factors of Article 17 were applicable in assessing compensation;

it is not possible to evaluate the amount of compensation that will be due in advance – the judging party will have to establish the damage suffered on a case-by-case basis, taking into consideration the circumstances of the individual case, the arguments raised and the evidence produced; the purpose of Article 17 is to reinforce contractual stability; and in determining the compensation, the judging authority should aim at determining an amount that puts the injured party in the position that the same party would have had if the contract was performed properly.

 

The CAS evaluated the amount due to Shakhtar applying the following criteria:

 

the value of the lost services of Matuzalem to Shakhtar;

the amount of salary expenses that Shakhtar did not have to pay to Matuzalem; and

the status and behaviour of the player. Matuzalem left the club just a few weeks before the start of the qualification rounds for the 2007/08 UEFA Champions League, after a season in which he had become Shakhtar captain and been voted player of the year. As a result the CAS awarded an additional amount equal to 6 months of his salary.

The amount of compensation awarded therefore was EUR 11,858,934 plus interest of 5% p.a. from 5 July 2007 until payment. Matuzalem and Zaragoza were held jointly and severally liable for the amount.

 

The decision essentially softens the perceived affect of the Webster ruling and signals a swing back towards football clubs, away from the perceived increase in 'player power'. That said, the decision did not specifically address the issue of buy-out clauses and further litigation in this area is likely. 

 

http://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=fba98d9f-52d1-403a-8b6d-39a356cfec33

[LRD]

Jonas is the only player I can ever remember doing it other than Webster himself?

 

Some Brazilian Metuesulem or whatever his name was. Went to court too and was a big fee as well.

 

Matuzalem.

 

Not directed at you but wish people would go do some simple googling and realise the bullshite the media were spouting. If it was that easy, Arsenal would have paid less than half the 42m it took to sign Ozil.

 

Definately my pet hate, such a lazy and incorrect thing to say yet most media are pushing it every day.

 

All started with that lame Julien Laurens who didn't even get the outdated Webster Ruling right. Rest of the media bought onto it as gospel after that.

[Tisd09]

It'll be interesting to see what happens when Southampton and Swansea are established in the top 6-10, will they spend again to push for the CL?

 

Both teams have increased their expenditure year on year in the Premiership. Swansea sold some of their better players to bigger clubs after the first season but at least re-invested that in the squad. Swansea fans understood the situation they were in, yes they were gutted that better players left but the frustrations were not as bad because of the subsequent expenditure and re-investment.  We have a bigger revenue stream than both Swansea and Southampton and as a team are far more established around Europe than them. Players like Bony and Osvaldo would both improve our team yet we wouldn't have paid the prices that Soton and Swansea have.

 

Evidence does seem to suggest they that do try and better themselves so if it were within their grasp I am sure they would try for a CL push.

 

Is it too much to ask to have a player lined up to replace Cabaye, it's not as if it is an out of the blue sale. I would imagine that many people expected a Cabaye sale, but why can't we show ambition and tell him "give us to the summer, let us sign some players and push for CL, if we don't get it then we'll grant you a transfer if our valuation is met" rather than just accept that everybody has their price. We don't need to be told that, other clubs don't need to be told that. Look at the difference in stances between us and Cabaye as opposed to Liverpool and Suarez or Man Utd and Rooney. Yes they are bigger clubs but the players involved are also bigger. We could have handled this a lot better.

[Guest DebuchyAndTheBeast]

I'm really disappointed but good to see him leave on a high and a very good performance

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Evidence does seem to suggest they that do try and better themselves so if it were within their grasp I am sure they would try for a CL push.

 

What do you mean "within their grasp" though? They've done well so far, nobody could deny that. But would they put themselves into massive debt to go from 10th to 4th? I just think sometimes how brilliant other clubs are is massively exaggerated on here. But meh.

 

Interesting to see if Man Utd or Chelsea manage to get Luke Shaw as well.

[merlin]

Does this now mean Cabs can "come clean" with what went down at the start of the season and Arsenal's bid and Joke's supposed involvement etc?

 

You must be joking - like everyone else that leaves he will be asked to sign some sort of 'confidentiality' agreement in which he guarantees NOT to give confidential info or bad-mouth the club...

He will do that just to get away...

[Guest Roger Kint]

Evidence does seem to suggest they that do try and better themselves so if it were within their grasp I am sure they would try for a CL push.

 

What do you mean "within their grasp" though? They've done well so far, nobody could deny that. But would they put themselves into massive debt to go from 10th to 4th? I just think sometimes how brilliant other clubs are is massively exaggerated on here. But meh.

 

Interesting to see if Man Utd or Chelsea manage to get Luke Shaw as well.

 

Soton have spent about £75m in the last 18 months. How much more to go 5 places more? No chance imo

[colinmk]

Evidence does seem to suggest they that do try and better themselves so if it were within their grasp I am sure they would try for a CL push.

 

What do you mean "within their grasp" though? They've done well so far, nobody could deny that. But would they put themselves into massive debt to go from 10th to 4th? I just think sometimes how brilliant other clubs are is massively exaggerated on here. But meh.

 

Interesting to see if Man Utd or Chelsea manage to get Luke Shaw as well.

 

Not sure why you would compare clubs the size of Swansea and Southampton with a club the size of us?