KaKa Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Not really sure what the alternative with Ba is though? Both he and Cisse just look awful together upfront, and Ba doesn't want to play on the left. Would have been nice if we had perhaps tried a diamond formation with HBA just behind both of them by now (remember Owen behind Martins and Viduka transforming what was similarly a largely dysfunctional team back then?), but our current manager lacks any kind of creativity so that was never going to happen. I can certainly see why people think he ought to go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Flash Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 If the manager can't effectively use players as good as Ba and Cisse then he should be going. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanji Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 I might be wrong but it appears people are actively advocating the sale of the best striker we've had since Shearer. Interesting parallel, Dave. Towards the end, we made the mistake of bending over backwards to please Shearer and paid a heavy price for it. If Ba is unhappy at the club, or he doesn't want to play where the manager thinks is best for the team, then he can take his miserable face somewhere else. One of those catch-22s. He's the best we've had since Big Al, and I don't want to him to leave. But if by the end of all of this, we couldn't pay to retain him; then I guess you blame our inability to pay the wages and you just hope that if he does leave, he goes far away from the Premier League as possible. I'd love to have an answer on how to pay him, keep him happy and also have Cisse here and have them both firing in goals in a fluid dynamic system that gets the best out of both of them and our squad which means wins and a higher position in the table, but we both (all) know the answer to that was that Ba couldn't buy himself a goal in that period last season. Had he scored 1 or 2 of those I don't think we'd be having this discussion if I'm honest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Ba's scoring problems were more to do with luck and missing chances than the fact he was playing wider. If anything he was getting more chances than he is now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanji Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Ba's scoring problems were more to do with luck and missing chances than the fact he was playing wider. If anything he was getting more chances than he is now. Yep, I've been saying that for quite some time. He had some poor luck, bad form, and knackered fitness that all seemed to contribute to this. I still maintain that had he scored a few of those before the slump really kicked in, we'd have probably have had a higher finishing place and/or Cisse wouldn't have scored the same amount, and we'd be playing the 4-3-3 we all loved last season and Ba wouldn't have kicked off about this over the summer. He basically took the easy excuse and blamed the formation, which on paper - sure. But anyone watching these matches could see it was more him than the formation itself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenham Mag Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 I think he'll be off in January. Some newspapers are still convinced he's off to Africa in January. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmonkey Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 I might be wrong but it appears people are actively advocating the sale of the best striker we've had since Shearer. But conversely, if one believes that Ba isn't the best striker we've had since Shearer (in their opinion), does it then become reasonable to advocate selling him? Ba has had one great half-season for us, as has Cisse last season and Carroll previously. I don't think there's much between them (and still consider Cisse to be the better/more talented striker, despite the miserable form), with the only real difference being that Ba has been with us in the Premiership longer (and in a team set up to his strengths). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughesy Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 If the manager can't effectively use players as good as Ba and Cisse then he should be going. That's ridiculous. Some players don't gel well together. That isn't necessarily the manager's fault. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Flash Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 If the manager can't effectively use players as good as Ba and Cisse then he should be going. That's ridiculous. Some players don't gel well together. That isn't necessarily the manager's fault. They were just examples, it's the whole team. He's wasted nearly every player all season and we've seen what a bad manager can do (Dalglish and Souness) to fantastic squads/teams before. It'll be completely unforgivable on his part if some of the better players leave soon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 I really can't see him going to Liverpool as there's no way he'd be guaranteed to be playing centrally there either. I couldn't see Suarez being happy if he had to change the role that he has been playing this season as he's been sensational. Suarez doesn't really play centrally though, even if he's shown there on a piece of paper. He pops up pretty much everywhere and spends the entire game drifting around, particularly to the flanks, and besides Rodgers, for all his flaws, is a manager who knows how to instill positive movement in his players. Him, Ba and Sterling up front would be fantastic, unfortunately. If Ba has rejected our contract offer I think it's time to sell - we should pre-empt any situation arising in the future and be pro-active in buying a replacement instead of waiting around and getting stung late on in the window. who knows we might even get someone who works better alongside Cisse as the partnership has been a real wash out so far. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wally_McFool Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 You would think people would realise that going to Liverpool from us is not a good career move. Alan Kennedy, Terry MacDermott and Peter Beardsley (and even a rejuvenated Jose Enrique) might tell you otherwise Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 I think Ba's an excellent striker, however i don't think his individual ability and "what's best for the team" is adequately balanced. Factor in his poor natural fitness and constant media attention, i don't think it would be the end of the world if he left. It'd be quite tragic in a way because he is such a good player who had a great start... but if he's a disruptive influence and if we can replace him with someone who makes us better as a team, it might be for the best. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 I'm starting to think he's more hassle than he's worth, got a similar feeling with Owen after a year of reading tall tales about where he was off to next. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainhaircut Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 He can't control the ball. Once he learns that he might be worth an increase. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_NUFC Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 He can't control the ball. Once he learns that he might be worth an increase. I can't wait to watch us bring in a replacement who can control all of Williamson's long balls all day long, he better not score from any though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainhaircut Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 He can't control the ball. Once he learns that he might be worth an increase. I can't wait to watch us bring in a replacement who can control all of Williamson's long balls all day long, he better not score from any though. I didn't mention long balls. I'm talking about simple passes into his feet (I acknowledge this is a rarity). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 As well as Carr has done for us if we sell Ba for £7m he will have a hell of a job finding an equal replacement, let's be honest we aren't going to flog him for £7m to spend £15m replacing him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Still dictating where he plays i see. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Still dictating where he plays i see. Our most in form striker playing as a striker, it's literally mental. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Still dictating where he plays i see. Our most in form striker playing as a striker, it's literally mental. He's not really that in form mind. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Still one of the highest scoring forwards in the league and we aren't exactly flush for goalscorers this season Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decky Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 I can see him being used as part of a deal to get Carroll back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Still dictating where he plays i see. Our most in form striker playing as a striker, it's literally mental. One player dictating how the team is set up is mental imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
loki679 Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Still dictating where he plays i see. Our most in form striker playing as a striker, it's literally mental. When putting one player in form (which is debatable anyway, how many in the last eight?) handicaps the rest of the team it is mental. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 I can see him being used as part of a deal to get Carroll back. Seems very feasible. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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