Pav Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 I don't think the motive for seats can be money, you could cram twice as many people in the ground if you let them stand, and only charge maybe 20% less. Have a read of this if you can be bothered, I reckon it gives a perfect account of what's happened since the PL was born http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/david-conn-inside-sport-blog/2011/aug/16/premier-league-football-ticket-prices Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GM Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 I should point out that I wasn't generalising all old people to be boring twats there, for the record. It was a little bit rant-tastic that, but what I'm getting at, is that for anyone to suggest that allocated standing areas should not be created (regardless of whether it's safe standing or in front of a seat) is nothing short of ridiculous. It is a human right to be able to stand, or walk, or jump even, so why should you be forced to sit? The powers that be, have simply pushed for it to become a social norm that you sit at football matches. The main reasoning behind this is Hillsbrough and money. So, other than being able to charge a fortune for a ticket, a one off occurrence which was the result of poor policing/overcrowding and metal fences is all they have to argue with. How many stadiums over the course of a year hold gigs and concerts where people stand at their seats dancing to Bon Jovi or rocking out to a bit of Oasis? It's safe to do so then, and that's people dancing around. So standing cannot be that much of a danger. It's not dangerous in the slightest, so long as it is well managed/policed. Might I add, that I don't think the solution is to stand in front of those who wish to be seated. However, I think it's totally unfair to not feel the slightest bit sympathy to those of us who've been moved 3 or 4 times (possibly more) over the last several seasons. The fans of this club have been treat like s***, and for many throwing the ticket in won't suffice. They want to show their support by being at the ground, and standing next to one another as a group, chanting and singing for their heroes every weekend. It's not like you cannot stream any match you want or watch it on the TV. People go to the match for the atmosphere, yet half the people there complain about those who go all out to create an atmosphere. Whilst I agree there is an element of charver mongs and people with no respect, these tend to be the knackers that help generate the atmosphere. All in all there should be seperate sections for likeminded people, whether it be standing sitting, creating a noise, or sipping tea and biscuits discussing how s*** we are. I know for a fact, I can go to the match and my Dad's mates will tell me about stories being chased by Arsenal at Kings Cross in the 70's and 80's and how the Geordies took whatever end, and how we totally outsung opponents and made amazing atmospheres, and it's what we're world renowned for. Yet there sdoes seem to be a growing minority that seem to think for the youth of today to do it is totally unacceptable. That's what f***s me off. If you want to be entertained f*** off to the cinema in my opinion. Don't know what cinema you go to but you're not supposed to stand up in there either. But I can just imagine him thinking it was great craic to throw popcorn at people from the back whilst talking all the way through the movie. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felling Mag Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hobshobs Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I can pretty much guarantee (?) that 95% of season ticket holders breach at least one of tlhose terms and conditions every single season. I'm on my phone so can't be arsed to type my full opinion out, but what I will say is that this whole debate is just another issue that plays part in destroying the 'beautiful' game. There's too many old, miserable, boring twats these days who forget what it was like to be 21, full of drink with your mates and chanting for your heroes on the terraces. It's fine for them to tell their stories of being chased, etc but now it's totally unacceptable for people to stand and sing. f*** off man. Even if I wanted to, I can't stand up for a whole game. Dodgy legs. So what do I do the next time I'm sat behind a bunch of boring 21-year-old twats, full of drink and with no idea of what it's like to be getting old or have a disability? Few years back at an away game saw an old Geordie, about 65 or 70, get intimidated by a bunch of Stone Island knobheads for having the temerity to suggest they sit down and let him see the game he'd paid to see. They weren't singing or anything either, like, just standing there trying to look hard. Saw exactly the same happen to an old couple at one of the Carlisle away friendlies. In the stand wannabee hard men stood throughout, stewards wanted to avoid any confrontation and the old couple left after about 20 minutes. I keep hearing we have the best support in the land. Believe me we don't. There are an element of total assholes who think they're hard in a crowd. Couldn't give a toss about there own support. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattypnufc Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Assholes? Are you American? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hobshobs Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Assholes? Are you American? Getting shirty online are we? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattypnufc Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Assholes? Are you American? Getting shirty online are we? Nope, just merely asking you internet warrior you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hobshobs Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Assholes? Are you American? Getting shirty online are we? Nope, just merely asking you internet warrior you. Button it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattypnufc Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Assholes? Are you American? Getting shirty online are we? Nope, just merely asking you internet warrior you. Button it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest michaelfoster Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I should point out that I wasn't generalising all old people to be boring twats there, for the record. It was a little bit rant-tastic that, but what I'm getting at, is that for anyone to suggest that allocated standing areas should not be created (regardless of whether it's safe standing or in front of a seat) is nothing short of ridiculous. It is a human right to be able to stand, or walk, or jump even, so why should you be forced to sit? The powers that be, have simply pushed for it to become a social norm that you sit at football matches. The main reasoning behind this is Hillsbrough and money. So, other than being able to charge a fortune for a ticket, a one off occurrence which was the result of poor policing/overcrowding and metal fences is all they have to argue with. How many stadiums over the course of a year hold gigs and concerts where people stand at their seats dancing to Bon Jovi or rocking out to a bit of Oasis? It's safe to do so then, and that's people dancing around. So standing cannot be that much of a danger. It's not dangerous in the slightest, so long as it is well managed/policed. Might I add, that I don't think the solution is to stand in front of those who wish to be seated. However, I think it's totally unfair to not feel the slightest bit sympathy to those of us who've been moved 3 or 4 times (possibly more) over the last several seasons. The fans of this club have been treat like s***, and for many throwing the ticket in won't suffice. They want to show their support by being at the ground, and standing next to one another as a group, chanting and singing for their heroes every weekend. It's not like you cannot stream any match you want or watch it on the TV. People go to the match for the atmosphere, yet half the people there complain about those who go all out to create an atmosphere. Whilst I agree there is an element of charver mongs and people with no respect, these tend to be the knackers that help generate the atmosphere. All in all there should be seperate sections for likeminded people, whether it be standing sitting, creating a noise, or sipping tea and biscuits discussing how s*** we are. I know for a fact, I can go to the match and my Dad's mates will tell me about stories being chased by Arsenal at Kings Cross in the 70's and 80's and how the Geordies took whatever end, and how we totally outsung opponents and made amazing atmospheres, and it's what we're world renowned for. Yet there sdoes seem to be a growing minority that seem to think for the youth of today to do it is totally unacceptable. That's what f***s me off. If you want to be entertained f*** off to the cinema in my opinion. I think its funny how some people think they have the right to stand at the match yet 40,000 + can manage to sit for an hour and a half, plus you know its against ground regulations so its your own fault should you get kicked out because of it. I sympathise that you have been moved from your seat but due to the anti-ashley songs i can see why they have broken up that section, and as the owner he can do whatever he wants (im not saying he is right though) If you want to be entertained than go to the cinema is pretty petty though Heza Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Roger Kint Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 The anti-Ashley stuff isnt the main point of it imo. That was coming from all parts of the ground! The fact is we had to extend the away section thanks to a stupid PL rule, he wanted to extend the family section as well which is a big success. Result? Either put both in separate areas of the ground which for away fans is just logistically daft. As for the family section, a standard ticket in the lower bowl is £560 a seat? Adult plus child working out at £400 for 2 seats? Ashley is a businessman, putting them in cheaper sections rather than lose money make perfect business sense to him. Obviously thats a kick in the teeth for L7 fans forced to move and for more money but you can see the reasons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WashyGeordie Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I came from level 7 and stood/sung up there and everything and I know moving down i had to sit 'cos of others around me/respect, but i don't mind sitting aslong as i can still sing, plus i'm 6ft3 so the leg room is abit naff. Mind, the atmosphere was abit naff aswell, maybe 'cos of the performance but i just hope it improves. The atmosphere was loud before the extension, so with everyone in the same area now you'd of thought it would be just as loud as then, but for some reason or other, it wasn't. However I assume most if they had the choice would obviously sing than stand, but being called 'a c***' etc off your own supporters - just because we got forced down from level 7is too far like. And it's not as if the Gallowgate/SE Corner isn't renowned for singing, because it is, or was. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 The anti-Ashley stuff isnt the main point of it imo. That was coming from all parts of the ground! The fact is we had to extend the away section thanks to a stupid PL rule, he wanted to extend the family section as well which is a big success. Result? Either put both in separate areas of the ground which for away fans is just logistically daft. As for the family section, a standard ticket in the lower bowl is £560 a seat? Adult plus child working out at £400 for 2 seats? Ashley is a businessman, putting them in cheaper sections rather than lose money make perfect business sense to him. Obviously thats a kick in the teeth for L7 fans forced to move and for more money but you can see the reasons. It would make sense if the family enclosure was sold out all the time. More often than not the singing section was totally sold out last year and then the Milburn stand L7 had spaces all around. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistle17 Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I think the corner is ideal, and I'm sure it'll become a success, but if everyone from Level 7 etc moved to the back of the Gallowgate- the lowest proportion of ST holders in the ground there- then there wouldn't be such conflict like we are seeing now. Also the noise would be tremendous if things got going with the low roof. However, it is a big shame to see our own fans divided over this when we're all supposed to be behind the same team here and- if the governing bodies had any sense they would introduce safe standing areas ie the ones Pav has been showing. That's the only way forward imo, I just cant see what is to lose by it. And plus, we have enough morons in our support, like any other club, so we don't need the level headed ones to be at each other. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I should point out that I wasn't generalising all old people to be boring twats there, for the record. It was a little bit rant-tastic that, but what I'm getting at, is that for anyone to suggest that allocated standing areas should not be created (regardless of whether it's safe standing or in front of a seat) is nothing short of ridiculous. It is a human right to be able to stand, or walk, or jump even, so why should you be forced to sit? The powers that be, have simply pushed for it to become a social norm that you sit at football matches. The main reasoning behind this is Hillsbrough and money. So, other than being able to charge a fortune for a ticket, a one off occurrence which was the result of poor policing/overcrowding and metal fences is all they have to argue with. How many stadiums over the course of a year hold gigs and concerts where people stand at their seats dancing to Bon Jovi or rocking out to a bit of Oasis? It's safe to do so then, and that's people dancing around. So standing cannot be that much of a danger. It's not dangerous in the slightest, so long as it is well managed/policed. Might I add, that I don't think the solution is to stand in front of those who wish to be seated. However, I think it's totally unfair to not feel the slightest bit sympathy to those of us who've been moved 3 or 4 times (possibly more) over the last several seasons. The fans of this club have been treat like s***, and for many throwing the ticket in won't suffice. They want to show their support by being at the ground, and standing next to one another as a group, chanting and singing for their heroes every weekend. It's not like you cannot stream any match you want or watch it on the TV. People go to the match for the atmosphere, yet half the people there complain about those who go all out to create an atmosphere. Whilst I agree there is an element of charver mongs and people with no respect, these tend to be the knackers that help generate the atmosphere. All in all there should be seperate sections for likeminded people, whether it be standing sitting, creating a noise, or sipping tea and biscuits discussing how s*** we are. I know for a fact, I can go to the match and my Dad's mates will tell me about stories being chased by Arsenal at Kings Cross in the 70's and 80's and how the Geordies took whatever end, and how we totally outsung opponents and made amazing atmospheres, and it's what we're world renowned for. Yet there sdoes seem to be a growing minority that seem to think for the youth of today to do it is totally unacceptable. That's what f***s me off. If you want to be entertained f*** off to the cinema in my opinion. Don't know what cinema you go to but you're not supposed to stand up in there either. But I can just imagine him thinking it was great craic to throw popcorn at people from the back whilst talking all the way through the movie. It's a social norm to be quiet and enjoy a film sitting down, it was a social norm for blokes to be able to go to the match, have a few beers, swear and stand and sing but that is the social norm that's now being 'made' unacceptable, and it's not right. Whilst I agree that if you want to be seated you should be able to, you should be able to stand. Swearing uncontrollably with women and children around is unnacceptable, but swearing is part and parcel of the game and the experience, so people should expect to hear some when they attend. We're blokes, it's what we do. Football used to be a place where blokes could go after a long, hard week and release their stress by showing their local team some support. Now it's just full of money grabbing wankers intent on making it an entertainment business. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I think the corner is ideal, and I'm sure it'll become a success, but if everyone from Level 7 etc moved to the back of the Gallowgate- the lowest proportion of ST holders in the ground there- then there wouldn't be such conflict like we are seeing now. Also the noise would be tremendous if things got going with the low roof. However, it is a big shame to see our own fans divided over this when we're all supposed to be behind the same team here and- if the governing bodies had any sense they would introduce safe standing areas ie the ones Pav has been showing. That's the only way forward imo, I just cant see what is to lose by it. And plus, we have enough morons in our support, like any other club, so we don't need the level headed ones to be at each other. Fair point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felling Mag Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Fulham match.....What was it like? I was at work and couldnt get to the game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilson Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 had leaflets on the end of each row about 'persistent standing' fairly dead i thought, livened up a fair bit after the goals naturally. Dunno why but i found it amusing when the 'ryan taylor, over the wall' chant just didnt end, went on for about 10 mins although it got annoying by the end Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Songs like that do get annoying after a while but they're atmosphere builders. If people don't try to out sing the ones singing it it keeps going. That's why I started toon toon...to try and change song. Hate my seat in this corner like, it's nowt like L7 was...but it might be one day. Fingers crossed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilson Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Songs like that do get annoying after a while but they're atmosphere builders. If people don't try to out sing the ones singing it it keeps going. That's why I started toon toon...to try and change song. Hate my seat in this corner like, it's nowt like L7 was...but it might be one day. Fingers crossed. ahh that was you...was gona mention someone trying to stop them with a 'toon toon' chant.... i wouldn't say i hate my seat, like the view and the fact i can still stand up (2nd row from back ) ..... but its just not the same for atmosphere/singing, sang at the top of my voice most of last season and could barely hear my own voice due to every single person around me singing. just hope it picks up in the corner Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lush Vlad Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Was sat about 15-20 rows back in the Leazes, sounded pretty decent I thought., hope it picks up over the season. L7 was still fairly loud, still loads of anti Ashley chants though, great decision Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ujpest doza Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 The anti-Ashley stuff isnt the main point of it imo. That was coming from all parts of the ground! The fact is we had to extend the away section thanks to a stupid PL rule, he wanted to extend the family section as well which is a big success. Result? Either put both in separate areas of the ground which for away fans is just logistically daft. As for the family section, a standard ticket in the lower bowl is £560 a seat? Adult plus child working out at £400 for 2 seats? Ashley is a businessman, putting them in cheaper sections rather than lose money make perfect business sense to him. Obviously thats a kick in the teeth for L7 fans forced to move and for more money but you can see the reasons. It would make sense if the family enclosure was sold out all the time. More often than not the singing section was totally sold out last year and then the Milburn stand L7 had spaces all around. Family stand is sold out to season ticket holders. Doesn't mean every seat is taken every week for example on Sunday my kids were at a party so i was at the match by myself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallsendmag Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Thought it was very loud at times on Sunday but also had long periods of silence which never really happened in Leazes Corner. Looked across there quite a bit during the first half as the match was quite boring (I sit Gallowgate middle block M) and their seems to be a them and us thing going on. The same people singing certain songs, then others that wouldn't join in singing different ones. Creates quite a din when they all sing together though and will have more of an impact on the overall atmosphere with them being much closer to the pitch. Think it'll take time as more people join and others move out over the next few seasons and hopefully as it grows more and more people in the Gallowgate will join in because the design of the stand is great for creating a loud atmosphere. Must also mention the lads at the very back of the Gallowgate. They were making plenty of noise on Sunday and it seems as if there's more and more of them every game which is encouraging. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallsendmag Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 The anti-Ashley stuff isnt the main point of it imo. That was coming from all parts of the ground! The fact is we had to extend the away section thanks to a stupid PL rule, he wanted to extend the family section as well which is a big success. Result? Either put both in separate areas of the ground which for away fans is just logistically daft. As for the family section, a standard ticket in the lower bowl is £560 a seat? Adult plus child working out at £400 for 2 seats? Ashley is a businessman, putting them in cheaper sections rather than lose money make perfect business sense to him. Obviously thats a kick in the teeth for L7 fans forced to move and for more money but you can see the reasons. It would make sense if the family enclosure was sold out all the time. More often than not the singing section was totally sold out last year and then the Milburn stand L7 had spaces all around. Family stand is sold out to season ticket holders. Doesn't mean every seat is taken every week for example on Sunday my kids were at a party so i was at the match by myself. Looked around 75% full at best on Sunday like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan_Taylor Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 The anti-Ashley stuff isnt the main point of it imo. That was coming from all parts of the ground! The fact is we had to extend the away section thanks to a stupid PL rule, he wanted to extend the family section as well which is a big success. Result? Either put both in separate areas of the ground which for away fans is just logistically daft. As for the family section, a standard ticket in the lower bowl is £560 a seat? Adult plus child working out at £400 for 2 seats? Ashley is a businessman, putting them in cheaper sections rather than lose money make perfect business sense to him. Obviously thats a kick in the teeth for L7 fans forced to move and for more money but you can see the reasons. It would make sense if the family enclosure was sold out all the time. More often than not the singing section was totally sold out last year and then the Milburn stand L7 had spaces all around. Family stand is sold out to season ticket holders. Doesn't mean every seat is taken every week for example on Sunday my kids were at a party so i was at the match by myself. Looked around 75% full at best on Sunday like. Weren't helped by Fulham bringing 8 fans like Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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