Kasper Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 The value is always what someone is willing to pay! Or in Ashley's case, value is a little bit more than what someone is willing to pay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conjo Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Apparently only worth half of what Fat Mike's asking, according to an 'expert': http://www.sunderlandecho.com/sport/football/newcastle-united/mike-ashley-asking-price-over-the-odds-for-newcastle-as-amanda-staveley-takeover-talks-continue-1-8800729 Mike Ashley asking price ‘over the odds’ for Newcastle as Amanda Staveley takeover talks continue. JACK MCGRAGHAN AND MARK DONNELLY Published: 10:35 Thursday 12 October 2017 A football finance expert has revealed what Newcastle United are really worth - and it may surprise fans. Rumours of a potential Toon takeover have been rife, with hedge fund boss Amanda Staveley understood to have opened informal talks with the club’s top brass after attending the recent 1-1 draw against Liverpool. That follows reports suggesting Newcastle owner Mike Ashley is willing to lower his asking price from £400 million to £380million. But Dr Daniel Plumley, an academic who studies football finance, suggests the Magpies are actually worth HALF that amount. Dr Plumley, of Sheffield Hallam University, said: “That asking price is arguably over the odds. “Current brand value, based on factors such as league standing, revenue potential, fan base and global exposure, has Newcastle valued at around £190-200million. “This is almost double that, so I would argue it’s a high asking price. “It’s probably also linked to what Mike Ashley has injected in with regards to his own funds and trying to recoup some of that which is fair enough, but based on market brand values it might be tough to achieve that figure.” A deal struck for the amount estimated by Plumley would represent a profit of around £70million for Ashley on his original £134 million purchase of United 10 years ago. But that is without taking into account the money Ashley has also committed on an interest-free loan basis. Staveley, who heads investment banking and financial advisory services firm PCP Capital Partners, holds a personal net worth of around £110 million according to the Sunday Times Rich List, while her company has global assets worth over £28billion. The 44-year-old is no stranger to football takeover deals – she helped to broker the deal which saw Sheikh Mansour bin Zayed Al-Nahyan purchase Man City in 2008, and also attempted to buy Liverpool twice. Suggestions of a new owner on Tyneside has brought a glimmer of hope to the United faithful, who are disenchanted with Ashley. And Staveley’s presence at the Liverpool game only added fuel to the fire. But why has Ashley struggled to find a buyer? Dr Plumley believes the owner himself could be a factor. He added: “I’m speculating slightly here, but probably due to some of the negative press surrounding Ashley and the current structure of the club plus the high asking price. “Another issue is league stability. When the club dropped into the Championship the brand value would have reduced somewhat. “It’s now back up because of Premier League status but the club need to stay there to keep the value high and maximise revenue from TV rights and commercial opportunities.” And while a takeover might seem like a straightforward process, Dr Plumley believes that it is more difficult than ever to take control of a Premier League club. “There are more regulations now in terms of Financial Fair Play which limit owner investment to a certain degree,” he said. “Because of some of these regulations the ‘big six’ are pulling further away in revenue terms from the rest and it is really difficult to compete and catch that pack. “Any potential buyer or investor must be prepared to build incrementally and look at longer term strategic decisions in the current market. That said, there are still good potential growth opportunities for clubs particularly in the overseas market.” The value is always what someone is willing to pay! Which usually is somewhere around the value estimated by experts unless someone is willing to pay more for sentimental reasons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Knowing Ashley it'll be £380 million + his 'loans', making the total price around £500 million. Plus any purchaser agreeing to keep the Sports Direct ads for 10 years probably. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klaus Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 I am doubtful we can get this one over the line lads. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 I am doubtful we can get this one over the line lads. That's where the smart money would be. It would be fantastic but lets face it, highly unlikely. If we ever were to be taken over it'll be by someone who just comes in one day doesn't care too much about the price and it's all done and dusted in a few days. Just like when Ashley himself took us over. Just hope this isn't still hanging around in January and effects our spending in that window, because we clearly have some holes to plug. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoveItIfWeBeatU Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Strange how the 'expert' mentioned in that article doesn't really take the actual TV income figures (which is at least £100m every year a club stays in the Premiership) in to account when valuing the club. If NUFC was priced at £200m there would be a stampede of potential buyers. £200m is less than 2 years TV income. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 But you can't just take that money out of the club so it's not like they'll make that cash. They'd have to spend that TV money on the newly inflated wages and transfer fees. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoveItIfWeBeatU Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 That's true but if asset strippers bought NUFC for £200m they could sell all the assets, pocket the TV money then they'd have made more than the £200m it cost to buy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 I hate Kraft and his cheating team with a passion but if he's interested in buying a PL team, we could do far worse as an owner based on what he's done with the Cheatriots. http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/41592525 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottledDog Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 That's true but if asset strippers bought NUFC for £200m they could sell all the assets, pocket the TV money then they'd have made more than the £200m it cost to buy. Hell yes. Anyone fancy joining my consortium... er... Octagon? Reckon we could get a shitload of student flats incorporated into the stands. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Apparently only worth half of what Fat Mike's asking, according to an 'expert': http://www.sunderlandecho.com/sport/football/newcastle-united/mike-ashley-asking-price-over-the-odds-for-newcastle-as-amanda-staveley-takeover-talks-continue-1-8800729 Mike Ashley asking price ‘over the odds’ for Newcastle as Amanda Staveley takeover talks continue. JACK MCGRAGHAN AND MARK DONNELLY Published: 10:35 Thursday 12 October 2017 A football finance expert has revealed what Newcastle United are really worth - and it may surprise fans. Rumours of a potential Toon takeover have been rife, with hedge fund boss Amanda Staveley understood to have opened informal talks with the club’s top brass after attending the recent 1-1 draw against Liverpool. That follows reports suggesting Newcastle owner Mike Ashley is willing to lower his asking price from £400 million to £380million. But Dr Daniel Plumley, an academic who studies football finance, suggests the Magpies are actually worth HALF that amount. Dr Plumley, of Sheffield Hallam University, said: “That asking price is arguably over the odds. “Current brand value, based on factors such as league standing, revenue potential, fan base and global exposure, has Newcastle valued at around £190-200million. “This is almost double that, so I would argue it’s a high asking price. “It’s probably also linked to what Mike Ashley has injected in with regards to his own funds and trying to recoup some of that which is fair enough, but based on market brand values it might be tough to achieve that figure.” A deal struck for the amount estimated by Plumley would represent a profit of around £70million for Ashley on his original £134 million purchase of United 10 years ago. But that is without taking into account the money Ashley has also committed on an interest-free loan basis. Staveley, who heads investment banking and financial advisory services firm PCP Capital Partners, holds a personal net worth of around £110 million according to the Sunday Times Rich List, while her company has global assets worth over £28billion. The 44-year-old is no stranger to football takeover deals – she helped to broker the deal which saw Sheikh Mansour bin Zayed Al-Nahyan purchase Man City in 2008, and also attempted to buy Liverpool twice. Suggestions of a new owner on Tyneside has brought a glimmer of hope to the United faithful, who are disenchanted with Ashley. And Staveley’s presence at the Liverpool game only added fuel to the fire. But why has Ashley struggled to find a buyer? Dr Plumley believes the owner himself could be a factor. He added: “I’m speculating slightly here, but probably due to some of the negative press surrounding Ashley and the current structure of the club plus the high asking price. “Another issue is league stability. When the club dropped into the Championship the brand value would have reduced somewhat. “It’s now back up because of Premier League status but the club need to stay there to keep the value high and maximise revenue from TV rights and commercial opportunities.” And while a takeover might seem like a straightforward process, Dr Plumley believes that it is more difficult than ever to take control of a Premier League club. “There are more regulations now in terms of Financial Fair Play which limit owner investment to a certain degree,” he said. “Because of some of these regulations the ‘big six’ are pulling further away in revenue terms from the rest and it is really difficult to compete and catch that pack. “Any potential buyer or investor must be prepared to build incrementally and look at longer term strategic decisions in the current market. That said, there are still good potential growth opportunities for clubs particularly in the overseas market.” The value is always what someone is willing to pay! Which usually is somewhere around the value estimated by experts unless someone is willing to pay more for sentimental reasons. Actually in recent years most sales of professional sports clubs have been for quite a bit more than teams were valued at by experts. I really don't think £350-400m is that crazy assuming a) it includes the debt and b) there are no clauses that keep Ashley or Sports Direct involved for any period of time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
number9shirt Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 I hate Kraft and his cheating team with a passion but if he's interested in buying a PL team, we could do far worse as an owner based on what he's done with the Cheatriots. http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/41592525 We could do a helluva lot worse than Kraft he has built one of the greatest sporting dynasties with Patriots. Also Bill Belicheck is a leader of men & one of the greatest manager's in history, who reminds me of our very own Rafa Benítez. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelphish Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Just anyone who will let us at least try to be competitive again, for the love of god. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaydnNUFC Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Just anyone who will let us at least try to be competitive again, for the love of god. I know, please. Just came across a clip of a 1-1 draw with Arsenal at SJP in 2003. Prior to the game we were 5 points off Arsenal in 2nd after 25 games played, wonder if we'll ever see those heights again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Kraft can get fucked for a number of reasons. Obviously better than Ashley because just about anyone is, but would not want. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
number9shirt Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Kraft can get f***ed for a number of reasons. Obviously better than Ashley because just about anyone is, but would not want. I'd love to know what these reasons are? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Kraft can get f***ed for a number of reasons. Obviously better than Ashley because just about anyone is, but would not want. I'd love to know what these reasons are? - I'm not going to say he deserves no credit for the Pats success, but he struck gold with Belichick/Brady. - He's hesitant to buy a PL club because there isn't a salary cap - He's done nothing to push the NE Revolution forward. I think he's widely viewed as the worst owner in the league. A big part of that is he's let (forced) them to continue playing in a half empty NFL stadium in the middle of nowhere, while every other club has built their own stadium. - He's buddy-buddy with Trump (although he has called him out a few times) - I hate Boston sports teams so the same reason I wouldn't want us to be owned by FSG Honestly, he'd be way better than Ashley but the way he's let the Revolution stagnate would be very worrying. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
number9shirt Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Kraft can get f***ed for a number of reasons. Obviously better than Ashley because just about anyone is, but would not want. I'd love to know what these reasons are? - I'm not going to say he deserves no credit for the Pats success, but he struck gold with Belichick/Brady. - He's hesitant to buy a PL club because there isn't a salary cap - He's done nothing to push the NE Revolution forward. I think he's widely viewed as the worst owner in the league. A big part of that is he's let (forced) them to continue playing in a half empty NFL stadium in the middle of nowhere, while every other club has built their own stadium. - He's buddy-buddy with Trump (although he has called him out a few times) - I hate Boston sports teams so the same reason I wouldn't want us to be owned by FSG Honestly, he'd be way better than Ashley but the way he's let the Revolution stagnate would be very worrying. Thanks for that info Ed. A very interesting point about the NE revolution, something I will be looking into. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Toon Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Cant believe we're still talking about a takeover. Never was happening, never will under the greedy c.unt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasy Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 That's true but if asset strippers bought NUFC for £200m they could sell all the assets, pocket the TV money then they'd have made more than the £200m it cost to buy. Clubs get paid TV money in stages don't they? If they sold everything over night they wouldn't get any further TV money payments. Also to sell that quick they'd have to sell at a small fraction of market value. If instead they sold over the season (which they'd need to to get the kind of money you're talking about) then they'd have to spend significant amounts of money on running costs (including about £70m+ on wages for the year). Don't get me wrong like, that "expert" talking about what the club is worth is talking utter bollocks, just saying that I don't think asset stripping would work in Football. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasy Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Just read that article, is he possibly looking at any potential £380m deal as exclusive of debt? As in he's saying the club is worth about £190m-£200m because there's about £200m of debt left to pay after you buy. So paying £380m for a club that will have £200m debt would be over the odds (total of £580m). That's the only way I can make sense of his opinion. Because if he's saying that Newcastle United, free of Ashley's debt, is worth only £190-£200m he's not an expert, he's a moron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 I don't know. In business world an assets value is closely related to the net profit generated each year. A very basic calculation would be net profit per year / expected return rate. But football club seems not running for net profits, isn't it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Toon Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 We are a bad example to value anyway as those, if there are anyone really looking, will find out when going through the books as a lot of income is diverted elsewhere thus not showing in the turnover. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 I suppose one thing to cling and clutching a little bit here, is that the club haven't come out and issued a "this is not true" or "there has been no official approach". Unless Ashley is playing the long scam with nufc fans for laughs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Toon Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 I suppose one thing to cling and clutching a little bit here, is that the club haven't come out and issued a "this is not true" or "there has been no official approach". Unless Ashley is playing the long scam with nufc fans for laughs. Nailed it with that bit for me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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