Sunderland

[midds]

It's amusing how they think they will hoover up every half-decent player in the Championship

 

Also get the sense that they believe their new raft of players are going to play for free and cost nothing. They're losing loads of players for nothing which is being spun as slashing their wage-bill, which it will obviously but they'll need replacing and this will cost money.

 

They've worked out that the parachute money will tide them over but have chosen to forget they'll need to spend to replace the loanees and out-of-contract players. Another 15 players out and another 15 coming in would be my guess.

 

15 out, probably about 4-5 free loans in couple of free transfers and actually pay for 3-4 probably covered by what they sell Johnson and Fletcher for.

 

 

sounds very plausible.

[Cajun]

We had Colo, Krul, Enrique, Nolan, Carroll.

 

All would still walk into their squad let alone the Championship. Who have they got realistically that will be of any benefit?

[Optimistic Nut]

Starting to think that these lot are kidding themselves if they think that going down will help them. Some of the players they seem to hate the most (Larsson, Gardner, Cuellar, Colback, Bardsley) are leaving at the end of the season whether they stay up or not.

 

Most of the players they seem to be talking about as being 'dead weight' are probably the ones that will have a bit of extra quality in the Championship to come back up (O'shea, Brown, Fletcher, Graham). I doubt Johnson or Giaccherini would stay if they were relegated either.

 

Their two best players are on loan, cut the 'dead weight' and they've got f***ing nowt  Properly up s*** creek if that happens, especially taking into account the latest financial figures.

 

 

 

 

We had assets that would do well at other clubs. (Bassong : Spurs, Owen : Man Utd [i know, I know], Beye : Villa, Martins : Wolfsburg...) and got a fair bit of money for these. Will Sunderland get rid of their main players and still keep a group good enough to go up?

 

We got nowt for Owen.

 

£100k off the wage bill though.

[Dokko]

Starting to think that these lot are kidding themselves if they think that going down will help them. Some of the players they seem to hate the most (Larsson, Gardner, Cuellar, Colback, Bardsley) are leaving at the end of the season whether they stay up or not.

 

Most of the players they seem to be talking about as being 'dead weight' are probably the ones that will have a bit of extra quality in the Championship to come back up (O'shea, Brown, Fletcher, Graham). I doubt Johnson or Giaccherini would stay if they were relegated either.

 

Their two best players are on loan, cut the 'dead weight' and they've got f***ing nowt  Properly up s*** creek if that happens, especially taking into account the latest financial figures.

 

 

 

 

We had assets that would do well at other clubs. (Bassong : Spurs, Owen : Man Utd [i know, I know], Beye : Villa, Martins : Wolfsburg...) and got a fair bit of money for these. Will Sunderland get rid of their main players and still keep a group good enough to go up?

 

We got nowt for Owen.

 

£100k off the wage bill though.

 

Then they'll get a 'fair bit of money' for their out of contracts too.

[Optimistic Nut]

Fuck off.

[Dokko]

It's amusing how they think they will hoover up every half-decent player in the Championship

 

Also get the sense that they believe their new raft of players are going to play for free and cost nothing. They're losing loads of players for nothing which is being spun as slashing their wage-bill, which it will obviously but they'll need replacing and this will cost money.

 

They've worked out that the parachute money will tide them over but have chosen to forget they'll need to spend to replace the loanees and out-of-contract players. Another 15 players out and another 15 coming in would be my guess.

 

15 out, probably about 4-5 free loans in couple of free transfers and actually pay for 3-4 probably covered by what they sell Johnson and Fletcher for.

 

 

sounds very plausible.

 

Where it gets them is anyone's guess. I don't see short putting funds in to get them going again. They either live within their means trying to get back up while managing their debt or he sells the club. Not sure who'd want them in that state, I'm sure if he could have sold them by now he'd have done it ages ago. Unless he gives them away for free it'll be done on the cheap.

 

When the come back up they'll come back a stronger outfit for it I'm absolutely sure of it. They won't allow the pisstakers in again, even if that means never showing any ambition of note under short, just surviving in the prem not costing anything. A poorer us.

[Dokko]

Fuck off.

 

[midds]

It's amusing how they think they will hoover up every half-decent player in the Championship

 

Also get the sense that they believe their new raft of players are going to play for free and cost nothing. They're losing loads of players for nothing which is being spun as slashing their wage-bill, which it will obviously but they'll need replacing and this will cost money.

 

They've worked out that the parachute money will tide them over but have chosen to forget they'll need to spend to replace the loanees and out-of-contract players. Another 15 players out and another 15 coming in would be my guess.

 

15 out, probably about 4-5 free loans in couple of free transfers and actually pay for 3-4 probably covered by what they sell Johnson and Fletcher for.

 

 

sounds very plausible.

 

Where it gets them is anyone's guess. I don't see short putting funds in to get them going again. They either live within their means trying to get back up while managing their debt or he sells the club. Not sure who'd want them in that state, I'm sure if he could have sold them by now he'd have done it ages ago. Unless he gives them away for free it'll be done on the cheap.

 

When the come back up they'll come back a stronger outfit for it I'm absolutely sure of it. They won't allow the pisstakers in again, even if that means never showing any ambition of note under short, just surviving in the prem not costing anything. A poorer us.

 

Agree with all of that.

 

Can't see too many takers for their better players either. Johnson will fetch a few quid and Fletcher could go for 4 or 5 perhaps? After that Giacherrini will go back to Italy on the cheap - 2 or 3 maybe and I don't think I could think of another player of worth for them. 

[Optimistic Nut]

Hang on, I got a warning for that?

 

I didn't think I needed a safety wink there.

[Dokko]

It's amusing how they think they will hoover up every half-decent player in the Championship

 

Also get the sense that they believe their new raft of players are going to play for free and cost nothing. They're losing loads of players for nothing which is being spun as slashing their wage-bill, which it will obviously but they'll need replacing and this will cost money.

 

They've worked out that the parachute money will tide them over but have chosen to forget they'll need to spend to replace the loanees and out-of-contract players. Another 15 players out and another 15 coming in would be my guess.

 

15 out, probably about 4-5 free loans in couple of free transfers and actually pay for 3-4 probably covered by what they sell Johnson and Fletcher for.

 

 

sounds very plausible.

 

Where it gets them is anyone's guess. I don't see short putting funds in to get them going again. They either live within their means trying to get back up while managing their debt or he sells the club. Not sure who'd want them in that state, I'm sure if he could have sold them by now he'd have done it ages ago. Unless he gives them away for free it'll be done on the cheap.

 

When the come back up they'll come back a stronger outfit for it I'm absolutely sure of it. They won't allow the pisstakers in again, even if that means never showing any ambition of note under short, just surviving in the prem not costing anything. A poorer us.

 

Agree with all of that.

 

Can't see too many takers for their better players either. Johnson will fetch a few quid and Fletcher could go for 4 or 5 perhaps? After that Giacherrini will go back to Italy on the cheap - 2 or 3 maybe and I don't think I could think of another player of worth for them.

 

Said last night I could see Johnson go to west ham, think a few other clubs will take a chance and get more out of him, till he gets bored/gives up/doesn't get England call. Will fetch around £7m.

 

Fletcher will be a little harder to shift but no doubt a promoted club will take a punt probably in the region of £5m. Huge loss like, but his stock through, form, attitude and fitness has hit rock bottom. 3rd relegation as well.

 

Giacherrini will head back to Italy for about half of what they paid. He only came for the money, he can't wait to leave.

 

So really £15m to play with, more than most championship clubs but still doesn't get you much these days unless you hit lucky and from the signings Gus has made I'm not sure if buying players is his strongest point. He basically wasted a huge chunk of money in the winter window bringing in players who weren't ready for the league and relegation battle and with huge question marks over the quality as well. A more experienced manager may have brought in players ready to make a difference rather change too much at once. For me he wasted a big chance to get them moving again along with losing momentum with the hull FA cup game it's been two massive mistakes which have effectively relegated them.

 

I still think he's got great potential, and light years ahead of what they've had in my time (doesn't say much) but his rookie mistakes have cost them, another fuck up on that scale early doors such as another transfer window blunder and Sunderland aren't a premier league club for 5 years. It's that fine Iyam.

[midds]

It's amusing how they think they will hoover up every half-decent player in the Championship

 

Also get the sense that they believe their new raft of players are going to play for free and cost nothing. They're losing loads of players for nothing which is being spun as slashing their wage-bill, which it will obviously but they'll need replacing and this will cost money.

 

They've worked out that the parachute money will tide them over but have chosen to forget they'll need to spend to replace the loanees and out-of-contract players. Another 15 players out and another 15 coming in would be my guess.

 

15 out, probably about 4-5 free loans in couple of free transfers and actually pay for 3-4 probably covered by what they sell Johnson and Fletcher for.

 

 

sounds very plausible.

 

Where it gets them is anyone's guess. I don't see short putting funds in to get them going again. They either live within their means trying to get back up while managing their debt or he sells the club. Not sure who'd want them in that state, I'm sure if he could have sold them by now he'd have done it ages ago. Unless he gives them away for free it'll be done on the cheap.

 

When the come back up they'll come back a stronger outfit for it I'm absolutely sure of it. They won't allow the pisstakers in again, even if that means never showing any ambition of note under short, just surviving in the prem not costing anything. A poorer us.

 

Agree with all of that.

 

Can't see too many takers for their better players either. Johnson will fetch a few quid and Fletcher could go for 4 or 5 perhaps? After that Giacherrini will go back to Italy on the cheap - 2 or 3 maybe and I don't think I could think of another player of worth for them.

 

Said last night I could see Johnson go to west ham, think a few other clubs will take a chance and get more out of him, till he gets bored/gives up/doesn't get England call. Will fetch around £7m.

 

Fletcher will be a little harder to shift but no doubt a promoted club will take a punt probably in the region of £5m. Huge loss like, but his stock through, form, attitude and fitness has hit rock bottom. 3rd relegation as well.

 

Giacherrini will head back to Italy for about half of what they paid. He only came for the money, he can't wait to leave.

 

So really £15m to play with, more than most championship clubs but still doesn't get you much these days unless you hit lucky and from the signings Gus has made I'm not sure if buying players is his strongest point. He basically wasted a huge chunk of money in the winter window bringing in players who weren't ready for the league and relegation battle and with huge question marks over the quality as well. A more experienced manager may have brought in players ready to make a difference rather change too much at once. For me he wasted a big chance to get them moving again along with losing momentum with the hull FA cup game it's been two massive mistakes which have effectively relegated them.

 

Yet again.

[Chris_R]

When we went down we kept many of our decent players. That's why we came back up again, not because of some terrific rebuilding exercise.

 

If (when?) they go down, they'll not be keeping the nucleus of a good squad for all the reasons already mentioned. They'll be pretty much building their team again from scratch. Not saying that's impossible, but it sure as fuck isn't a blessing to be in that situation and have to do it.

[Optimistic Nut]

We also had a squad which when at their best, was probably a lower mid-table Premier League club (proven when we came back up).

 

These aren't that. They've had 3 managers in the last 18 months and they've been equally bollocks throughout it all. They're a crap Premier League team. If they keep these and come back up, they'll go back down. If they sell them, they have a massive rebuilding job as well. Tough times ahead I reckon.

[Ryan_Taylor]

All of their decent players don't belong to them anyway

[loki679]

A £27m loss - £30m lost TV revenue - £8m loyalty bonuses + £16m parachute payment = 

[Chris_R]

Aren't loyalty bonuses paid over the duration of the contract rather than as a lump sum at the end? Always thought that they were spread out pro-rata over the whole term. Not sure they'll have to stump up £8m all at once.

 

Not that this makes their predicament any less funny. Just slightly more realistic.

[Guest Nixon]

I was listening to Total Sport tonight and I couldn't help but focus on something Steve Harper said. He was talking about Kevin Nolan and how he is the best captain he's ever had. I'm aware Harper hasn't been blessed with an abundance of candidates ,but it reminded me just how influential it was to have that 'player's council' we had in the Championship.

 

Harper, Nolan, Nicky Butt, and Joey Barton, while only the former two consistently delivered on the pitch, it was incredibly helpful to have someone marshalling the squad.

 

It's something I think is lacking in the current Sunderland dressing room. Wes Brown and O'Shea have good resumés, but in the middle of the park there really isn't anyone vocal. Seeing as I get to watch Sunderland quite often, Cattermole is something of a faux-general. He shouts, he ruffles feathers, but he doesn't actually lead, and I sense a lot of his teammates don't actually want to work for him.

 

There's undoubtedly going to be a clear out this summer. Modibo Diakite and Cabral are gone already. Jozy Altidore, and Emanuele Giaccherini will both find mid-table teams in central Europe and then it's a case of who do you try and keep. Steven Fletcher will score goals but he's also one of their few saleable assets. We've seen with QPR and West Ham in recent years that some teams make few changes in the hope of bouncing straight back up.

 

I think if they played it right, showed some patience, it could be the making of them. The last 3-4 years especially they've been burnt in the transfer market. Nearly £30million on strikers, all of whom have been outscored by a loanee from Liverpool.

 

I don't see Lee Congerton helping much either. He's a bit like Roberto Da Fanti in my opinion. He's arrived with a flattering CV that has him down as working with a clutch of talent at Chelsea, then at Hamburg in the Bundesliga. What it fails to mention is that they brought a number of those Chelsea players to Hamburg and few if any of them worked out/lasted at the club.

 

 

[Miercoles]

It's something I think is lacking in the current Sunderland dressing room.

 

 

Not to mention the cunting Newcastle dressing room.

[cp40]

I was listening to Total Sport tonight and I couldn't help but focus on something Steve Harper said. He was talking about Kevin Nolan and how he is the best captain he's ever had. I'm aware Harper hasn't been blessed with an abundance of candidates ,but it reminded me just how influential it was to have that 'player's council' we had in the Championship.

 

Harper, Nolan, Nicky Butt, and Joey Barton, while only the latter two consistently delivered on the pitch, it was incredibly helpful to have someone marshalling the squad.

 

It's something I think is lacking in the current Sunderland dressing room. Wes Brown and O'Shea have good resumés, but in the middle of the park there really isn't anyone vocal. Seeing as I get to watch Sunderland quite often, Cattermole is something of a faux-general. He shouts, he ruffles feathers, but he doesn't actually lead, and I sense a lot of his teammates don't actually want to work for him.

 

There's undoubtedly going to be a clear out this summer. Modibo Diakite and Cabral are gone already. Jozy Altidore, and Emanuele Giaccherini will both find mid-table teams in central Europe and then it's a case of who do you try and keep. Steven Fletcher will score goals but he's also one of their few saleable assets. We've seen with QPR and West Ham in recent years that some teams make few changes in the hope of bouncing straight back up.

 

I think if they played it right, showed some patience, it could be the making of them. The last 3-4 years especially they've been burnt in the transfer market. Nearly £30million on strikers, all of whom have been outscored by a loanee from Liverpool.

 

I don't see Lee Congerton helping much either. He's a bit like Roberto Da Fanti in my opinion. He's arrived with a flattering CV that has him down as working with a clutch of talent at Chelsea, then at Hamburg in the Bundesliga. What it fails to mention is that they brought a number of those Chelsea players to Hamburg and few if any of them worked out/lasted at the club.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Steve  Harper said on Total sport a couple of weeks ago it was a dressing room meeting led by Nolan and Barton, that got the job of getting us promoted done.

 

[Ronaldo]

Do we have to have this nonsense on an NUFC forum?

 

By the way, Barton and Butt consistently delivered on the pitch? 

[Guest Walter]

Do we have to have this nonsense on an NUFC forum?

 

By the way, Barton and Butt consistently delivered on the pitch? 

 

I think he meant Barton and Nolan

[Ronaldo]

Barton had 5 good months in 4 years.

[Nobody]

I think he meant Barton and Nolan in the Championship. Not that it's still entirely accurate, and you have to make quite a few assumptions to get there

[cp40]

Do we have to have this nonsense on an NUFC forum?

 

By the way, Barton and Butt consistently delivered on the pitch? 

 

 

what nonsense would that be?

[Ronaldo]

An analysis of Sunderland's leadership.