gdm Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 32 minutes ago, Froggy said: I don't see it that way. We have other executives in place and this isn't a sprint. Why would we overpay for someone who desperately wants to join us and can do so for free in 12 months time? I'd have been incredibly unhappy at us wasting a fortune to bring him in early. There’s overpaying and there’s underpaying and being cheap. £2m is an insulting offer when he cost £6m and every report I’ve read suggests ashworth not being in place is hampering your summer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 2 hours ago, Froggy said: Of course, because you don't really watch us and when you do, like others, you do it with a bit between your teeth and want to see faults everywhere you look. Fact remains, we've had the highest counter press success rate in the league the last two years running. We've had the most possession won in the final third and middle of the pitch. We had the second most pressing sequences in the league this year. It would be quite incredible to have those stats being a defensive side. We are absolutely anything but boring. your comment just proves you either don't watch us at all or you simply don't know what you're talking about. I don't watch many Newcastle games. But what I read on here suggests you're a high intensity team. You had the intensity of a wet fart in the cup final last year. You had the intensity of a wet shart at Old Trafford in a must win game against a defence of Casemiro and Jonny Evans. You're not in Europe because of that game. Should I base my opinion on those? It seems like that's what you're doing with us. I knew this post was coming some bollocks stats to 'prove' your point. If anything, those stats show just how shit of a manager he is then, because despite them you're still a team that is absolutely rubbish on the eye and look completely incoherent. Ask 100 football fans who they think is the team that applies the highest press and not a single one says Man U. Oh, and Man U is the team Ive watched most other than Newcastle the last 4 or so seasons as I work with a Man U fan. Reckon Ive seen more of them than you have, as you seem to be reading off a stats sheet and watch some Youtuber talk about your games. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 We still talking about Man Utd ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 2 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said: If you mean that the press was so poor that it was mostly unrecognisable as a press (at least compared to Arsenal, Man City, even us) then I take the point, but I watched a ton of Man United matches last season (obv not as much as you) and in your worst performances I can't say kamikaze pressing stood out to me as a root cause of your problems. Definitely not as much as lack of possession, sloppiness in possession, and conceding space and chances. What you've said is exactly what I mean, but you know as well as I do that I don't articulate things very well when it comes to football debates. We were trying to play a man for man press with players like Rashford and Scott McTominay on the field which was suicidal from Ten Hag, hence the kamikaze press comment. If one man doesn't pull his weight, it falls apart. When we had a front four of Hojlund, Garnacho, Fernandes and Antony, the press actually worked fairly well and was effective and our stats in this field were high. That leads in to your comment about sloppiness in possession which is absolutely correct. Ineffective wingers not passing the ball, or running into traffic. Hojlund just not receiving the ball at all. There were games where Onana was the one with the most passes to Hojlund. That's absolutely insane. The team is young though, I'm hoping that development will come with experience and time. Our players capable of maintaining possession such as Eriksen and Mount either weren't available or don't have the legs anymore to be effective in the middle of the park. Mainoo brought some more balance to this, but with no competent defensive midfielder the midfield was constantly overrun. When we tried to press and were sloppy as you mentioned, we were countered and with everyone high up the pitch and no DM with the legs to cover ground, we conceded shot after shot after shot. I'm in no way trying to suggest we were even close to good last season, and Ten Hag should shoulder a lot of the blame because when the injuries started flying in and Casemiro was in a back four with Jonny Evans, the only sensible thing to do was to protect them, but we continued with suicide ball. If we were in the same situation this year come October with two or three valuable defensive players out and we continued to play the high press, I'd be the first one calling for his head. I like my manager to be able to adapt, and Ten Hag did just that against Arsenal, Newcastle, Brighton and City to finish the season. It gave me some hope that he's not as stubborn as I initially thought and I felt like he deserved another go at proving he's the man for the job. I hope it makes sense what I'm trying to say. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 4 minutes ago, Nobody said: Oh, and Man U is the team Ive watched most other than Newcastle the last 4 or so seasons as I work with a Man U fan. Reckon Ive seen more of them than you have, as you seem to be reading off a stats sheet and watch some Youtuber talk about your games. OK chief. I'd say I've been to Old Trafford more in the last 6 months than you've been to SJP in your lifetime. You're not in the position to throw stones. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 9 minutes ago, gdm said: There’s overpaying and there’s underpaying and being cheap. £2m is an insulting offer when he cost £6m and every report I’ve read suggests ashworth not being in place is hampering your summer I fully agree it's insulting. I'm just happy we aren't bending over and paying over the odds like we have done for years now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 5 minutes ago, Froggy said: I fully agree it's insulting. I'm just happy we aren't bending over and paying over the odds like we have done for years now. Aye but you won't be saying that when you don't sign the players you want because of tightarse ratface. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 3 minutes ago, STM said: Aye but you won't be saying that when you don't sign the players you want because of tightarse ratface. I still think we'll match the wages of most other clubs, and we'll target players with release clauses so clubs can't bend us over a barrel like Ajax did with Antony. We'll find all of this out in the next month or two anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjohnson Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 9 minutes ago, Froggy said: I still think we'll match the wages of most other clubs, and we'll target players with release clauses so clubs can't bend us over a barrel like Ajax did with Antony. We'll find all of this out in the next month or two anyway. Yep and Mike Ashley mkii will give you a taste of what we endured for 14 years....cost cutting everywhere, buying players for profit and not what the team adds, outstanding lack of awareness, only thing he can't or won't do is that because ineos materials aren't generally available to the public they won't be plastered all over the wreckage that is Old Trafford Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groundhog63 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 25 minutes ago, Froggy said: OK chief. I'd say I've been to Old Trafford more in the last 6 months than you've been to SJP in your lifetime. You're not in the position to throw stones. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovejoy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 Take it to a Man Utd forum lads, ffs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 7 minutes ago, Groundhog63 said: It must have been the Goldbridge insinuation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 How about Fabian Hurzeler then lads? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 9 minutes ago, lovejoy said: Take it to a Man Utd forum lads, ffs. Even the Man Utd thread on here would do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 17 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said: Even the Man Utd thread on here would do. It's a thread about managerial news. The Ten Hag situation was always going to spark debate in this thread about how he's performed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 I always felt that this complicated set up at Man U where the Glazers and Ratcliffe divide responsibilities was going to be problematic. The drawn out decision making over Ten Haag is symptomatic of this. He still looks vulnerable. It’s hard to tell whether they really have confidence in him, or they just couldn’t find a better alternative. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallumG6 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 17 hours ago, Froggy said: Why would they know before that? I've no reason why they would, but for them to find out at a similar time as everyone else seems a bit suspect. I read somewhere they expected him to be sacked and were shocked to hear him staying, is that correct? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 1 minute ago, Cronky said: I always felt that this complicated set up at Man U where the Glazers and Ratcliffe divide responsibilities was going to be problematic. The drawn out decision making over Ten Haag is symptomatic of this. He still looks vulnerable. It’s hard to tell whether they really have confidence in him, or they just couldn’t find a better alternative. The Glazers have absolutely nothing to do with the footballing side anymore. Reality is, if they had spoken to a manager they thought was a better option, they'd have pulled the plug on Ten Hag. You do always have to go with what you think is the best option available, and I personally don't think Tuchel, Pochettino, De Zerbi, McKenna etc. were an upgrade on Ten Hag, so I'm happy they've stuck with him. If you had asked me a few months ago about De Zerbi I'd have been very keen but I'm not a fan of how it ended between him and Brighton. 15 minutes ago, CallumG6 said: I've no reason why they would, but for them to find out at a similar time as everyone else seems a bit suspect. I read somewhere they expected him to be sacked and were shocked to hear him staying, is that correct? I haven't read anything about that to be honest. The vast majority of the current players will be happy he's staying. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 Ten Hag has to be a better manager than he has shown, but he has made some outrageous man management blunders it seems, and his transfers havent inspired, but there generally is a lot of positives to keeping managers in situ, I think there definitely has been a move away from the culture of sacking managers so quickly almost everywhere but Chelsea just out of seeing how well the likes of Arteta have done once they are stable and got everything how they want, it takes time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbo Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 6 minutes ago, Froggy said: The Glazers have absolutely nothing to do with the footballing side anymore. Reality is, if they had spoken to a manager they thought was a better option, they'd have pulled the plug on Ten Hag. You do always have to go with what you think is the best option available, and I personally don't think Tuchel, Pochettino, De Zerbi, McKenna etc. were an upgrade on Ten Hag, so I'm happy they've stuck with him. If you had asked me a few months ago about De Zerbi I'd have been very keen but I'm not a fan of how it ended between him and Brighton. I haven't read anything about that to be honest. The vast majority of the current players will be happy he's staying. Their number 1 target isn’t available until after the euros, all they’re doing is trying to shut down media speculation until they can get their man. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 It's hard to argue with Froggy. He's in a very unique situation whereby he has excellent contacts at the Executive and Boardroom level, coaches and management and also the senior players in the dressing room. So when he tells you they have the very best decision makers at the top of the club, the best post war manager, probably the best young striking prospect in the world, possibly the best midfielders and at least 3 of their defenders are among the top 2 in the world, you'd better listen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 9 minutes ago, Tiresias said: Ten Hag has to be a better manager than he has shown, but he has made some outrageous man management blunders it seems When people say this, who are they talking about? Sancho and Ronaldo? Fans are 100% behind him with both. We're delighted with how he's handled them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 2 minutes ago, Lotus said: It's hard to argue with Froggy. He's in a very unique situation whereby he has excellent contacts at the Executive and Boardroom level, coaches and management and also the senior players in the dressing room. So when he tells you they have the very best decision makers at the top of the club, the best post war manager, probably the best young striking prospect in the world, possibly the best midfielders and at least 3 of their defenders are among the top 2 in the world, you'd better listen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paully Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 Absolutely outrageous how they've treated Ten Haag mind - he must be embarressed by it https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5543044/2024/06/12/erik-ten-hag-manchester-united-why-not-sacked/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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