Froggy Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 If he's not in the elite how is he world class? He's not one the top 3 forwards in the league let alone the world. Yes he is. If you had said striker then maybe it was agreeable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 If he's not in the elite how is he world class? He's not one the top 3 forwards in the league let alone the world. The elite is about 5 players. There's still world class players around the globe who just fall short of that bracket. Just got to look at Rooney stats and they tell it's own sotory, he makes goals and he scores goals. He can score all types of goals as well, he's a nightmare for defenders to deal with and if he stays fit going into the tournament, he's one of our biggest assets. No doubt about it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
triggs Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 If he's not in the elite how is he world class? He's not one the top 3 forwards in the league let alone the world. Yes he is. If you had said striker then maybe it was agreeable. When is the last time he played well in an important game against a good side? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Don't start with this recent years s**** like . Your claim is major tournaments because Rooney in that last two years for England has 10 in 15 games as a deep player. Is that s**** or something now? This is England's problem. Nothing is ever good enough. Messi has played in two World Cups and scored one goal by the way. The comparison isn't laughable at all, just people are in denial about Rooney. Rooney and Messi have almost identical international records except 14 of Messi's goals were in competitive games, compared to Rooney's 28. Messi was very good in the last world cup except against Germany. This was generally accepted at the time but people seem to have forgotten this He played OK by his standards. Messi should be scoring, especially at that stage of his career when he was undoubtedly the best player in the World. In the opening game he was trying to score from all angles too against Nigeria, a game they only won 1-0. That was an easy group by the way. You may as well have said he was good in the World Cup except when they needed him most, i.e. against Germany. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 When has he been the difference in a top match? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Spark Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Don't start with this recent years shite like . Your claim is major tournaments because Rooney in that last two years for England has 10 in 15 games as a deep player. Is that shite or something now? This is England's problem. Nothing is ever good enough. Messi has played in two World Cups and scored one goal by the way. The comparison isn't laughable at all, just people are in denial about Rooney. Rooney and Messi have almost identical international records except 14 of Messi's goals were in competitive games, compared to Rooney's 28. I honestly have no idea why you've brought Messi into this. He played really well in 2010. Why are you judging such a player purely on goals scored? Also, qualifiers are quite obviously not the same as tournaments, and Rooney has shown very little in the last 3 competitions. His performances have been bad enough to justify trying something new, in my opinion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 If he's not in the elite how is he world class? He's not one the top 3 forwards in the league let alone the world. The elite is about 5 players. There's still world class players around the globe who just fall short of that bracket. Just got to look at Rooney stats and they tell it's own sotory, he makes goals and he scores goals. He can score all types of goals as well, he's a nightmare for defenders to deal with and if he stays fit going into the tournament, he's one of our biggest assets. No doubt about it. Yes and Wayne Rooney isn't one of them. To be world class you've got to surely be one of the top 3 maybe 5 players in your position in the world. He's not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 So Rooney has never really done it a tournament, yet people are still backing him to do it in the climate out there with the way he looks after himself? I'm not backing him to take tourney by storm or anything, i think he's been made the scapegoat for England's past failings. Problem isn't Rooney, it's England. If we had genuine top players fighting for his place, i'd be sided with trying something different. Our options are so limited though, there shouldn't even be a debate for Rooney or Welbeck. Even Moyes can work that one out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Lionel Messi and Wayne Rooney have played in the same number of CL finals (in fact maybe just 2). Messi has 3 goals, Rooney has 0. Let's not compare anything about them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Spark Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Don't start with this recent years s**** like . Your claim is major tournaments because Rooney in that last two years for England has 10 in 15 games as a deep player. Is that s**** or something now? This is England's problem. Nothing is ever good enough. Messi has played in two World Cups and scored one goal by the way. The comparison isn't laughable at all, just people are in denial about Rooney. Rooney and Messi have almost identical international records except 14 of Messi's goals were in competitive games, compared to Rooney's 28. Messi was very good in the last world cup except against Germany. This was generally accepted at the time but people seem to have forgotten this He played OK by his standards. Messi should be scoring, especially at that stage of his career when he was undoubtedly the best player in the World. In the opening game he was trying to score from all angles too against Nigeria, a game they only won 1-0. That was an easy group by the way. You may as well have said he was good in the World Cup except when they needed him most, i.e. against Germany. We also had an easy group but Rooney was barely able to trap the ball. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 When has he been the difference in a top match? Seriously I can see why so many people disagree with you now like. This is the most juvenile argument people have. People even say it about Ronaldo ffs. Wayne Rooney contributes massively in EVERY game he plays for us. The team in general has been shit this year, mainly down to shit tactics, but when we play poor Rooney is the only one who stands out. He's the one who looks the most likely and is the one with the most fight. In the rare occasions this year when the team has played well, it's all been Wayne Rooney, as evidenced by his double digits goals and assists tally in the league. Don't forget his performances in Europe as well. Sure we had a bad result against Olympiacos but Rooney was devastating in the groups stages. I suppose 5-0 away to Bayer Leverkusen is an average result now, where he set up 4 of the goals? Seriously man, denial. Get out of your fucking cages. You need to watch a full game of Manchester United's instead of catching highlights on Match of the Day 2 and forming opinions based on that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I'm certainly not saying Welbeck ahead of Rooney for a central striking option, I'm saying playing him on the wide left ahead of Rooney as he would do the job he was supposed to be doing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Lionel Messi and Wayne Rooney have played in the same number of CL finals (in fact maybe just 2). Messi has 3 goals, Rooney has 0. Let's not compare anything about them. Wrong again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I think he's also scored more competitive goals than any other player for England. Not that it matters, like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I'm certainly not saying Welbeck ahead of Rooney for a central striking option, I'm saying playing him on the wide left ahead of Rooney as he would do the job he was supposed to be doing. I thought you said you were thinking he shouldn't even go. I'm not even annoyed at you now anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Nah definitely not. He should go I just don't know if he should start because of the reasons I've mentioned. Also I completely agree with your assessment of him when playing for Man Utd, especially as you watch a lot more of him than I do at that level. I'm just talking about for England I don't think his performances have been at the same level. Whatever reason that might be, that's why I'm not adverse to trying something different. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinho lad Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Lionel Messi and Wayne Rooney have played in the same number of CL finals (in fact maybe just 2). Messi has 3 goals, Rooney has 0. Let's not compare anything about them. http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2011/05/29/sports/28goallive7/28goallive7-blog480.jpg Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Nah definitely not. He should go I just don't know if he should start because of the reasons I've mentioned. Also I completely agree with your assessment of him when playing for Man Utd, especially as you watch a lot more of him than I do at that level. I'm just talking about for England I don't think his performances have been at the same level. Whatever reason that might be, that's why I'm not adverse to trying something different. I wouldn't have brought club form into it except people childishly bring up the "when does he do it in big times" argument. Sturridge should absolutely play up top for England like, but Rooney starts. No question. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Yeah Cronaldo scored a hat trick against Portugal to take his country to the WC. Just scored the equaliser against their bitter rivals. Scored in 5 consecutive Clasicos. Scored in the CL final. People may say that but they are wrong. Say the same for Rooney? Bring out the massive moments. I can think of a couple. If the best you have is a CL group game then your point is defunct. I'm talking RVP single handily taking his team to the CL. Scoring winners against City and Arsenal. I'm not saying he's not a great player. Obviously he should start for England. But world class? GTFOH. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Don't start with this recent years s**** like . Your claim is major tournaments because Rooney in that last two years for England has 10 in 15 games as a deep player. Is that s**** or something now? This is England's problem. Nothing is ever good enough. Messi has played in two World Cups and scored one goal by the way. The comparison isn't laughable at all, just people are in denial about Rooney. Rooney and Messi have almost identical international records except 14 of Messi's goals were in competitive games, compared to Rooney's 28. Messi was very good in the last world cup except against Germany. This was generally accepted at the time but people seem to have forgotten this Sorry, but I don't buy this at all. Messi was decent, he wasn't the only one at fault for not going further, but to say he was very good is simply not true. He didn't score, was extremely ineffective in front of goal and did well against poor teams. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/mar/10/toni-kroos-open-to-manchester-united-move-bayern-munich-champions-league?CMP=twt_gu Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I think he's also scored more competitive goals than any other player for England. Not that it matters, like. Crouch has a very impressive goals record for England... Well Rooney probably has treble whatever Crouch has at least. Don't starting backing up Pilko's 'different option' talk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Lionel Messi and Wayne Rooney have played in the same number of CL finals (in fact maybe just 2). Messi has 3 goals, Rooney has 0. Let's not compare anything about them. Wrong again. So Wayne Rooney has scored in any of his 3 finals? Messi has 2 in 2 IIRC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 He'd be crackers if he left Bayern to go to Man Utd. Not so much if Ferguson was in charge for his own development as a player but to leave the chance of being managed by Pep to Moyes. Just why? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinho lad Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 would be a superb signing for those cunts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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