Hatem Ben Arfa (now retired?)

[thomas]

1 hour ago, LiquidAK said:

Anyone who offers even the mildest criticism towards the brightest spark we had amidst a decade or more of abject misery needs their hard-drive checked. If our mod team had the stones they'd be making referrals to the relevant authorities imo.

[PauloGeordio]

7 hours ago, ryanegg said:

 

It's mainly the ones who lapped up the shite put out to them by Ashley/Pardew. 

 

Never forget that flag with him as Ché Guevara, he really was that beacon of hope in some dire years. Would love for him to do a talk-in of some sorts. 

[The College Dropout]

I love HBA.

 

But I think he played under one of the better managers for him, with us. I don't think Rafa or Howe would have any time for him at all. But after KK and Robson - I think Pardew is the NUFC manager of recent times that would have tried to work with him most.

 

He is underrated in the wider footballing world. He was better than Taarabt, levels better imo. All that needs to be said is HBA was considered the better talent out of him and Benzema. And Benzema was considered an A1 talent himself

[huss9]

21 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

I love HBA.

 

But I think he played under one of the better managers for him, with us. I don't think Rafa or Howe would have any time for him at all. But after KK and Robson - I think Pardew is the NUFC manager of recent times that would have tried to work with him most.

 

He is underrated in the wider footballing world. He was better than Taarabt, levels better imo. All that needs to be said is HBA was considered the better talent out of him and Benzema. And Benzema was considered an A1 talent himself

pardew fucked it up in the end.

[kingxlnc]

3 hours ago, The College Dropout said:

I love HBA.

 

But I think he played under one of the better managers for him, with us. I don't think Rafa or Howe would have any time for him at all. But after KK and Robson - I think Pardew is the NUFC manager of recent times that would have tried to work with him most.

 

He is underrated in the wider footballing world. He was better than Taarabt, levels better imo. All that needs to be said is HBA was considered the better talent out of him and Benzema. And Benzema was considered an A1 talent himself

He would have loved it under McClaren - no discipline, can do whatever he wants etc

Wouldn't have minded it personally - he was way better than Cabella and Thauvin and all the other wasters we signed to try and replace his magic

Agree he's levels above Taraabt, annoys me they're both considered 'streets wouldn't forget' players in equal measure and that's all

[Holloway]

10 hours ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

I don’t think lack of effort or selfishness was ever his problem, it was more non-conformism and an inability to just accept whatever football and football people want you to do. Maybe along with artistic or extremely sensitive personality that leads to you being depressed about the state of things, angry when the manager criticises you etc. 

 

I don’t know but I don’t think his on-pitch work was ever really the main problem. 

 

 

 

It was more of an observation that the initial reaction to Hatem was a negative one ,rather than marvelling in his outrageous flashes of footballing ability. A mention of Obertan and Gouffran would see somewhat of a piping down in the conversation 

[TheBrownBottle]

4 hours ago, The College Dropout said:

I love HBA.

 

But I think he played under one of the better managers for him, with us. I don't think Rafa or Howe would have any time for him at all. But after KK and Robson - I think Pardew is the NUFC manager of recent times that would have tried to work with him most.

 

He is underrated in the wider footballing world. He was better than Taarabt, levels better imo. All that needs to be said is HBA was considered the better talent out of him and Benzema. And Benzema was considered an A1 talent himself

Robson wouldn’t have put up with his nonsense for long either.

 

KK would’ve offered his fullbacks outside if they’d continually asked HBA to track back.

[The College Dropout]

1 hour ago, kingxlnc said:

He would have loved it under McClaren - no discipline, can do whatever he wants etc

Wouldn't have minded it personally - he was way better than Cabella and Thauvin and all the other wasters we signed to try and replace his magic

Agree he's levels above Taraabt, annoys me they're both considered 'streets wouldn't forget' players in equal measure and that's all

Not a single player put 5 good performances together in a row under Steve.  

 

3 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

Robson wouldn’t have put up with his nonsense for long either.

 

KK would’ve offered his fullbacks outside if they’d continually asked HBA to track back.

Robson put up with wild and lazy characters his whole career and got the best out of them.  

[ryanegg]

 

 

6 hours ago, PauloGeordio said:

 

I've got a photo next to it from that day. Was such a shit game and by far the worst atmosphere I had witnessed at SJP. Was my last game under Ashley.

[Heron]

Wasted talent

[TheBrownBottle]

2 hours ago, The College Dropout said:

Not a single player put 5 good performances together in a row under Steve.  

 

Robson put up with wild and lazy characters his whole career and got the best out of them.  

You'll need to name them - it was only towards the end of his time with NUFC that he seemed to lose control over the idiots.  Don't remember him entertaining this with Ipswich, his European clubs or England - it was perform or you're out.  HBA put in very few good performances relative to his talent.  Pardew was the perfect manager for him as he could indulge him.

[Shays Given Tim Flowers]

Romario at PSV. 

[The College Dropout]

Laurent Robert.  Kieron Dyer.  Craig Bellamy. 
 

I remember Bobby saying sometimes he would sub Robert and he wouldn’t have sweat on his back.   He would’ve got a tune out of past-it Kluivert too. 
 

He managed king lunatic himself Romario a true GOAT - Bobby knew he was special and he indulged him. Sir Bobbby valued talent if you would deliver for him.  Bobby knew what Robert and Bellamy were like when he signed them and that’s probably why they weren’t first choice.  But he knew he could get a song out of them.  
 

Hear Bellamy speak on Bobby. He would’ve day Bobby made him feel like Didier Drogba. 

 

[The College Dropout]

HBA under prime Carlo would’ve been immense. Would’ve built a system that let HBA walk around for 60 minutes 

[Ellis H]

Robert gave Bobby loads of hassle both on and off the pitch but he always supported him and played him. He knew the value of a talented, match winning maverick. 
 

Meanwhile…

 

 

 

[TheBrownBottle]

2 hours ago, The College Dropout said:

Laurent Robert.  Kieron Dyer.  Craig Bellamy. 
 

I remember Bobby saying sometimes he would sub Robert and he wouldn’t have sweat on his back.   He would’ve got a tune out of past-it Kluivert too. 
 

He managed king lunatic himself Romario a true GOAT - Bobby knew he was special and he indulged him. Sir Bobbby valued talent if you would deliver for him.  Bobby knew what Robert and Bellamy were like when he signed them and that’s probably why they weren’t first choice.  But he knew he could get a song out of them.  
 

Hear Bellamy speak on Bobby. He would’ve day Bobby made him feel like Didier Drogba. 

 

 

6 minutes ago, Ellis H said:

Robert gave Bobby loads of hassle both on and off the pitch but he always supported him and played him. He knew the value of a talented, match winning maverick. 
 

Meanwhile…

 

 

 

Robert's output is why he was selected.  Bellamy was possibly the hardest-working forward I've seen in B&W.  Romario scored fucking truckloads and was a sublime forward.

 

As I said, Robson towards the end of his time with NUFC was a reduced figure - which is why the real pisstaking commenced.  There is zero chance a lazy HBA with little output is indulged.

[Ellis H]

According to transfermarkt 
 

HBA got 30 g/a’s in the equivalent of 56.6 games.

 

Robert got 87 g/a’s in the equivalent of 151.5 games. 
 

Also bear in mind the quality of manager and teammates at the time. 

[Rich]

5 hours ago, TheBrownBottle said:

You'll need to name them - it was only towards the end of his time with NUFC that he seemed to lose control over the idiots.  Don't remember him entertaining this with Ipswich, his European clubs or England - it was perform or you're out.  HBA put in very few good performances relative to his talent.  Pardew was the perfect manager for him as he could indulge him.

Found one, get in.

[Rich]

3 hours ago, Ellis H said:

According to transfermarkt 
 

HBA got 30 g/a’s in the equivalent of 56.6 games.

 

Robert got 87 g/a’s in the equivalent of 151.5 games. 
 

Also bear in mind the quality of manager and teammates at the time. 

Aye, it’s just absolute nonsense to say he had poor output. Complete rewriting of history.

[Optimistic Nut]

3 hours ago, Ellis H said:

According to transfermarkt 
 

HBA got 30 g/a’s in the equivalent of 56.6 games.

 

Robert got 87 g/a’s in the equivalent of 151.5 games. 
 

Also bear in mind the quality of manager and teammates at the time. 

 

Robert in a time where there were 2 wingers and 2 strikers so numbers were naturally spread out more. HBA in a time of 1 striker and two wide men. 

[Rich]

Ben Arfa managed a goal or assist every 193 minutes here across all competitions.

 

Robert managed a goal or assist every 204 minutes across all competitions.

 

Also much preferred watching Ben Arfa, myself, even though I was an avid Robert botherer back in the day.

[Fak]

But Robert is the greatest player to have ever played for Newcastle though

[Mattoon]

HBA is one of my favourite ever players, he was unplayable in his pomp and in the early days he tore teams to shreds. It was only when things began to come unstuck for Pardew and he threw HBA under the bus that he started to become anonymous. HBA was a player that needed constant smoke blown up him, he needed to feel like the main man but instead he was ostracised, blamed and hung out to dry and too many supporters bought into the blame game when the real problem was Pardew.

 

There's not many managers that could handle a mercurial talent such as his but I agree Sir Bobby would have been the perfect manager for him, his ability to put his arm around a player and make them feel bigger than life would have got him fired up. I'm not saying HBA was innocent, he was his own worst enemy and should have been one of the best players of his generation, he did himself no favours with his attitude, he was a diva, but that usually goes hand in hand with the immense skill he possessed.

 

Losing Ben Arfa was one of the lowest points I've ever had watching NUFC, harder to take than relegation.

[Optimistic Nut]

Criminal that he was dropped for Gosling and Sammy Ameobi at the time. 

 

Actually thought on paper Cabella was a cracking replacement for him, obviously just didn't work out for him. 

[kingxlnc]

58 minutes ago, Mattoon said:

HBA is one of my favourite ever players, he was unplayable in his pomp and in the early days he tore teams to shreds. It was only when things began to come unstuck for Pardew and he threw HBA under the bus that he started to become anonymous. HBA was a player that needed constant smoke blown up him, he needed to feel like the main man but instead he was ostracised, blamed and hung out to dry and too many supporters bought into the blame game when the real problem was Pardew.

 

There's not many managers that could handle a mercurial talent such as his but I agree Sir Bobby would have been the perfect manager for him, his ability to put his arm around a player and make them feel bigger than life would have got him fired up. I'm not saying HBA was innocent, he was his own worst enemy and should have been one of the best players of his generation, he did himself no favours with his attitude, he was a diva, but that usually goes hand in hand with the immense skill he possessed.

 

Losing Ben Arfa was one of the lowest points I've ever had watching NUFC, harder to take than relegation.

Agreed with everything here

 

But I also think Keegan would have worked very well with him, he told Beresford to work twice as hard to make up for Ginolas work ethic. Keegan loved flair players and in an alternative timeline, when he was here in 2008, he would have stayed and signed HBA to be his Beardsley/Ginola