The College Dropout Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Keegan was out of the game for a few years himself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Collage Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 So is Garde... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest antz1uk Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Since Keegan our last few managers have been: out of the game for years, promoted assistants, had absolutely no experience whatsoever, dredged up from League One. What makes people thing Carver won't get the job with our track record? It's a good question. But...it could be that not even Fat Mike fail to realise that appointing Carver would mean relegation. I also hope Graham Carr has a major say in all this. Quick reminder that this is the same Mike Ashley who less than 2 years ago, without consulting Carr or the manager, appointed Joe Kinnear as Director of Football to steady the ship after we finished 16th with our second lowest PL points total ever. the only thing that is giving me slight hope is that apparently Carr had to really be persuaded not to fuck off after that shambles. hopefully it is him that has been given the remit of advising on someone else as he's the golden goose in all of this. although it's not like they've been known to lie to staff before to get their own way Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 I don't see Carr as the messiah, some would say he is as complicit as Pardew and Carver. He is however, our only real hope of positive change. As he seems to actually watch football. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 I don't see Carr as the messiah, some would say he is as complicit as Pardew and Carver. He is however, our only real hope of positive change. As he seems to actually watch football. If Pardew deserves stick for working for Ashley then so does Carr, he obviously wants a good job as much as anyone else. The difference is he seems to know what he's doing. Problem is, he can suggest as many managers as he wants. Then the club meets them, they're too expensive, they won't be complete patsies, and they fail to do a deal. Would Carr resign over that? I doubt it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 I don't see Carr as the messiah, some would say he is as complicit as Pardew and Carver. He is however, our only real hope of positive change. As he seems to actually watch football. How? Because he works for the regime and does what he's told by Mike Ashley. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Guilty by association. If the club ignore his recommendations on recruitment and the use of his players (Mbiwa for example) and he puts up with it, isn't he as much of a patsy as Pardew. The only difference being that Pardew paraded himself in front of the cameras every week, lying through his teeth, which Carr isn't in the position to do. I don't mind making a judgment on people by the company that they keep. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 I'm guessing part of the interview process involved agreeing to be bound by confidentiality agreements etc. Can't let myself believe it's anything more than that. I think that would only apply if he was still in consideration for the job. I can't see why he would consider himself duty bound if he'd ruled himself out. Clutching at straws maybe but at this point it's all we've got. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 The other difference being Carr is competent while Pardew was crap. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 The other difference being Carr is competent while Pardew was crap. Absolutely. It's his competence that gives us some slight hope. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Well yeah, but that's a difference of competence rather than a difference of intent. FWIW I didn't blame Pardew for sticking to his position either, but if one is complicit then they both are. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallace Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 I have certain reservations about Carr and how much influence he has. If he has a lot, is he really doing a great job? He has been a manager himself so he will understand the problems having an understrength team will cause. We have been lightweight in defence and with strikers for years now but there does not seem to have been any real intent to improve those areas. Is he suggesting loads of players but the club just focus on the midfielder because he is the biggest bargain and potentially will bring in the greatest profit? Does he not realise that we need some leaders on that pitch. His one real success so far has been Cabaye. Other players have done a decent job for us but is their potential to be any more than a decent Premier League player and realise the profit they seem to hanker after. (Perez is rumoured to have discovered by that scout in Spain and it is still early days for him). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Nah, because Pardew's remit was inclusive of selling payers and throwing games. Carr literally scouts players. True, what I mean is they are both carrying out the instructions from Ashley. Carr might prefer to scout £10m players but he's scouting £3m players because that's his remit. Pardew might prefer to keep Cabaye but he's peddled him because those were his instructions. Kind of an philosophical point TBH Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ste Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Pardew was 100% complicit, and it was clear as day. Carr does his job extremely well at scouting quality players. He may know they'll be sold on at a profit but I think most scouts are aware that this is how their club will operate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Incandenza Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 He has been a manager himself so he will understand the problems having an understrength team will cause. We have been lightweight in defence and with strikers for years now but there does not seem to have been any real intent to improve those areas. We tried to sign Douglas the summer before last. This summer gone we tried to sign Alderweid. We bought two strikers. I don't think Carr can be held to account for Riviere being a flop, because just about any striker bought for only 6 million would be a flop in the Premier League; he was limited by the club's stinginess. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Carrs competence increases Mike Ashley's benefit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ste Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Carrs competence increases Mike Ashley's benefit. I dunno, can we hate him for doing his job well? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 It's not about hating him, but he is a pretty important part of the Ashley regime. There's a whole range of perspectives about Ashley's tenure. Do you look at NUFC relative to Ashley's continued ownership or do you accept the only way forward for the club is to get Ashley out? I'm being rhetorical. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Well yeah, but that's a difference of competence rather than a difference of intent. FWIW I didn't blame Pardew for sticking to his position either, but if one is complicit then they both are. I hated Pardew because he was absolutely fucking terrible in every conceivable way. If he'd been good at his job (as I believe that Carr is) then I can't honestly put my hand on my heart and say that I'd have given a shit if he was complicit or not. As it happened it was just another stick to beat him with because one of the defences of Pardew was often about his hands being tied, and it was the retort to that that highlighted him being complicit, it wasn't necessarily a criticism on its own. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Let's get one thing here very clear: I did and do not hate Alan Pardew because he was part of Ashley's regime. I hate him because he's a fucking horrible human being and an even worse, negative, soul crushingly boring manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Although Carr's status as some kind of god scout is probably overblown there's nothing to suggest he isn't fit for purpose in his role. So I fail to see how he's 'complicit' just by doing his job? Everyone working at the club is complicit by association if that's the case. Like Pardew, Carver is complicit because, despite being dogshit, he's insisting on giving his managerial dreams a whirl and dragging us towards the relegation zone whilst spouting the club's PR nonsense to the press. He's helping to maintain the mid-table mediocrity Mike Ashley is content with, Carr isn't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 My only real annoyance with Carr is that despite being a 'fan', he's complicit in finding players for the purpose of resale value who aren't particularly suitable for the team. I also think if he truly 'has Ashley's ear' a more concentrated effort to stress the need for a proper manager and squad of players would be justified. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 I'm guessing part of the interview process involved agreeing to be bound by confidentiality agreements etc. Can't let myself believe it's anything more than that. I think that would only apply if he was still in consideration for the job. I can't see why he would consider himself duty bound if he'd ruled himself out. Clutching at straws maybe but at this point it's all we've got. Surely it's because Ashley would sue him if he broke the agreed confidentiality clause. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DahnSahf Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 I'm guessing part of the interview process involved agreeing to be bound by confidentiality agreements etc. Can't let myself believe it's anything more than that. I think that would only apply if he was still in consideration for the job. I can't see why he would consider himself duty bound if he'd ruled himself out. Clutching at straws maybe but at this point it's all we've got. Surely it's because Ashley would sue him if he broke the agreed confidentiality clause. There is another possible explanation for the confidentiality terms and the apparent leakage of pro Carver sentiments to the local press. Bearing in mind the club's well established Machiavellian tendencies, it could be that their sole purpose is to make Carver himself believe he's still in with a shout of the job! If the club intends, or has even already arranged, to make a sensible appointment in the summer they still need JC to keep us out of a relegation battle in the meantime. In that case, the last thing they'd want is for him to suspect that his fate's already sealed. Remember, when asked if he'd be prepared to take charge just for the rest of the season, he said he'd have to think about it. Moreover, if he's out on his ear they wouldn't want the players knowing yet either. Not if they want to stay up. Yeah, I know. Just sayin' ...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 We're through the looking glass now people. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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