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Rafa Benítez (now unemployed)

Greg

by Greg
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kingxlnc

kingxlnc

Posted
Posted

Rafa managed to turn Ayoze Perez into a £30m player. 

Longstaff we wanted £50m for, for his form under Rafa

Almiron prior to this season's form, last showed this type of form under Rafa, the first season he joined before he got injured (minus the goals)

Rondon was a great fit here

Lascelles thrived as captain

Dubravka was an unknown, and a steal

Schar and Leujene were relatively unknown and both steals

He managed with very very paltry resources to make a competitive team that finished 10th!

 

It was ridiculous what he achieved - that NUFC which came up is probably the worst, man-for-man in the PL era, compared to the other teams. 

 

It was the definition of solid and unspectacular. 

 

Ashley didn't want to compete - who else can make miracles happen with a 5m reserve striker from Stoke as your first choice? 

 

I can't believe the revisionism in this thread. 

 

Rafa achieved amazing things against the odds and had to make do with whatever he was given. 

To be honest he is similar to Howe in terms of how well drilled his sides are, they know their roles and he improves players no end. 

 

And when he's backed, he is very attacking, his Real Madrid side, his Liverpool sides all had record wins under him. 

 

When he's the underdog, he has to adapt - e.g. Valencia, smaller budget but his pragmatic style won through. Ditto Liverpool 2005, not the best team - but in 2008 when they had Alonso and Torres they finished second and scored tons of goals. Ditto us, not a great team but if he actually got money to spend (e.g Almiron) the signs were there it was all going in the right direction and would have had us competing for a top half finish. 

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TRon

TRon

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, The College Dropout said:

Aye Bruce did do a decent job at first. Aye a lot of it is down to using Rafa's template but he still did a decent job.

 

No he didn't. It was all based on Rafa's structure, the only thing he managed to do was gradually destroy it, which most of us predicted would happen. He didn't do a decent job, he was just there.

 

 

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andycap

andycap

Posted
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2 hours ago, magvicar said:

I'm not defending Bruce other than to say he came in and did a decent job at first. Benitez did a decent job at first. Pardew did a decent job at first.

Hughton did a decent job at first.

I could go on and on about managers that come in and do a decent job at first.

If that's defending them then Rafa is also in that.

 

 

 

Benitez finished strongly we looked like we'd push on the next season. So don't understand the started of well then lost the plot narrative. 

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Chris_R

Chris_R

Posted
Posted

image.thumb.png.c34d8c676848d6700bfb01828f9fd832.png

 

Media: "Bruce averaged about the same as Benitez", which whilst it might mathematically be provable, it's absolutely baffling that people swallow this. But they do, time and again.

 

Benitez took a shit team and made them good over time. Bruce took a good team and made them shit over time. These 2 achievements are not the same.

 

Then add in their relative net spends. Benitez achieved what he did with a negative spend, Bruce spent a shitload to actually go backwards. Then the flag on top of the turd on top of the cake is how Bruce treated the fans, and belittled any hope we might think we should have, playing down expectations to match his own incompetence.

 

I know football is about opinions, but it's incomprehensible that anyone on here is trying to legitimately equate the 2 managers in any meaningful way.

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magvicar

magvicar

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Conjo said:

 

He came in and gave the players more time off as I remember it, which Shelvey was a big fan of.

He wasn't perfect by any stretch of the imagination.

As I said earlier I was glad to see him go but I say it how I saw it and see it and his time at Newcastle was a mad mixture which included some good, just as Rafa's was, yet I enjoyed the football under Bruce much better, for a while than I did under Rafa, premier league wise.

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The College Dropout

The College Dropout

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, TRon said:

 

No he didn't. It was all based on Rafa's structure, the only thing he managed to do was gradually destroy it, which most of us predicted would happen. He didn't do a decent job, he was just there.

 

 

That doesn't matter. If I go into a job and keep the things that worked well previously and achieve comparable results that were seen as a success - I would have done a decent job.

 

You're letting your personal bias cloud your judgement. 

 

Obviously Rafa did a better job. He built that foundation and he managed the fans much better.

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magvicar

magvicar

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Conjo said:

 

I maybe wrong here, and I refuse to read myself up on it as I don't want to refresh my memory of the Bruce "era", but I seem to remember his start being riddled with excuses about players not being able to play his system because they were too drilled in the way Rafa had them play, so he ended up setting the team up very much like Rafa did, without knowing the system or instructions which resulted in the "boring" football and added bonus of not even being defensively solid. Then a few "judge me after x amount of time".

 

Which first period exactly was the good one? :lol:

Good?

I didn't say that. 

I said better.

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TRon

TRon

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

That doesn't matter. If I go into a job and keep the things that worked well previously and achieve comparable results that were seen as a success - I would have done a decent job.

 

You're letting your personal bias cloud your judgement. 

 

Obviously Rafa did a better job. He built that foundation and he managed the fans much better.

 

It's not personal bias, I just don't agree Bruce did a good job. As @Chris_R has shown quite graphically, the only thing Bruce did a good job of was taking us on a downward trajectory.

 

I think John Carver or one of the three Steves could have done the same job when they weren't stuffing their faces with all day breakfasts at the training ground caf. Is that doing a good job? Not by my definition.

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Danh1

Danh1

Posted
Posted (edited)

Bruce’s idea of having a go was bringing every attacking player off the bench on for defensive players when we were getting beat and completely ruining the shape of the team, not that there was much of a coordinated plan in the first place like. 
 

Doesn’t work on Football Manager or real life, that.

 

 

Edited by Danh1

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magvicar

magvicar

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Danh1 said:

Bruce’s idea of having a go was bringing every attacking player off the bench on for defensive players when we were getting beat and completely ruining the shape of the team, not that there was much of a coordinated plan in the first place like. 
 

Doesn’t work on Football Manager or real life, that.

 

 

 

Aye he was gung-ho many a time but I call it having a go regardless and his track record is favourable with Rafa's but overall better football for games played excluding Rafa's championship season.

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