The "delighted Ashley has gone, but uncomfortable with Saudi ownership" thread

[Hovagod]

5 minutes ago, Broadsword said:

Education is good but I don’t really get the point? Educate me on something I can relate to and impact by all means but what exactly do I do? Can I vote or make a donation or something? 

Well there is no point outside of your first three words, I suppose. Education is good.

[Wallsendmag]

25 minutes ago, Hovagod said:

Lots of people do, and are concerned about the ownership and its implications. And as such they are attempting to educate people like you who don’t know about what exactly we are in bed with here. You’re bothered or you’re not but they are fully entitled to help people understand. 

 

I thought they'd had to legally prove separation from the State before the PL would allow them to pass the owners and directors test?

[RUHRLYASLEEVESUP]

Just now, Wallsendmag said:

 

I thought they'd had to legally prove separation from the State before the PL would allow them to pass the owners and directors test?

They did

[Wallsendmag]

2 minutes ago, RUHRLYASLEEVESUP said:

They did

 

In that case where is the problem? PIF are an investment group, the Reubens have been involved in the city of Newcastle for years and Amanda and Mehrdad are simply wonderful people.

[tomlynnherrington]

1 minute ago, Wallsendmag said:

 

In that case where is the problem? PIF are an investment group, the Reubens have been involved in the city of Newcastle for years and Amanda and Mehrdad are simply wonderful people.

The only real problem is on Wierdside,predictably.

[RUHRLYASLEEVESUP]

2 minutes ago, Wallsendmag said:

 

In that case where is the problem? PIF are an investment group, the Reubens have been involved in the city of Newcastle for years and Amanda and Mehrdad are simply wonderful people.

Fo me there is no problem, if we were owned by the Saudi state then fair enough there would obviously be some misgivings on my behalf, however as we stand were owned by an investment group including as you correctly elude to the Reuben's, Amanda et al, but lets not get he facts get in the way of a story eh. Cant stand it when people try to force theyre opinion down others throats, not one word written on any forum wil lever change things however strongly we feel about whatever the situation is.

Hey ho im just enjoying the ride & whats to come 

[Shays Given Tim Flowers]

There really isn't a non-sporting justification for them being involved with the club at all. 

[The Prophet]

4 minutes ago, Wallsendmag said:

 

I thought they'd had to legally prove separation from the State before the PL would allow them to pass the owners and directors test?

 

PIF are the sovereign wealth fund of KSA. 

 

It's a subjective moral dilemma, so it'll naturally divide the fan base. That's why a healthy discourse is decent, but instead it's already become very tribal. There's no getting away from our association with KSA, but everyone will feel differently about it. 

[Wallsendmag]

11 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

 

PIF are the sovereign wealth fund of KSA. 

 

It's a subjective moral dilemma, so it'll naturally divide the fan base. That's why a healthy discourse is decent, but instead it's already become very tribal. There's no getting away from our association with KSA, but everyone will feel differently about it. 

 

Tbh in the real world I'm yet to speak to a Newcastle United supporter (friends, workmates, family members etc) who isn't absolutely ecstatic with our new owners so I don't think there is a natural divide as such here.

[Whitley mag]

1 hour ago, Wallsendmag said:

 

Tbh in the real world I'm yet to speak to a Newcastle United supporter (friends, workmates, family members etc) who isn't absolutely ecstatic with our new owners so I don't think there is a natural divide as such here.

There is no divide in the real world mate just with a few conflicted individuals who want to weigh us all down with their moral dilemmas.

 

As for being educated what a load of patronising shite, I’m fully aware of what goes on over there and don’t need some condescending souls taking the moral high ground preaching to me when I go to the match.

 

They don’t want to educate anyone they want the Saudis out of the club, try squaring that off with Tyneside at the minute. Everyone has the right to protest but when fans openly voted in favour of these owners, don’t expect a free ride when your aim is to kick them out. The world is full of protests and counter protests, those of us who fully back PIF’s involvement have every right to question the motives of these individuals and what they are hoping to achieve, which is far more than simply raising awareness as some claim on here.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 2, 2022 by Whitley mag

[RUHRLYASLEEVESUP]

17 minutes ago, Whitley mag said:

There is no divide in the real world mate just with a few conflicted individuals who want to weigh us all down with their moral dilemmas.

 

As for being educated what a load of patronising shite, I’m fully aware of what goes on over there and don’t need some condescending souls taking the moral high ground preaching to me when I go to the match.

 

They don’t want to educate anyone they want the Saudis out of the club, try squaring that off with Tyneside at the minute. Everyone has the right to protest but when fans openly voted in favour of these owners, don’t expect a free ride when your aim is to kick them out. The world is full of protests and counter protests, those of us who fully back PIF’s involvement have every right to question the motives of these individuals and what they are hoping to achieve, which is far more than simply raising awareness as some claim on here.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Excellent, well written.

[Barnes23]

39 minutes ago, Whitley mag said:

There is no divide in the real world mate just with a few conflicted individuals who want to weigh us all down with their moral dilemmas.

 

As for being educated what a load of patronising shite, I’m fully aware of what goes on over there and don’t need some condescending souls taking the moral high ground preaching to me when I go to the match.

 

They don’t want to educate anyone they want the Saudis out of the club, try squaring that off with Tyneside at the minute. Everyone has the right to protest but when fans openly voted in favour of these owners, don’t expect a free ride when your aim is to kick them out. The world is full of protests and counter protests, those of us who fully back PIF’s involvement have every right to question the motives of these individuals and what they are hoping to achieve, which is far more than simply raising awareness as some claim on here.

 

 

That's the distinction, like. If they are agitating to remove PIF they can expect to face some hostilities in turn from some quarters, whatever their motives. 

 

Personally, I think the practical separation between the political and social formation of SA (with all of it's cultural complexities, contradictions and directions of travel for the future) and NUFC on a matchday is so huge it's hard to see what such a protest is really hoping or expecting to achieve. 

 

 

Edited November 2, 2022 by Barnes23

[JumpersForGoalposts]

I wonder if the anti-PIF crowd are also righteous enough to never buy any goods made in China, use any Russian gas or fill their cars with middle eastern petrol.

 

No, thought not. Hidden agenda bell ends.

[The Prophet]

18 minutes ago, JumpersForGoalposts said:

I wonder if the anti-PIF crowd are also righteous enough to never buy any goods made in China, use any Russian gas or fill their cars with middle eastern petrol.

 

No, thought not. Hidden agenda bell ends.

 

A perfect example of unhelpful, tribal nonsense.

[Kid Icarus]

3 hours ago, tomlynnherrington said:

Does anyone celebrate any less after we’ve scored and at the final whistle? I knew very little about Saudi Arabia’s human rights record before Ashley sold up and I know the exact same amount now.I don’t do politics.

 

 

 

Me tbh. I was just saying last week that I'm maxing out at about 75%. I know somethings still missing, part of it's the damage done by Ashley, part of it's our owners.

 

Not everyone's the same.

[teohgk]

It’s ok for the West to send troops over to middle east and invade countries causing death of thousands citizens , but it’s not ok for the middle east country to send money over to UK investing football club.

 

[Kid Icarus]

2 hours ago, Wallsendmag said:

 

Tbh in the real world I'm yet to speak to a Newcastle United supporter (friends, workmates, family members etc) who isn't absolutely ecstatic with our new owners so I don't think there is a natural divide as such here.

I think in some ways the forum is more akin to the real world tbh. Or at least it has a wider spread of views evenif they'renot all equallyrepresentative of a majority. All of us on here have our own bubbles, but it's on here that we talk to other fans from other bubbles.

[Kid Icarus]

Just now, teohgk said:

It’s ok for the West to send troops over to middle east and invade countries causing death of thousands citizens , but it’s not ok for the middle east country to send money over to UK investing football club.

 

Nah it's not ok for the west to do that. I'd be surprised if anyone on here has the view you've come up with there like.

[Myleftboot]

27 minutes ago, JumpersForGoalposts said:

I wonder if the anti-PIF crowd are also righteous enough to never buy any goods made in China, use any Russian gas or fill their cars with middle eastern petrol.

 

No, thought not. Hidden agenda bell ends.

Or use Facebook,watch a Disney film or go on holiday in a Boeing aircraft.

[Wallsendmag]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

I think in some ways the forum is more akin to the real world tbh. Or at least it has a wider spread of views evenif they'renot all equallyrepresentative of a majority. All of us on here have our own bubbles, but it's on here that we talk to other fans from other bubbles.

 

I'd disagree with that tbh. Social media, whether that's Twitter, Facebook, forums or whatever tend to have a high proportion of weirdos! A perfect example is RTG. I can guarantee that your average Sunderland fan isn't like that  Real life is real life however. You go in any pub before the match next Wednesday or next Saturday and I guarantee you'd struggle to find anyone unhappy with our owners.

 

As I say I'm yet to have a real life conversation with anyone who isn't happy with our ownership model. 

[Kid Icarus]

29 minutes ago, JumpersForGoalposts said:

I wonder if the anti-PIF crowd are also righteous enough to never buy any goods made in China, use any Russian gas or fill their cars with middle eastern petrol.

 

No, thought not. Hidden agenda bell ends.

 

'You take part in society so you can't suggest we should make it better' is a terrible point like. No idea why people continue to waste their time on that one.

[Shays Given Tim Flowers]

Being wilfully blind is still being blind to something. 
 

If PIF ran the club like Mike Ashley I think the opposition to their involvement would be more prominent. 
 

 

[Kid Icarus]

7 minutes ago, Wallsendmag said:

 

I'd disagree with that tbh. Social media, whether that's Twitter, Facebook, forums or whatever tend to have a high proportion of weirdos! A perfect example is RTG. I can guarantee that your average Sunderland fan isn't like that  Real life is real life however. You go in any pub before the match next Wednesday or next Saturday and I guarantee you'd struggle to find anyone unhappy with our owners.

 

As I say I'm yet to have a real life conversation with anyone who isn't happy with our ownership model. 

Aye, but the point is that my real life and your real life aren't the same. It reads like you're saying real life is the majority alone and no one else, I'm just saying the minority against the owners make up a proportion of that real life.

 

As far as online communities go, N-O isn't too bad for weirdos compared to Twitter or RTG like you say.

 

 

Edited November 2, 2022 by Kid Icarus

[Wallsendmag]

Just now, Shays Given Tim Flowers said:

Being wilfully blind is still being blind to something. 
 

If PIF ran the club like Mike Ashley I think the opposition to their involvement would be more prominent. 
 

 

 

Totally. And by the same token if they ran the club like Mike Ashley all these Sunderland fans screaming "hewman rights" and "Yemen" wouldn't actually care less about any of that. That's how it works.

[Kid Icarus]

It's also making the point that Newcastle United ranks alongside petrol, Disney, etc and is essentially a product rather than, as you know, something that means much more to us than that.

 

 

Edited November 2, 2022 by Kid Icarus