Eddie Howe

[Gallowgate Toon]

28 minutes ago, Mattoon said:

 

I said this a couple of weeks ago, he has a philosophy and the players are the extension of that, that's why their weaknesses are so glaringly obvious. He's too rigid in his ways to his detriment, Rafa (I know, I know) knew how to utilise the strengths of these players while covering their weaknesses, it wasn't pretty but it was functional, people want pretty you get this though.

For parity, Benitez also went on some pretty terrible runs of results - it can take a while to figure things out and let coaching come through. 

 

Ultimately, we need quality through the door.

[Gallowgate Toon]

2 hours ago, Yorkie said:

Really interesting graphics from that Lawton fella. I don't think there's any question that we play with more structure and intensity, it's they only real visible difference. It just hasn't translated into results. It's the sort of thing that gives you some optimism because it indicates that we're working on building a solid foundation. Improve CB and CM and hopefully we'll start seeing the material impacts. 

I do think Howe is trying to cover weaknesses but keep some form of foundation. I imagine Brentford is how he wants us to play but he quickly saw we couldn't handle that style defensively and has tried to shore up the space between defence and midfield since. To me, that explains his bigger focus on trying to get defensive players in this window so he can reset the shape.

 

I think we do try and counter in a different way to before, with higher pressing and retrieving the ball in the middle of the pitch to get in on goal. Before, we sat right back and would basically run the length of the pitch to get a chance. Joelinton has been amazing at being the guy who wins the ball and gets us on the turn. But what we don't see is commitment in attack when we build play. It feels cautious and like we're waiting for someone to break shape.

 

 

Edited January 17, 2022 by Gallowgate Toon

[GWN]

 

 

food for thought before you start having a go .

[worthy]

1 hour ago, GWN said:

 

 

food for thought before you start having a go .

As stated many many many times. Howe seemingly had a plan and told AS that the players were underperforming and he could get them to do better. So far this is not the case in terms of results and even in some cases metrics that can win you games. He has to deal with what he's got, and he is not dealing with it well imo. He knew what he was accepting, he said he had a plan and knew the players. I'm not letting him go easy just because his name isn't Steve Bruce or pardew.

 

To be like that guy with the green balls or whatever: Plenty or people said that anyone could have this squad playing better, now that he is here it's shifted over to: squad was already so bad can't do anything. So which is more correct? Either way results is what matters and he can't get them 

[elbee909]

Tbf they mostly are playing better. But the results haven't come, fair to say. But what to do about it? Get in another manager at this point? Doesn't seem realistic.

[Optimistic Nut]

Should have beaten Brentford, Man U & Watford. Would have beaten Norwich if it wasn’t for the red card. Even just 2 wins from those and we look healthier.

[MarkyMark]

1 hour ago, GWN said:

 

 

food for thought before you start having a go .

Where did Newcastle finish that season?  Where did that Villa side finish?

 

Not a defence of Ashley's neglect and mismanagement - just this may not be as apt a comparison as the tweeter thinks.  That Villa side couldn't get out of the division, never mind finish mid-table in the PL.  

[MarkyMark]

26 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said:

Should have beaten Brentford, Man U & Watford. Would have beaten Norwich if it wasn’t for the red card. Even just 2 wins from those and we look healthier.

We didn't get the result vs Norwich because Howe and inexplicably still in a job Jones thought Clark was a better bet than Fernandez - a view shared by no-one else who'd seen a Newcastle United match in the previous half-decade.

[Izakaya]

Fuck my arse i forgot Jones was still here. 

[tom1988]

I'm all for backing Howe as manager and he is infinitely better than Bruce as a person but, I don't think he's particularly good.

 

Aside from us being more energetic and pressing more, statistically we're still just as bad as we were with Bruce.

 

Under Bruce this season we conceded an average of 2.375 goals a game and scored 1.25, under Eddie we're conceding an average of 2.1 goals a game and scoring 0.88... Pretty damning for a supposed attack minded coach.

 

Under Bruce we had an average of 39.4% possession per game and under Howe it's 39.88% - again, no improvement!

 

Our xG under Bruce, 0.92, under Howe 0.88

 

Our xG(against) under Bruce was 1.47 and now under Howe 1.73

 

The only stat where there is a noticeable difference is points per game, under Bruce we managed 0.3 and now we're up to the dizzy heights of 0.77 - Bruce also had 2 less home games and twice as many away games as Howe has had.

 

I detested Bruce, he was and is awful and is the epitome of everything that was wrong with the Ashley era but with every passing game we slide closer to relegation because Eddie Howe is just not a very good coach. 

 

In my opinion, if he were a good coach he would have looked at what we have (shit) and tried to make a system work that if not brings the best out of the players at his disposal then at least covers for some of their frailties but that just hasn't happened. It's all well and good having a particular style or identity or idea of how the game should be played but if you haven't got the tools for that (which he hasn't) then you need to adapt and I really don't think Howe has. 

 

Life is certainly better with the new owners and actually being active in the transfer market this month is fun but we're going down whether we like it or not. 

[Dandy Man]

2 minutes ago, tom1988 said:

I'm all for backing Howe as manager and he is infinitely better than Bruce as a person but, I don't think he's particularly good.

 

Aside from us being more energetic and pressing more, statistically we're still just as bad as we were with Bruce.

 

Under Bruce this season we conceded an average of 2.375 goals a game and scored 1.25, under Eddie we're conceding an average of 2.1 goals a game and scoring 0.88... Pretty damning for a supposed attack minded coach.

 

Under Bruce we had an average of 39.4% possession per game and under Howe it's 39.88% - again, no improvement!

 

Our xG under Bruce, 0.92, under Howe 0.88

 

Our xG(against) under Bruce was 1.47 and now under Howe 1.73

 

The only stat where there is a noticeable difference is points per game, under Bruce we managed 0.3 and now we're up to the dizzy heights of 0.77 - Bruce also had 2 less home games and twice as many away games as Howe has had.

 

I detested Bruce, he was and is awful and is the epitome of everything that was wrong with the Ashley era but with every passing game we slide closer to relegation because Eddie Howe is just not a very good coach. 

 

In my opinion, if he were a good coach he would have looked at what we have (shit) and tried to make a system work that if not brings the best out of the players at his disposal then at least covers for some of their frailties but that just hasn't happened. It's all well and good having a particular style or identity or idea of how the game should be played but if you haven't got the tools for that (which he hasn't) then you need to adapt and I really don't think Howe has. 

 

Life is certainly better with the new owners and actually being active in the transfer market this month is fun but we're going down whether we like it or not. 

Surely the sample size of 10 matches for Howe (including away to Arsenal, away to Liverpool and home to Man City) is far too small to be drawing any meaningful conclusions

[gbandit]

Think it’s a bit early to be looking at xG as a comparison as there’s a tiny sample size for Howe, especially as it includes an Arsenal, Liverpool, Man City, Man U and Leicester game. I genuinely think it’s almost impossible to fairly rate Howe on what we’ve seen so far. The only thing that I think we can say is that his in-game management could be better

[Gallowgate Toon]

That is a very, very small sample size.

 

I love the idea that coaching is this thing you just flick on and everything is better. Did Rafa teach us nothing? His whole philosophy was about building up everything and that took time. 

 

Eddie Howe finished 9th with this squad. He clearly has something as a coach.

 

 

Edited January 17, 2022 by Gallowgate Toon

[afcb]

Hello. Thought I'd have a look out of interest as an afcb fan that obviously, like every afcb fan, loves Eddie. One thing I've read a few times is about the attack not linking up properly and the striker being isolated. We had this with him many times when he didn't trust the defence, sacrificing wingers almost making it a back 6 instead of allowing them to attack. If you do get the CB's he's after I'd expect that to change.

 

You probably need more than that, people actually up for a fight unlike the wee cunt, but anyway I hope you do stay up and we play you next season in the PL.

[Kid Icarus]

13 minutes ago, tom1988 said:

I'm all for backing Howe as manager and he is infinitely better than Bruce as a person but, I don't think he's particularly good.

 

Aside from us being more energetic and pressing more, statistically we're still just as bad as we were with Bruce.

 

Under Bruce this season we conceded an average of 2.375 goals a game and scored 1.25, under Eddie we're conceding an average of 2.1 goals a game and scoring 0.88... Pretty damning for a supposed attack minded coach.

 

Under Bruce we had an average of 39.4% possession per game and under Howe it's 39.88% - again, no improvement!

 

Our xG under Bruce, 0.92, under Howe 0.88

 

Our xG(against) under Bruce was 1.47 and now under Howe 1.73

 

The only stat where there is a noticeable difference is points per game, under Bruce we managed 0.3 and now we're up to the dizzy heights of 0.77 - Bruce also had 2 less home games and twice as many away games as Howe has had.

 

I detested Bruce, he was and is awful and is the epitome of everything that was wrong with the Ashley era but with every passing game we slide closer to relegation because Eddie Howe is just not a very good coach. 

 

In my opinion, if he were a good coach he would have looked at what we have (shit) and tried to make a system work that if not brings the best out of the players at his disposal then at least covers for some of their frailties but that just hasn't happened. It's all well and good having a particular style or identity or idea of how the game should be played but if you haven't got the tools for that (which he hasn't) then you need to adapt and I really don't think Howe has. 

 

Life is certainly better with the new owners and actually being active in the transfer market this month is fun but we're going down whether we like it or not. 

5 of the 10 matches you're using for those stats were against Arsenal, Leicester, Liverpool, Man City, Man United. 

[Kid Icarus]

12 minutes ago, afcb said:

Hello. Thought I'd have a look out of interest as an afcb fan that obviously, like every afcb fan, loves Eddie. One thing I've read a few times is about the attack not linking up properly and the striker being isolated. We had this with him many times when he didn't trust the defence, sacrificing wingers almost making it a back 6 instead of allowing them to attack. If you do get the CB's he's after I'd expect that to change.

 

You probably need more than that, people actually up for a fight unlike the wee cunt, but anyway I hope you do stay up and we play you next season in the PL.

 

Thanks for the post and the insight. Feel free to stick around. :thup:

 

Fraser's actually been one of our better players in terms of pressing from the front and doing the dirty work, I'm sure that's annoying for you to read but it's true. The player not doing it (possibly because he's been told to conserve energy) is Saint-Maximin. 

 

 

Edited January 17, 2022 by Kid Icarus

[Hanshithispantz]

I think Howe's main problem hasn't been his coaching like, it's that he's come in with far too much responsibility, which is probably partly his fault as it seems like he blagged the interview.

 

There's some weird tactical decitions he's made which don't look good but I think we could avoid that if we bring some players in.

 

 

Edited January 17, 2022 by Hanshithispantz

[Smal]

Playing Jonjo Shelvey as the only protection for a weak back four is absolutely insane stuff tbh but he’s done it for nearly all of his 10 games now.

 

Think we need to switch to a double pivot asap. He needs to show signs of trying to find a system that actually works for the players we have.

[Optimistic Nut]

2 hours ago, MarkyMark said:

We didn't get the result vs Norwich because Howe and inexplicably still in a job Jones thought Clark was a better bet than Fernandez - a view shared by no-one else who'd seen a Newcastle United match in the previous half-decade.

No problem with a manager taking a few games to notice things like that. It took Rafa until half-time of the Southampton away game for example to suss that S.Taylor was done for and Lascelles was a better option.

[arnonel]

Also dont understand Shelvey in his role. 
He is one of the best passers in the league, but is being used in DM role playing short simple passes.
If he is going to be used in the team, at least use his strengths and try negate the weaknesses

 

 

[Andy]

36 minutes ago, arnonel said:

Also dont understand Shelvey in his role. 
He is one of the best passers in the league, but is being used in DM role playing short simple passes.
If he is going to be used in the team, at least use his strengths and try negate the weaknesses

 

 

 

Think that's the biggest myth in football, personally.

[BGRM]

38 minutes ago, arnonel said:

Also dont understand Shelvey in his role. 
He is one of the best passers in the league, but is being used in DM role playing short simple passes.
If he is going to be used in the team, at least use his strengths and try negate the weaknesses

 

 

I really don’t think he’s one of the best passers in the league like.

[Gazzaschicken]

Shelvy is a great passer in a shite team who can't pass. Remember his debut he hit 2 Cross field diagonal balls he looked amazing and the crowd were giving it the Gary neville orgasms but that was only cause we had years of shite football no1 had done it in so long. 

[r0cafella]

Just now, Gazzaschicken said:

Shelvy is a great passer in a shite team who can't pass. Remember his debut he hit 2 Cross field diagonal balls he looked amazing and the crowd were giving it the Gary neville orgasms but that was only cause we had years of shite football no1 had done it in so long. 

Long passing is bread and butter for any top level central midfielder like. 
 

You could argue he has an eye for a pass but then I look at his assist and key passes and it also doesn’t seem to add up. 

[Lush Vlad]

2 hours ago, ManDoon said:

I think one game is a pretty poor sample size. Also Leeds drag your players all over the shop. He should do the same when we play Leeds again.

 

Pretty sure there was one after our first 3-4 games and the average positions of players was generally a good bit higher up the pitch and we seemed to have a bit more shape and structure.  Which isn't really that surprising.   

 

It does work both ways, of course.  Everyone who is going on about the results, possession, xG, goals scored and conceded etc compared to Bruce.  They are also using a small sample size and not factoring in the strength of opposition that we have faced for more than half of those league games. 

 

Such small margins at this level.  Hang on against Man U, Norwich and Watford and we are a bit more clinical in those games and we could have been 6 points better off.  Brentford felt like points dropped and all.  There is a theme here, mind.  We can't protect a lead.