Froggy Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Shearer, Henry, Bergkamp Aguero, Suarez, Van Nistelrooy, Torres Fowler, Cole, Drogba, Owen, Rooney, etc Probably missed some obvious ones but I’d have them in three tiers like that. Absolutely crazy to have Rooney in that third tier IMO. Scored a shit load of goals but contributed massively in other areas. He's in the top tier, as is Aguero. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Shearer and Henry are the only options at that level imo. No other players have the same combination of great goal scoring numbers, consistency, and non-goalscoring contribution. Aguero doesn't have the non-goalscoring contribution those 2 have and Rooney doesn't have the great goalscoring numbers they have. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Not worthy of a poll: is Sergio Agüero the PL GOAT? I think I'm in the minority that thinks he's canny overrated tbh. His goalscoring numbers are really good, but he's not a player who does anything beyond goalscoring that really wows me, like. Long post alert... I think Aguero is actually underrated as a footballer in terms of his all-round game and all the other attributes he possess outside of his goal scoring ability, here in England and on the international stage. He’s a level above Salah for example for me and at the same level as Harry Kane is right now and maybe just maybe, that little bit better. He’s the best player in the league at current and is one of the best of all-time. I think he’s up there with the likes of Shearer, Henry, Suarez, van Nistelrooy et al, the great great strikers of the past in terms of the Premier League and internationally he’s up there with past greats like Ronaldo, Batistuta etc. as well. I’m not saying he is better or as good, but he belongs to that level of player going back. He’s definitely equal to or above anyone else out there right now who is not named Messi or Ronaldo, anyway. IMO that is. I think he’s so good he’d excel at a Newcastle United under Rafa for example, or Arsenal under Emery, or Man Utd under Mourinho even, or Barcelona or Liverpool. Any team really. Any league. Forget about the goals for a moment, of course he’s a machine and capable of scoring from nothing which makes him deadly in front of goal at all times, inside the box or outside, marked or unmarked. In that regard, he almost guarantees that when he gets a shot away the keeper is either forced into making a save or ends up picking the ball out of the back of the net, and frequently as well. Like I said he’s deadly. City’s all-time record top goal scorer and equal with our own Alan Shearer scoring a hat-trick 11 times and in fewer games/seasons. Albeit he’s predominantly played in a team that when not finishing first, finishes between that and 4th top with players of equal ability all-around him throughout his time in our game. But goalscorimg aside, he’s equally just as competent and as good as a footballer which combined with his non football characteristics elevates him to a very high level very few can reach even if someone scores more goals than him and shares a few of his qualities or has certain qualities he lacks. He doesn’t lack much, mind, not as much as others lack that’s for sure. Take Jamie Vardy for example, he is deadly too, he’s a great finisher, world-class IMO and has been one of the best players in the country over the last few years, but he’s nowhere near as good a footballer as Aguero is or near the level he is at and never will be. Of the two just as an example, Vardy has a poorer technique, less game intelligence when it comes to timing and decision making, a heavier touch when it comes to control, less variation of movement in certain areas of the pitch in space or when tightly marked both on and off the ball and a poorer understanding of what’s around, what’s on and what’s not on, and again on and off the ball, in different areas of the pitch and whichever team is in possession or the type of game being played from both sides. Aguero can adapt to different tactics, positions, roles and oponents and still be effective whether he’s scoring goals or not or involved on the ball or in the final third or not. Those higher levels of technique, skill, touch, vision, intelligence, awareness, understanding, movement and on and off the ball play allied together with his experience, his physical strength, his mobility, his turn of pace, that inner determination, that work-rate, that will to win, his fitness and energy levels during the 90 minutes and that single minded clinical mindset in front of goal are all tools he possesses together combined that he consistently demonstrates effectively and at a high level of standard. And he has done so from day one at City. He’s a great player, world-class and one of the best the PL has seen and one of the best strikers of the last 25 years or so. I'm not reading all that, but I can probably summarise by disagreeing like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Only Shearer has scored more than Rooney like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Marcelo’s comments on Bale came up during a wider chat about his friendships at Real Madrid. "[i was also sad] with [the departure of] Kiko Casilla, who was sitting next to me. Every day I was saying, ‘How are you Kiko, how are you doing?’ and now I have no one next to me. On the other side I have Bale, but Bale does not speak as he only speaks English and we talk with gestures and I say, ‘Hi, hello and good wine.’" He's been there 6 years ffs *Disco klaxon* I'd probably do the same to get out of talking to Marcelo who I suspect would be a massive whopper. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Shearer and Henry are the only options at that level imo. No other players have the same combination of great goal scoring numbers, consistency, and non-goalscoring contribution. Aguero doesn't have the non-goalscoring contribution those 2 have and Rooney doesn't have the great goalscoring numbers they have. Rooney scored 208 goals in the premier league. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Only Shearer has scored more than Rooney like. In double the amount of seasons Henry (16 vs 8) had he managed an extra 33 goals over him. I know he didn't always play as a striker, but still. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Marcelo’s comments on Bale came up during a wider chat about his friendships at Real Madrid. "[i was also sad] with [the departure of] Kiko Casilla, who was sitting next to me. Every day I was saying, ‘How are you Kiko, how are you doing?’ and now I have no one next to me. On the other side I have Bale, but Bale does not speak as he only speaks English and we talk with gestures and I say, ‘Hi, hello and good wine.’" He's been there 6 years ffs *Disco klaxon* I'd probably do the same to get out of talking to Marcelo who I suspect would be a massive whopper. Bale’s Spanish is actually flawless Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Shearer and Henry are the only options at that level imo. No other players have the same combination of great goal scoring numbers, consistency, and non-goalscoring contribution. Aguero doesn't have the non-goalscoring contribution those 2 have and Rooney doesn't have the great goalscoring numbers they have. Rooney scored 208 goals in the premier league. In 16 seasons. Average of 13 goals a season vs Henry's 22 and Shearer's 20. I'm not saying Rooney isn't involved in any all-time PL debate, but in terms of strikers, those two are untouchable at the moment as far as I'm concerned. Again I know he didn't always play as a striker, but still. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Shearer and Henry are the only options at that level imo. No other players have the same combination of great goal scoring numbers, consistency, and non-goalscoring contribution. Aguero doesn't have the non-goalscoring contribution those 2 have and Rooney doesn't have the great goalscoring numbers they have. Rooney scored 208 goals in the premier league. In 16 seasons. Average of 13 goals a season vs Henry's 22 and Shearer's 20. I'm not saying Rooney isn't involved in any all-time PL debate, but in terms of strikers, those two are untouchable at the moment as far as I'm concerned. Again I know he didn't always play as a striker, but still. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Shearer and Henry are the only options at that level imo. No other players have the same combination of great goal scoring numbers, consistency, and non-goalscoring contribution. Aguero doesn't have the non-goalscoring contribution those 2 have and Rooney doesn't have the great goalscoring numbers they have. Rooney scored 208 goals in the premier league. In 16 seasons. Average of 13 goals a season vs Henry's 22 and Shearer's 20. I'm not saying Rooney isn't involved in any all-time PL debate, but in terms of strikers, those two are untouchable at the moment as far as I'm concerned. Again I know he didn't always play as a striker, but still. Aye well you've hit the nail on the head with your last point really. He was moved all over the place. Out wide in earlier years to accommodate Ronaldo. When Ronaldo left he played centre forward for 3 years and scored 64 in 94. Some use it as a black mark against him that he ended up in midfield etc. but he was just so good in other areas of his game that he was able to moved elsewhere to suit the team. If Rooney played centre forward for his entire premier league career he'd have shattered the goal record IMO. Only Kane has a proper shot at it for the foreseeable future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Shearer and Henry are the only options at that level imo. No other players have the same combination of great goal scoring numbers, consistency, and non-goalscoring contribution. Aguero doesn't have the non-goalscoring contribution those 2 have and Rooney doesn't have the great goalscoring numbers they have. Rooney scored 208 goals in the premier league. In 16 seasons. Average of 13 goals a season vs Henry's 22 and Shearer's 20. I'm not saying Rooney isn't involved in any all-time PL debate, but in terms of strikers, those two are untouchable at the moment as far as I'm concerned. Again I know he didn't always play as a striker, but still. Aye well you've hit the nail on the head with your last point really. He was moved all over the place. Out wide in earlier years to accommodate Ronaldo. When Ronaldo left he played centre forward for 3 years and scored 64 in 94. Some use it as a black mark against him that he ended up in midfield etc. but he was just so good in other areas of his game that he was able to moved elsewhere to suit the team. If Rooney played centre forward for his entire premier league career he'd have shattered the goal record IMO. Only Kane has a proper shot at it for the foreseeable future. Didn't he stop playing centre forward because he wasn't any good at it by that point of his career though? It's a bit of a stretch to claim that he'd continue scoring at the same rate as when he was in his prime. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marmoset Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 I know Rooney's not popular but he was at least as good a player as Aguero has been. Only if you're really talking pure goals a game numbers you can make a case for ol' Sergio and even then your not taking into account Rooney's games as an adolescent and a crumbling old man. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Shearer and Henry are the only options at that level imo. No other players have the same combination of great goal scoring numbers, consistency, and non-goalscoring contribution. Aguero doesn't have the non-goalscoring contribution those 2 have and Rooney doesn't have the great goalscoring numbers they have. Rooney scored 208 goals in the premier league. In 16 seasons. Average of 13 goals a season vs Henry's 22 and Shearer's 20. I'm not saying Rooney isn't involved in any all-time PL debate, but in terms of strikers, those two are untouchable at the moment as far as I'm concerned. Again I know he didn't always play as a striker, but still. Aye well you've hit the nail on the head with your last point really. He was moved all over the place. Out wide in earlier years to accommodate Ronaldo. When Ronaldo left he played centre forward for 3 years and scored 64 in 94. Some use it as a black mark against him that he ended up in midfield etc. but he was just so good in other areas of his game that he was able to moved elsewhere to suit the team. If Rooney played centre forward for his entire premier league career he'd have shattered the goal record IMO. Only Kane has a proper shot at it for the foreseeable future. Totally get what you're saying, but playing the same game Shearer had 137 in 169 over 4 years (0.8 GPG) and Henry had 130 in 171 over 5 years (0.76 GPG) - Rooney's 64 in 94 (0.68 GPG) over 3 years is still class, but if we're comparing to those two, his goalscoring peak wasn't for as long, or as frequent as them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 I don’t have a dog in this fight, but Aguero’s always had a tremendous supporting cast at City, while Rooney had to play with the likes of Ashley Young, Nani, Tony Valencia, Anderson, etc. for years. Aguero’s also been the undisputed #1 goal scorer since he arrived, even with Tevez, Dzeko, and Balotelli in the side. Rooney took a backseat to Ronaldo and Van Persie for sure, and arguably even Berbatov. I think that’s a testament to Rooney’s flexibility as a player. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
triggs Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 I didn't watch enough football when Rooney was in his prime to have a real opinion on this but think in general players who go through a major decline at the end of their careers get underrated and players who have a bit of a renaissance towards the end of their career get overrated Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Son up for racial. I assume the Father given the shared name/address up for general abuse. Patriot Dyche rumoured to be funding their legal bills. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanji Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 dock points Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinho lad Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Needless dig at Wor Nikos there, he looks like a SMB. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chicken little Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 I didn't watch enough football when Rooney was in his prime to have a real opinion on this but think in general players who go through a major decline at the end of their careers get underrated and players who have a bit of a renaissance towards the end of their career get overrated i'm wary of saying this because i think a lot of people characterized rooney as "in a decline" at far too young an age, but always think it should be taken into account that rooney had made 100 league appearances before he was 20, whilst kane (to pick an example off the top of my head) only became a spurs regular at 21. rooney had already played the equivalent of a very respectable career well before he turned 30. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
triggs Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 I didn't watch enough football when Rooney was in his prime to have a real opinion on this but think in general players who go through a major decline at the end of their careers get underrated and players who have a bit of a renaissance towards the end of their career get overrated i'm wary of saying this because i think a lot of people characterized rooney as "in a decline" at far too young an age, but always think it should be taken into account that rooney had made 100 league appearances before he was 20, whilst kane (to pick an example off the top of my head) only became a spurs regular at 21. rooney had already played the equivalent of a very respectable career well before he turned 30. Aye same with Fabregas and Owen really Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 My thing with Rooney is just pure selfishness really. The player he became at Man United was incredible and fully reaped the rewards of his talent, but I never enjoyed the Rooney with rounded edges as much as what his raw potential promised, I missed the street footballer style that he had at Everton and Euro 2004. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gottlob Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 In my opinion Aguero's acceleration and close control make him a better fit for this Manchester City side than Shearer or Henry would have been, and they're the only two I'd be inclined to put ahead of him when it comes to the Premier League's best ever strikers. The fact that Aguero can run from deep and scores plenty of headed goals, the intelligence and persistence of his movement, and the quality and inventiveness of his finishing all put him ahead of other poachers like Fowler, Owen, Wright, and Cole, who to be fair became much more rounded at Manchester United and in turn wasn't always the spearhead of their attack. I'd put Suarez up there with Shearer, Henry, and Aguero, obviously without the same longevity, with the likes of Kane, Drogba, Van Persie, Rooney, Torres, Cole, Van Nistelrooy in a category just below. I know that he was competing with Ronaldo, but I'm not sure it can be to Rooney's credit as a striker that he spent his most successful years at Manchester United playing as an auxiliary midfielder. Rightly or wrongly I consider Bergkamp, Zola, Beardsley, Cantona as a slightly different sort of player. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Away Day Gadgie Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Although Rooney had a great career i always thought that Ferguson ruined him a bit by playing him in so many different positions. He was a fantastic talent who could do a job almost anywhere but he should’ve been used a lot more as Number 10 or a striker. Imagine how many goals he would’ve got if he hadn’t spent so much time being used at left wing or centre midfield? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
samptime29 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Reading, Brentford, Millwall, Wigan, Rotherham and Ipswich have won a combined 5 away games this season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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