andycap Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 1 minute ago, Shearergol said: I hoped he’d do well as a wide forward but clearly not. But pretending he’s not class is just weird. For England Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Holloway said: Have you seen so called elite players being so anonymous in critical games? He's overrated I mean it’s your opinion so I can hardly dispute that Edited June 16 by Shearergol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Just now, andycap said: For England Hence why my first post was “he oozes class in the PL”. I’d play Gordon, I’m not even debating that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leffe186 Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 9 minutes ago, Yorkie said: The main problem for me in that second half was how sloppy we were in possession. That's under zero threat, too, just wayward passes under no pressure. Even down to lobbing it straight to the opposition from throw-ins. I don't know how much of that you can level at Southgate. I think there's a lot to improve on but I think you can afford the tactical performance a bit of grace; we're shoe-horning Trent in because there isn't an obvious partner for Rice (plus he's so talented), and it's similar with Foden - he has to play but the left is the only available place. Meanwhile, the balance is out of whack cos we've no fit LB. Essentially we're going into the tournament with an experimental side and, clearly, it needs time to settle. Despite this, we've beaten a capable and spirited side with pretty minimal fuss. I agree with the first part. The worst culprit was probably Foden. The bit you can level at Southgate is that I think his structure and tactics left fewer passing options going forward - most obviously with the absence of Gordon. We did make some terrible sloppy passes (the one that spring to mind was Foden playing it behind Gallagher). Not having the second part though. There’s not a standout partner for Rice but there are two or three players who can and do do that job week in and week out and none of them is Trent. He is being shoehorned in, and that’s bad. If Wharton or Gallagher played there we might question whether they’re the best choice but they would be playing their position, as Gallagher’s performance illustrated. As for “Foden has to play”…come on man. Greavsie “had to play”. Lampard, Gerrard and Scholes “had to play”. Bollocks. You find what works, whoever that is. I do agree that no orthodox LB messes with the balance though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andycap Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 1 minute ago, Shearergol said: Hence why my first post was “he oozes class in the PL”. I’d play Gordon, I’m not even debating that. I know that my reply was refering to England appearances not club form. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armchair Pundit Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Some players can play out of position, Foden isn't one of them and there are better options for the position he would like to play in. It was a waste of a shirt to play Foden imo, just another piss poor choice by Southgate, along with his inability to use tactics that play to the team's strengths. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 (edited) Just a reminder that Guehi was another Chelsea throw away. Just like Tomori was. I swear if they make Chalobah available we should pick him up based on that alone! Edited June 16 by KaKa Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemtizz Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Really looking forward to Southgate starting Gordon against Denmark's low block. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 1 minute ago, andycap said: I know that my reply was refering to England appearances not club form. I don’t disagree. If people don’t perform for England they should be dropped. Back on the manager again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
McDog Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 (edited) Just finished watching the games played today, recorded them. England was a bit shaky in the second half but a good three points. I saw the England thread was locked. Oh man. I love England myself and Great Britain at large too. Hope you lads do well the rest of the tournament. Edited June 16 by McDog Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pata Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 4 minutes ago, andycap said: Yeah basically the system pep plays makes foden look world class. Stick him in a Brentford type of style he'd be good still but not as effective. Obviously every player would look better at Man City. Doesn't mean Foden isn't extremely talented and clearly world class. The team should be built around him and Bellingham. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Didn’t like the CM balance from the start. Rice was deeper than TAA. Trent’s not a CM, if he is to play at CM he should play simple, central and deep not marauding around like a headless chicken. Gallagher and Rice doesn’t work because neither are good at passing it through the lines to build attacks. Foden should play 10 or sit on the bench. Great option for Bellingham or Saka. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattoon Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 That was a tough watch, so obvious that Southgate just wanted to play safe after scoring, Foden was anonymous again, thought Saka was useful and Bellingham probably motm. But the city players were shocking. Such a frustrating team to support, keep turning the screw at 1-0 and we win that 2 or 3-0 but no, we could possibly play with any risk whatsoever. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andycap Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 1 minute ago, Pata said: Obviously every player would look better at Man City. Doesn't mean Foden isn't extremely talented and clearly world class. The team should be built around him and Bellingham. I mean the system suits his game he's been brought through playing that system. Then when he's in England colours he looks lost. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaqen Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 12 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said: Is it fair to say that trying to make Trent work right now is similar to what it would have been like trying to make a young Beckham work if the dominant formation in the 90s was 433 based? Beckham was at least a midfielder. I think there's just a massive difference between moving defenders higher up the pitch in terms of positioning and how they receive the ball from when you are used to playing to a defensive line and seeing the whole game Infront of you and generally receiving the ball facing the opponents. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Foden is one of the most naturally talented players I've seen pull on and England shirt, but he is accustomed to playing a certain style of football from the middle of the park. He was poor tonight, but he's wasted on the left. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Duper Branko Strupar Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Not getting Foden at his best is quite clearly Southgates failure and not his. Him on the left and TAA in CM is shocking, let's get honest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 8 minutes ago, leffe186 said: I agree with the first part. The worst culprit was probably Foden. The bit you can level at Southgate is that I think his structure and tactics left fewer passing options going forward - most obviously with the absence of Gordon. We did make some terrible sloppy passes (the one that spring to mind was Foden playing it behind Gallagher). Not having the second part though. There’s not a standout partner for Rice but there are two or three players who can and do do that job week in and week out and none of them is Trent. He is being shoehorned in, and that’s bad. If Wharton or Gallagher played there we might question whether they’re the best choice but they would be playing their position, as Gallagher’s performance illustrated. As for “Foden has to play”…come on man. Greavsie “had to play”. Lampard, Gerrard and Scholes “had to play”. Bollocks. You find what works, whoever that is. I do agree that no orthodox LB messes with the balance though. Fair enough regarding the CM position, but if Gallagher or Mainoo are in there then it only emphasises the lunacy (imo) that is calling us the favourites. Not only due to how dysfunctional (Trent)/unimpressive (others) the CM is - but we don't have a left-back either. Southgate can't leave Foden out, absolutely no way, he'd by lynched. After that insipid individual performance I'd be trebucheting the lad back to Manchester personally, but there's absolutely no way the England manager would be allowed to leave the Prem's player of the season out. Nor should he; he has to to do everything he can to find a way to make that work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pata Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 1 minute ago, Jaqen said: Beckham was at least a midfielder. I think there's just a massive difference between moving defenders higher up the pitch in terms of positioning and how they receive the ball from when you are used to playing to a defensive line and seeing the whole game Infront of you and generally receiving the ball facing the opponents. Beckham would be so interesting in a modern game. Him cutting in from the left would be deadly but I'm not sure if he had the physical traits or dribbling to play that position. Possibly a tidy CM with amazing passing range and a threat from set-penises? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattoon Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Foden is backup to Bellingham at 10 for me, Gordon starts at LW and I'd probably go Trent at RB, I'd also Start Wharton in CM next to Rice, we're lacking severe chemistry at the moment and the City lads have all been poor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
McDog Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 3 minutes ago, Mattoon said: That was a tough watch, so obvious that Southgate just wanted to play safe after scoring, Foden was anonymous again, thought Saka was useful and Bellingham probably motm. But the city players were shocking. Such a frustrating team to support, keep turning the screw at 1-0 and we win that 2 or 3-0 but no, we could possibly play with any risk whatsoever. I thought Stones was ok. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pata Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 (edited) 32 minutes ago, Yorkie said: Fair enough regarding the CM position, but if Gallagher or Mainoo are in there then it only emphasises the lunacy (imo) that is calling us the favourites. Not only due to how dysfunctional (Trent)/unimpressive (others) the CM is - but we don't have a left-back either. Southgate can't leave Foden out, absolutely no way, he'd by lynched. After that insipid individual performance I'd be trebucheting the lad back to Manchester personally, but there's absolutely no way the England manager would be allowed to leave the Prem's player of the season out. Nor should he; he has to to do everything he can to find a way to make that work. Play him in his natural position then. It feels harsh at some players but he has to play either at right or at 10 even if that means dropping Saka to the bench or Jude next to Rice. Trying to fit in all England's best players to the lineup in any way possible has never really worked for England. Edited June 16 by Pata Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Reckon Mainoo is a better option than TAA next to Rice. Should be Bellingham though, with Foden at number ten and Gordon or Eze on the left Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Duper Branko Strupar Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Rice 6, Bellingham 8, Foden 10. It's so obvious it's painful. And Kane must not drop deep and take Fodens space and leave CF empty. All it takes is a disciplined, ambitious manager. Why he's so adamant to shoehorn TAA in is beyond me. If he's not good enough to start RB he doesn't start, simple. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 (edited) Bellingham is a better 10 than Foden for England if Kane is going to do that drop deep stuff. Bellingham runs in behind more and is a bigger threat late in the box. Personally I think a tournament is too late to start trying to build a team around Foden. Do what works well and have Foden off the bench. Fodens never stood out for England. Professionally he’s only flourished under Pep. Southgate should’ve picked a LW who has done well for England before. Sterling or Rashford. I don’t trust that he trusts Gordon enough. Edited June 16 by The College Dropout Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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