KaKa Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Carlisle United 1, Newcastle United 1Jul 23 2007 by Stuart Rayner, The Journal THERE was little doubt for those who got their first glimpse of Sam Allardyce’s Newcastle United at the weekend that this was the start of something new but they will be hoping a 1-1 draw at League One opposition is not a sign of things to come. Anyone who reads anything into pre-season results is on a slippery slope. But change brings suspicion and poor results to start the manager’s rein – even in pre-season – could erode the goodwill which greeted his appointment. It took Nolberto Solano’s stunning strike 36 seconds into injury-time to salvage a draw on Saturday. But more significant was the wastefulness which made it an equaliser rather than the icing on the cake. Having played 4-4-2 at Hartlepool United in midweek, Newcastle reverted to the shape Allardyce perfected at Bolton Wanderers. Solano was a deep-lying playmaker with Joey Barton and Nicky Butt on either side to do the legwork. Story continues ADVERTISEMENT The forward line had Obafemi Martins largely on the right, Andy Carroll in the centre and Kieron Dyer, who a month ago was being considered as an England right-back, on its left. The emphasis was on full-backs Stephen Carr and Charles N’Zogbia to attack, as both are happy to, but the shape allowed the widemen in Carlisle’s 4-4-2 plenty of space. Kieran Westwood kicked the ball into the hole left by one Carr foray and although Jeff Smith brought it down well, Kevin Gall chipped wide. Premiership opponents might not be so forgiving. While Newcastle’s shape followed the Bolton stereotype, their football did not, stroking the ball around in a way the Trotters’ critics claim they never did. Allardyce was probably weighing up his tactical options, as with his choice of captain. Without Shay Given, Barton donned the armband. He will definitely not wear it against Celtic on Thursday, having fractured a metatarsal midway through the second half. “It’s the hardest pre-season I’ve had at Newcastle, everything looks very professional,” Solano said of Allardyce’s methods. “In terms of the tactics the new manager wants us to play it is very important we move forward. There are no secrets anymore so Sam’s ideas might give us an advantage. “The new system is not ready to play all the time and we don’t know if that’s what we’ll use at the start of the season.” The Peruvian recognises an opportunity to extend his career. “We have our own personal masseur and we’re wearing heart monitors,” he said. “But the football is the most important thing. “Wearing the heart monitors is bad news for us because they show just how hard you’ve been working. The manager can see who’s been cheating. I feel fitter at this stage than at any time in my career. “I’m only 32 and what Sam is doing could help me go on in the Premiership even longer but because the talent and quality is getting better all the time, I’m just looking to the season. “I like being able to direct the play and having time to pick out passes. But playing in that position against the likes of Chelsea will be tougher.” Carlisle’s spirit and Newcastle’s finishing masked the fact the latter had the majority of the chances, thanks largely to their superior pace. Too many shots were dragged off target from promising positions and Danny Graham should have punished them when, in the 50th minute, he pounced onto David Rozehnal’s poor touch but blazed wide. When Butt pulled Smith back six minutes later, however, Marc Bridge-Wilkinson delivered an excellent free-kick which Danny Livesey, whose aerial ability was crucial at both ends, headed home. As the game progressed and substitutes flooded on, Newcastle increasingly dominated, Geremi coming closest with a free-kick. Carroll’s height caused problems throughout and just after the board indicated three added minutes he nodded Tim Krul’s kick to Solano for his blast into the top corner. http://icnewcastle.icnetwork.co.uk/newcastleunited/journalsport/tm_headline=carlisle-united-1-newcastle-united-1%26method=full%26objectid=19499461%26siteid=50081-name_page.html Interesting stuff. Doesn't look like Nobby will be used as a right back or right winger this season. Looks like he will be more likely to provide depth for us in the centre. Also, I think it is very likely we will be seeing a front three of Owen, Viduka and Martins this season, in a 4-3-3 that actually features three out and out strikers. Hence the fullbacks (Carr and N'Zogbia on Saturday) being encouraged to attack so as to provide the width for the team, as opposed to the two wide strikers playing out wide. Could be exciting. However we will need to upgrade the full back positions for this to really work. We will need two quality full backs who can really get up and down the pitch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Souness tried that too... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShearMagic Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 He'd go well centrally IMO. He's a very creative player, great ball usage and good skills. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Moe-Ali Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 this is fucking bullshit, if we're soo rich now, why do we have players playing out of position!? and why havent we spent more than 8million pounds? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 this is fucking bullshit, if we're soo rich now, why do we have players playing out of position!? Because the manager was using a friendly match to experiment with a different formation. Calm down. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 this is f****** bullshit, if we're soo rich now, why do we have players playing out of position!? Because the manager was using a friendly match to experiment with a different formation. Calm down. Goodness grief Moe-Ali calm down indeed. I doubt he will be in the first team in that position. Just how he will be used when he is brought off the bench which he should be this season as he is getting on a bit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloydie Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 It is interesting. The big bit “The new system is not ready to play all the time and we don’t know if that’s what we’ll use at the start of the season.” Suggests that we could start some games 4-4-2 till Allardyce is happy people know what they're doing / he's got the right personnel in and fit. Personally I think he'll be looking for Emre or a new signing to do the job in the middle with Solano the backup, but if Nobby is fit and up to the physical challenge of playing in the centre then I'm happy to see him given a chance. Still wondering where this system is going to leave players like Milner and N'Zogbia. For away games I can see them playing wide in a 4-5-1, but if the big three strikers are starting up front there's nowhere for them to go. I suppose Milner could play in the centre three, but it's not where his talents lie. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Sounds shit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Surely we can't play that formation with Carr and Babayaro as fullbacks? They'll be exposed and torn to shreds by premier league players... even more so than they are in 442. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
junkhead Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Sam better know what he's doing.. i think he underestimates how shit our full backs are.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Sounds s***. Well as long as it doesn't actually look shit then there won't be a problem. Patience. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 The players we have now simply do not have the ability to play in two different formations, they struggle coping with one. I'm all for trying new things but this is just going to add fuel to the fire that were a Bolton MkII or that we've no money to spend and are having to make do with the utter shite we've got. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Sam mentioned that Zog is the best left back the club has at the minute Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danswan Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 this is fucking bullshit, if we're soo rich now, why do we have players playing out of position!? and why havent we spent more than 8million pounds? Actually I'm delighted we are trying new things. We need an alternative to 4-4-2, ideally we would have a few systems we could switch between quickly and efficiently. I think Souness had the right ideas, just no ability or clue as to how to drill it into a squad of players. I don't think switching Nobby inside is emergency playing people out of position, more using his talents where they can influence play more. Of course equally, it could be fucking bullshit and we are skint Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCW1983 Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Nice to see we are trying to move forward, im pretty sure Souness tried the same tactic using Dyer and Luque cutting in from the right and left...maybe's thats the way to get Luque to perform although im not suggesting playing a formation simply to accomodate Luque. Mind if i had to put my mortgage on one of our players picking out a pass Solano would be the man of choise. I went to Carlisle and it was quite refreshing to see us trying different things although im not so keen on Martins playing on the left but Barton was a monster in the centre untill he got hurt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Solano is probaly being considered as a utility player - he can play anywhere down the right centre, he's got teh skill and the abilty to read teh game even if he's slwoing down i can see Sam keeping him in the first team squad for quite a while even when he has bought for all the positions that need a decent player ( 7 or 8) then a coaching role probably - he's hard working, a credit to the club and very popular inside and outside SJP - teh ort of bloke Sam needs Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShearMagic Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Yes, lets go out and buy Deco hey. While we're at it, I'm sure Kaka and Ronaldinho will come too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 this is f****** bullshit, if we're soo rich now, why do we have players playing out of position!? and why havent we spent more than 8million pounds? Down shep. Most teams that come to SJP tend to sit deep, so it makes sense having someone like Nobby sitting in midfield making passes and keeping things ticking over. Nobby is a cracking player, his distribution is up there with the best in the Premiership. FACT. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robster Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 I couldnt really say off the top of my head but wouldnt Geremi be out Right Wing-Back instead of Carr meaning that we only need to sort out the Left Back spot ? I cant remember if he has played that role for Boro/Chelsea or if he was more as an out and out Full Back / Centre Half Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Logic Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Geremi as a RWB is better than Geremi as a FB for sure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newcastle Fan Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Souness tried that too... What Souness had in mind was actually a good thing, he wanted our strike force to be this: Owen Luque Shearer But he was never able to keep all three fit at the same time, so he kept playing 4-4-2 untill he got sacked I think it will be - if used correctly- a good style of play for our team, the classic 4-4-2 dosn't always work espically when facing the likes of Man Utd and Chelsea. As for Nobby, i am actually happy to see him play in the center, always thought he have the technique and mentalty to play in the center of the field rather than on the wing, he's getting older and losing his pace (wich he had little of to start with), so using him in a more center will be the smart thing to do imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Did he balls. He didn't have a fucking clue. He was panicking because he knew he needed a left-winger and a striker with days left of the transfer window. He missed out on Boa Morte and Anelka so bought two for the price of one when he got Luque. He probably knew very little about the guy as an actual player. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Did he balls. He didn't have a fucking clue. He was panicking because he knew he needed a left-winger and a striker with days left of the transfer window. He missed out on Boa Morte and Anelka so bought two for the price of one when he got Luque. He probably knew very little about the guy as an actual player. Have to agree with this. He did have an initial plan with Boa Morte and Anelka, seemingly, but that soon went up the spout with the arrival of Owen/Luque. Shepherd to blame? CAN OF WORMS!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shak Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 No surprise that Nobby will play more centrally this season, he's not direct enough at all to play out wide in Allardyce's system in my opinion. Think he'll probably compete with Emre for this deep lying playmaker role, should be a decent battle. Much depends on what system we end up playing though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 Am I alone in still wishing for a big powerhouse to play in this "deep lying role" behind Barton/Emre/Both? We still seem desperately lightweight in every area of the park to me, both in terms of numbers and physically as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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